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(Myke) -
2008-12-23 01:35
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#203136 - 2008-04-17 02:26
Frames make my head hurt
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Hath995
New Challenger
Registered: 2008-04-17
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Hey,
I'm new to VF completely, I've played a few fighter games before like mortal kombat, ergheiz, smash brothers, etc. I never really tried to get good at them. I just played them for fun. I can see now that VF has waayyy.. more depth than those games and it would be cool to get good at.
I picked up VF 5 for the ps3 just the other day and I like it so far but I've definitely run into a wall playing against the quest mode 2nd and 3rd Dans (some chars I can beat easier than others).
I found this site and the super detailed wiki but its so overwhelming. How in the world do you people count frames? It looks like so much strategy is based on knowing tons of frame data. Do I really have to memorize all of that to beat the single player? When I say that I mean fight 10th dan and win a reasonable percentage of the time (is this a realistic expectation? How hard is 10th dan?)
I pretty much started playing with Jacky since he uses a style I've studied irl so his moves are amusingly familiar. I can pull off most of his moves, some of the more complicated ones I can't (Edit: lol I meant in game).
I can see clearly that right now I really lack in blocking. Recently, when fighting Lei-fei and Vanessa they block everything, I block nothing and they do WTF throws and combos that destroy my health bar. What can I do here?
Edited by Hath995 (2008-04-17 06:01)
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#203247 - 2008-04-17 16:11
Re: Frames make my head hurt
[Re: Hath995]
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Hath995
New Challenger
Registered: 2008-04-17
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Thanks for the responses,
Yeah, I've only had casual experience with fighting games. Though usually I was at least able to beat the single player on the hard difficulties but not with this game.
While I've never encountered the concept of frames before I do think I get the gist of it. In the past after playing the games enough I just got a sense of how fast moves were and when I could safely attack. From what I've read and what you say frames are the same idea but in a far more concrete sense than I've ever dealt with.
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#203263 - 2008-04-17 18:31
Re: Frames make my head hurt
[Re: Hath995]
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Sorias
Addict
Registered: 2007-11-02
Loc: Seattle
XBL GT: Sorias
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Yeah, frame data is really just precisely expressing how much faster/slower a move is.
For example, if your low punch hits your opponent, your opponent is then at -4 frames of disadvantage. An elbow takes 14 frames to execute, and in general the fastest attacks in the game are 10-frame punches. So you have 14-4 frames = 10. And they also have 10 frames for their punch... but elbows do more damage, so in this case, the elbow will counter hit the punch.
Now, if you ignore all that math, I could have just said "If your low punch strikes your opponent, and you immediately perform an elbow, then your opponent will always get hit unless they block/evade, or use a sabaki/reversal. There is no normal attack that they can use that will beat your elbow in that situation."
Frames are just an easy way of looking up that data very precisely, without having to actively test it in game, however it's the exact same information. You don't ever need to memorize the frame numbers to learn how to play.
_________________________
If you give a man a fire, he's warm for a day. If you set a man on fire, he's warm for the rest of his life.
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#203930 - 2008-04-21 09:30
Re: Frames make my head hurt
[Re: Sorias]
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Jaytech
Enthusiast
Registered: 2007-03-15
Loc: Germany
XBL GT: PSN ID: Jaytech3
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imo the most important part is knowing which moves are safe on block and which can be punished easily. you don't need to remember the frames of every single move during a match.
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#206643 - 2008-05-12 16:00
Re: Frames make my head hurt
[Re: Jaytech]
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RawEmpire
Journeyman
Registered: 2008-04-22
Loc: Newport News, VA but I'm Origi...
XBL GT: ANT LIVE 5000
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(lying to every1 in the room) I made a 62 frame attack look like a 5 frame jab
_________________________
"I spit flames, so burn up in the heat, my ryms will neva deplete cause I rap to the heart beat of the streets, everything I say is pothole deep, to make manholes leak what Hip-Hop speaks"~RawEmpire http://card.mygamercard.net/aero/Ant+Live+5000.png
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#206754 - 2008-05-13 08:14
Re: Frames make my head hurt
[Re: RawEmpire]
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TheWorstPlayer
Old Hand
Registered: 2007-11-29
XBL GT: | WorstPlayer |
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I think you should bust out a calculator and start solving the equations. If you're going to be hardcore go ALL the way seriously.
Check it, 2P(NH)=+4F:6P > Opponent Attack </= Reversal/Sabaki/Inashi/Block/Fried Bologna
See its the easiest way to learn!
You even get to learn Japanese!
Edited by TheWorstPlayer (2008-05-13 08:15)
_________________________
Online Rank: 1ST KYUONLINE WEEKLY TOURNAMENT!
SHOUTBOX SHAKEDOWN! SUN. 8PM EST! It's On BITCHES!
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#206796 - 2008-05-13 13:31
Re: Frames make my head hurt
[Re: TheWorstPlayer]
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Slide
Addict
Registered: 2007-03-18
XBL GT: ACTION KUNGFU
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Just know when you're at a small, medium, or large advantage/disadvantage. Learn what to do offensively on advantage, and defensively on disadvantage(sometimes that can switch on you. like reversals and sabaki's). And know what moves you and your opponent can punish for free, or make them deal with, when you act right away. After that the game does a good job of being somewhat intuitive, and when you see things similar you can usually make a pretty good guess as to the choices you can make, just based on how a move and a situation works.
And advantage you want to be on the offensive to make use of your advantage. And on disadvantage, acting defensively is a good choice because you could make the situation worsen otherwise.
Edited by Slide (2008-05-13 13:36)
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