Am I a DMPK whore?

I only use Sarah and I don't use her DM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif much (Sarah's frankly sux.) But I use DM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif more than I'd like to admit... almost exclusively against scrubly Leis and Eileens.

GodEater once told me to stop always using DM from disadvantage... it's kind of my state of mind lately... instead of blocking the attack I expect from my opponent I'm always looking to make them whiff, either by evading or hopping low attacks (which can be extremely stupid when you guess wrong.) I don't fuzzy guard much, if at all.

Do you hold the same disdain for someone that uses DM -> launcher that you would for an ordinary abuser of DMPK?

 

I played a Sarah today that DM and then /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif about 95% of the time at any disadvantage. It didn't matter if it was small or large he would just evade and go for the launch every time. Anyway, while this can be a strong technique against beginners or intermediates, it's REALLY, REALLY easy to beat for someone with experience. All I had to do was just hit him with 1 or 2 moves and then anticipate the incoming DM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif and use a delayed launcher or combo starter for BIG damage. Maybe the disdain GE was referring to was that the matches can sometimes go the route of being dull especially if you can predict what's coming. In my experience players you can't condition to do something else other than what they have programmed into their hands and brain can be highly annoying to play against. Most of the time their game tends to be based on a single or series of patterns that they run through over and over and over until they grab a K.O. and not something they are creating to match the situation.

Hope no one finds this post offensive. I'm just giving my opinion.

 

Well, at least you can TE.

 

Heh, GodEater has complained about getting bored fighting me too... enlightening. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/blush.gif

I agree with you completely, Konjou. The whole point of playing this game and enjoying the experience is to condition your opponent to react in some fashion and then take advantage of that. Mind games. If they are fighting like robots, then what's the point? This is why I end up hating fighting the AI... there's no reward for trying to set something up in the future by what you are doing now.

Anyways, so DM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is Sarah's version of DMPK scrub.

 

With Sarah evading into dragon is less effective than DM P+K would be, atleast imo. But one is more rewarding than the other, obviously.

Konjou, who was the Sarah? I haven't played many other Sarahs, but Yupa is the only one I know that evades to dragon cannons.

 

DM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif has better range and it's full circular, but the damage potential of a dragon cannon float is so alluring. If they are blocked, they're basically the same. -14 vs. -15. Dragon Cannon is more riskier because it's a straight attack with relatively short range.

Cripes, I just looked it up, Sarah's DMPK is only +5 on counterhit. Nothing is guaranteed afterward. Sux for a move that's throw counterable if blocked.

I started down this path because another Sarah player used it on me... I just know how much I hate facing a Wolf that always goes to DMPK... I don't want to be that Sarah player.

 

Evade Dragon Cannon

It's NOT less effective. The /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif crouchdash motion cancels the evade animation, failed or otherwise. This means evade dragon cannon will the move will come out faster than dm p+k. It also means it will beat slower half/fullcirculars & delayed attacks/throws.

Typical example: normally after a punch or low punch, moves with small total frames, evade p+k is blockable. Evade dragon cannon floats. I don't think it's a coincidence they changed the input for sarah's dragon cannon (and jacky's high angle btw) in VF5R. Evade /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif will net you jack (knife LOL pun). Going for evade > crouchdash cancel > launcher is going to require some more compicated inputs imho.

The same is true for evade > yoho btw (thank god the akira's i've stumbled across in xbox live don't seem to have caught up with that yet) but hey, it's poster boy, let him have the crouchdash launcher.

You and Kamnari_Oyaji must be the only ones who don't do that. I don't know if there's such a thing as playing TOO morally but Evade Dragon Cannon is great, use while stocks last /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

 

Re: Evade Dragon Cannon

Evade Dragon cannon eh ? It was for more effective in EVO..

Both options are still very unsafe. As both on block is free damage pretty much.

If you're getting hit by potentially evade > attacks then you need to employ delaying your moves more often.


God I miss that game....(Right Myke?) /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cool.gif

 

I consider evade-> Dragon cannon as unsafer than DM P+K. The former is not guaranteed on all evades. If opponent does like P~G and you do evade dragon cannon, your DC is getting blocked and you eat guaranteed damage. DM P+K is on several characters better option than given credit to. Personally, Id go as far as recommending AGAINST using DC after evade. Try serpent cannon cause its slightly faster and hit-checkable. Both DM P+K and DM -> DC arent safe options. But latter is less safe in my books.

This is one of those things that seems better in theory than it is in practise.

 

Re: Evade Dragon Cannon

No it certainly does not. Point is, on successful evade you cant cancel anything. On unsuccesful evade you can be interrupted by anything.

ps. Evade -> yoho with Akira is like one of the stupidest things you can possibly do. Yoho's needlepoint hitbox ensures that you wont hit anything after even succesful evade of a slow move.

 

Re: Evade Dragon Cannon

I confirm about evade Yoho haha.

 

Re: Evade Dragon Cannon

I'm not ragging on the choice or anything. Not that match videos really mean anything but I don't see any upper Sarah's using evade dragon in their choices anyway. I see alot of PKs, P4Ks, from all Sarahs gameplans(which is smart imo cause PK/P4K she gotta live of this). I saw evade dragons in 4evo's.

Maybe it's something I should try at random sometimes? On average when I evade stuff all I get is throws or PKs guaranteed though.

 

Re: Evade Dragon Cannon

I notice quite a lot of players online that evade every time they are at disadvantage, even if it's a small disadvantage. I don't think it should bother anyone but it is kinda sad when you pwn them for it 20 matches in a row and they still spamming on it.

 

Re: Evade Dragon Cannon

Yo Yupa,

I also see Mista Tee gettin down with evade 33k. I'd simply second what everyone else said about dont' let it become predictable. But i'd also say that from playing sarah that its also rather effective. Just don't be "that sarah" that does evade 33k on every rising. lol, i don't think that was you, but i played a few sarah's recently who did that. Very easy to stuff.

I'd definitely tell you to keep it in your bag of tricks, but don't make it your main trick. Sometimes just holding guard when at disadvantage is a good thing (unless you are using lei fei, then mash and be as abare as possible because its easier than learnting to play defense and i suck).

 

Re: Evade Dragon Cannon

yupa caught me alot last monday using evading dragon cannon. i notice i got hit mostly when i went into one of lei 's stances using k for example . I tried to adapt by attacking the evading dragon cannon with sweeps,9p+k/3p+k using lei, or just guard and punish. i should try this once in a while using lei evade9k+g

 

Methylidene

 

I think that's the line between intermediate and good players. Actually Methyldene something beats me more often than I beat him but he did that /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif on evade very often. I did not punished him every time and got caught by the canon usually haha.

Not playing with patterns and create an original flow each time to adapt is the goal to attain, ofc, but it requires a lot of mastery of the game system and a very good knowledge of your character. With my 4 months experience my Akira is a bit predictable and I guess I rely on some patterns, but Akira is not a surprising or deceptive char so it's a bit hard to be creative /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/whistle.gif

 

Thanks for the input.

DM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is a better option. It's faster and safer and does almost as much dmg with combos.

I've been mulling over DM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif to get into flamingo stance. The switch kick is 17 frames, same as /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif. I'd still be a DMPK whore but with variety... /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

 

A good pressure option after evasion would be /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif which offers humongous advantage when hitting from the side (I think /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif followup may be guaranteed). It has a problem of hitting high though, so obviously you cant punish lowrecovering moves with it.

Can you see on reflex what kind of move you evaded when you got a succesful evade? Theres very little time. If you can, you could go for suitable attack. But if you cant, a /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif or /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif that the japanese seem to use is a no-brainer 'safe' option. Id recommend /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif over those though.

Yupa: at least switch kick is +4 on block compared to dragon cannon.. Plus switch kick may cause side stagger and a followup FL /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is very hard to avoid. Use it now as long as we dont have R's sideguard! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif This kind of sums up my playing style with Sarah, all mixup pressure, very few 'random launchers'.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Sometimes just holding guard when at disadvantage is a good thing </div></div>
This is like the most profound advice in the thread right here. I discussed this with Adam when I was in WCG. Sometimes its best to resist the urge of doing something like ETEG (or DM P+K for 'those' players) and instead just stand there and block. I used to make myself far too predictable with the 'advanced defense techniques' for years. If opponent knows you are doing them, youre being predictable right there. This is something that becomes an issue when you are playing very good players. Theres also the issue that under pressure you might screw up something in the inputs or timing, while its kinda hard to mis-input /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif. Pressing G for a split second and watching what the opponent does is... not appreciated enough /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif Plus, developing the ability to block and evade on reflex is very strong.