Escape - Crouch Dash defensive technique

Discussion in 'Junky's Jungle' started by Myke, May 11, 2002.

  1. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

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    Here's a new defensive technique, courtesy of the latest Arcadia magazine.

    It's the Escape - Crouch Dash (ECD), and really comes into effect when you're at around 3 to 4 frames disadvantage. This works because Escapes, both normal and fast types, can be cancelled with a CD. So far, this is nothing new to most of you, but to show the utility of this technique, I'll share an example they used in the magazine.

    Firstly, at 3 to 4 frames disadvantage, all elbows (and similar fast mids) will beat your d+P or standing P. Akira's Low Back Fist (df+P+K), on normal hit, will put you at 3 frames disadvantage. Akira can now force a pretty good two-choice guessing game on you -- his Double Plam (D,b,f+P) will beat your fastest attacks (d+P or P), and his Throw will get you if you try to Escape. At this point, you could try to ETEG, but you still have to guess which throw(s) to escape. However, if you ECD, you can avoid both the Double Palm and any throw attempts.

    The difficulty lies entering a ECD in what is essentially a 5 frame window. Remember, you're already 3 frames behind, and Akira just needs another 5 frames to throw you. But, rest assured, it is definitely possible.

    You can use Free Training to practice this technique. Select Akira as the opponent, then record df+P+K - b,f+P (which is a Double Palm because you're crouching) as Action 1. Then record df+P+K - P+G (or any throw, doesn't matter) as Action 2. Setup playback with Action 1 and 2 at 50% each. Let Akira hit you with the df+P+K, and then enter a fast and clean ECD. If Akira DbPm's, you should get the successful (fast) Escape. If he tries to Throw you, you should get a normal (slow) Escape cancelled with a CD going under the throw whiff.

    If you switch Motion Display to on (so you can see the exe-co-rec bars) you should be able to visually notice the recovery (orange bar) of the normal Escape get cancelled with the CD. Just practice that for a while against an idle CPU just to get a feel for cancelling normal Escapes with CDs. Once you get the hang of it, try it against the CPU in the above Playback sequence.

    Just like all defensive techniques, there are vulnerabilities associated with ECD too. It won't work against circular attacks or if the attack is delayed.
     
  2. Llanfair

    Llanfair Well-Known Member

    A very good technique indeed. I focused a lot on ECD when I switched to playing Pai more. I wanted to have a fast and seamless E into her FC throw (*f+P+G) and I also wanted a seamless E into her heelkick. Both tactics are very powerful and the ECD part of each is wonderful for the defensive reasons described by Myke. /versus/images/icons/smile.gif

    Followup question however - perhaps I've never noticed but do you get a "MC dodge" when the opponent attempts a throw? What's weird about the Akira example is that the throw is being avoided by the CD, which means that the dodge (and I'm assuming a MC dodge) happens after the df+P+K hits but before the throw. That produces a MC dodge? Hmm...cool.

    cheers,
     
  3. vf4akira

    vf4akira Well-Known Member

    Myke, where are you getting the Arcadia mags from?

    As for ECD, I've seen someone doing this in one of the Daioh videos. Very interesting technique. I'll have to practice more. /versus/images/icons/smile.gif
     
  4. kil

    kil Well-Known Member

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    whats tha command/notation 4 tha ECD?
     
  5. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

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    Followup question however - perhaps I've never noticed but do you get a "MC dodge" when the opponent attempts a throw?

    No you don't, it's just a normal (slow) Escape, which can still be cancelled with a CD.

    What's weird about the Akira example is that the throw is being avoided by the CD, which means that the dodge (and I'm assuming a MC dodge) happens after the df+P+K hits but before the throw. That produces a MC dodge? Hmm...cool.

    I see what you're saying, but the answer is still no /versus/images/icons/smile.gif The assumption that the MC Dodge (fast Escape) is happening after the hit is incorrect.

    The key behind all this working is the fact that a normal (slow) Escape can be cancelled with a CD, and if done fast enough can foil any throw attempt even when you're at a 3 ~ 4 frame disadvantage.
     
  6. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

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    Myke, where are you getting the Arcadia mags from?

    My friend gets them from a local Japanese book store.
     
  7. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

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    whats tha command/notation 4 tha ECD?

    It's exactly as the name suggests, Escape - Crouch Dash (ECD).

    Escape (E) = u or d
    Crouch Dash (CD) = df, df

    ECD = u (or d), df, df

    Something worth noting is that you can only cancel a normal Escape with a forward CD, i.e. backward CDs won't work.
     
  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    So is it evade, then CD,CD?
     
  9. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

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    So is it evade, then CD,CD?

    No. Just Evade, then Crouch Dash (CD).
     
  10. CreeD

    CreeD Well-Known Member

    can you do evade first, then crouch dash?
    or does it have to be evade - crouch dash?
    also, does backwards crouch dash work?
    does it work if you don't evade, i.e. just crouch dash?
     
  11. Mike90210

    Mike90210 Well-Known Member

    "does it work if you don't evade, i.e. just crouch dash?"
    If you didnt evade first you would eat the double palm.
     
  12. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

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    can you do evade first, then crouch dash?
    or does it have to be evade - crouch dash?


    If you're asking whether or not you must cancel the Evade with a CD, the answer is yes, you must cancel. If you wait for a normal Evade to finish before you CD, you'll be thrown.

    also, does backwards crouch dash work?

    Nope. Like I said, you cannot cancel a normal Evade with a backward CD.

    does it work if you don't evade, i.e. just crouch dash?

    Mike92123 already answered this.


    Remember, just like TEG and ETEG, the ECD is an option-select defensive technique which protects you from two choices - a fast mid attack or throw.
     
  13. CreeD

    CreeD Well-Known Member

    so it's evade, then crouch dash .. what happens if you crouch dash first? nothing? Or how about crouch dash, dodge? Also is it the big dodge or the little one?
     
  14. feixaq

    feixaq Well-Known Member

    You have to Evade ~ CD. If you try to CD ~ Evade you get hit by Akira's DbPm. Also, it's the small Evade (i.e. ARM), not the MC Evade, but this can be cancelled into the CD.

    Note that while it's fairly easy to cancel an E into a CD... it's a heckuva lot harder to do ECD (u,df,df) all within 5 frames.
     
  15. BK__

    BK__ Well-Known Member

    this is great! just what i've been looking for... can the CD be lead into anythin else?
     
  16. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

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    this is great! just what i've been looking for... can the CD be lead into anythin else?

    CDs can be cancelled with anything.
     
  17. ReCharredSigh

    ReCharredSigh Well-Known Member

    that's tite, Myke, awesome tidbit...we've all heard of E-->CD as a semi-Korean Step working especially well to punish whiffed moves with FC moves(ie Akira), but to see it being used as option select when you're running at a disadvantage but aren't counterable...wow, that blows my mind.

    guess what's going to make it into my next revision of the FAQ besides SummErs' HUGE critiques on my anti-Pai section? /versus/images/icons/wink.gif
     
  18. Jinisgod

    Jinisgod Well-Known Member

    CDs can be cancelled with anything.


    Bet thats the kind of info i wanted
     
  19. CreeD

    CreeD Well-Known Member

    doh fei, the original post was hum0ur. Sorry. Subtle, yet, unhumorous!
     
  20. feixaq

    feixaq Well-Known Member

    Oh sorry, my bad.
     

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