Help pls on how to skin a shinobi

I seem to be having problems with power ranger's + & ++.

Are these moves totally safe when blocked? I just couldn't find any way to punish them when they come out randomly with Jacky, Sarah and Aoi. It almost feels like free damage - I block A or B then he mixes up a followup (throw, d+p, blabla)

 

ano po?

 

A quick look at Kage's counter chart, both moves are not present so I guess they're not counterable (nothing guaranteed when you block them). recovers low leaving Kage with a slight disadvantage when blocked. + leaves Kage even with you.

You just have to be defensive. EDTEG should suffice. Backdashing will also nullify throws and d+P.

 

recovers, as said, low - probably that's why you have trouble with it (learn to read the commandlist). + is kinda slow in it's startup animation but yeah, safe on block. Try to get the habbit of evading it instead of blocking it (or with aoi reversing it with a mid reversal), it's not as hard as it seems. Most Kage players will do or something else fast on block after and hope for a MC so that's something to think about if you do happen to block it.

 

ang sabi nya powerranger = Ninja

 

aznricemasta:
bili mo ako ng bibinka for christmas o ^_^

Oioron:
+ is ghey >_<. It's making me hesitate to attack at most times - which equals to Kage free to piss me off. Darn, what a control priviledge.
As for ++, are you sure that this leaves Kage even with me, if that's the case I think I can find something to deal with it then, thanks.
I didn't know backdashing from that range could prevent a d+p, thanks
Sorry but what's EDTEG?
When you said you have to play defensive, is that the sucessful gameplan when up against Kage? I hope not - I hate being static.

KiwE
That's what I was kinda afraid of - I thought at first there was no way to deal with those two but prevent them in the first place with sidestep, d+p, reversal, or blabla. The last time I fought ChinChinSushi, he gets away with those two risk free ghey moves which led to free momentum if blocked or 30% to 40% damage if hit. A bit later I realized that + recovers mid so at least I can punish it with Jacky's +>, Aoi's +> or ++> and Sarah's +> which was more reliable among the other two since it promises more damage.
But when Kage does ++, Kage's d+p always beats my elbow unlike the + scenario up there - which led me to believe that ++ benefits him frame advantage. Is there another way other than backdash after blocking it? A more aggressive approach perhaps?

ChinChinSushi:
Damn you and your majhong chewing fugging ninja! Kage should be banned like Pokemon - they both destroy braincells! And stick that jumanji crap up where the sun don't shine!
Things in my mind when against your freak:
1) st00pid + & ++!!! one wrong poke then it's either I get bitchslapped or suck sidewalk which leads to...
2) when the fark is it safe to attack!?! which leads to...
3) ten feet flying fark!!! I'm so paranoid with throws, I do multiple throw escapes every .5 second which leads to...
4) Carpal's Syndrome!!! >_<;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

 

Silly rabbit, tricks are for kids /versus/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

 

EDTEG is Evade Double Throw Escape Guard, could be triple or just one TE. It's vulnerable to half and full crescent moves.

You use Jacky and Sarah, both can and are designed to exert pressure on the opponent with an array of offensive moves. I'm surprised that your opponent is not the one bitchin about your characters /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif. Don't gamble too much with big moves and and won't be much of a problem.

Take a look at these Counter Tables , it will greatly help.

 

[ QUOTE ]
The last time I fought ChinChinSushi, he gets away with those two risk free ghey moves which led to free momentum if blocked or 30% to 40% damage if hit.

[/ QUOTE ]

None of the moves are risk free. After After he is at a rather large disadvantage (just under throwcounterable) and the + can be punished pretty bad if you evade it (or perhaps even you can punch right into the move since it's slow and get a MC?).

Don't forget the possibility (and you don't want to hear this) that he might be a better player than you. /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif

For example, Jackys is even advantage to Jacky on block and his Step-in Iaigeri just aswell are they not? Learn to read the charts and etc on the site - they're very valuable and help.

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry but what's EDTEG?
When you said you have to play defensive, is that the sucessful gameplan when up against Kage? I hope not - I hate being static.


[/ QUOTE ]

EDTEG = Evading double throw escape gaurd.
Don't play defensivly all the time cause that means your gameplay will in turn be obvious - you need to vary your playstyle due to the opponent etc; there is no easy way. Kage has a pretty strong throwgame aswell that would make it even worse (specially if your not comfortable with throwescapes yet).
After Kage's + you are even (and since an elbow is slower than a punch, his punch will win) so you can do things like aswell as him if you don't evade it or you can just block his and get the advantage from blocking it (if he always does this) etc but what's wrong with backdashing / CD'ing back? You could launch a counterattack or even backdash>evade the etc. If you can read your opponent, you can counter it. That's how it is in vf (and why we love it).

With Jacky, do >+, and combo. With Sarah I believe your will win against the lowpunch in this situation and with Aoi you could reverse or do >++ (crouchthrow him). Those are great options, if you just read your opponent that is.
Good luck and Over and out.

 

Oh, so that' the universal term for what I called sidestepmultiplethrowescapeanddon'tforgettheblock. doh.

Oioron:
Unfortunately for us, we're only 3 ppl playing here so one of us is obligated to pick Jerky for plenty of reasons. Sarah was my starting char and I use Aoi 'cuz I'm notorious for utilizing the most technical bastards/bitches. As for him, he picks Goh 'cuz they both look alike: fugly. Kage, 'cuz he also wears a mask to hide his fuglyness. Crap, I kind got off topic.
About the counter table, holy shite - this is one of the most convenient things I have ever seen in my fighting game career. It's just too good to be true... wow.

KiwE:
Waa? What do you mean throwcounterable? That I can punish it with a throw after block? But, dosen't he recover crouching? Anyway, I'll do alright against Kage's + since I have a guaranteed elbow and Kage can't do a thing. Now for the ++, I'm aware that it can be puniished if I evade it in the first place. What I was looking for was how to punish it after 'blocking' it. Poking Kage with a during his ++ sounded interesting - I wonder if it works tho.

Pfft!!! No way! I'm 1773er! The only thing he does with all charcters is eleventy billion times until his opponent's get ring out! /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Drat, I didn't know those moves of Jerky had such. But IMO, I would put my money on those 2 moves of Kage due to the horrifying evasion at startup.

Hey, thanks you for the tips. Those were in the back of my mind but I just couldn't think straight 'cuz of all the noise and smoke here (st00pid fireworks!). You were great help.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Waa? What do you mean throwcounterable? That I can punish it with a throw after block? But, dosen't he recover crouching? Anyway, I'll do alright against Kage's + since I have a guaranteed elbow and Kage can't do a thing

[/ QUOTE ]

No, I said just under throw counterable meaning it isn't (it's -5 to -7 frames for him and a TC situation requires -8).
Btw, you don't have a garanteed elbow at all against Kage when you block . It can be both gaurded and evaded. For you to have a garanteed elbow it would have to be atleast -14 (the double). About + punching, a MC is when you interupt a move during it's execution and since it was slow my brain freaked (I'm still wasted from New Years) but in reality, since the + has long reach, it's probably not a valid option. Heh, I like doing Brads midkick reversal on it myself, even though a evade knockdown would be much better (love playing Kage vs Brad matches btw). There are probably alot more options for you to try out - get comfortable with the training mode and the amazing record feature VF has and just record kage doing +> and some other options and condition yourself to a correct reaction every time - it's the best way of getting the habbit of breaking strong flowcharts and will help you kick that ninja ass with style (remember to insult Kage with alot of "yo momma" jokes and spam down attacks).

 

Ugh... This is not funny anymore...

He's killing me by by totally doing a range game. If ever I do get in, here comes the st00pid +bitchslap. It's not that he abuses it - it's the intimidation that that move gives-off to make you hesitate which allows that idiot Kage to have more control of the match.

So how do you guys skin him properly? What I need to know is what are his weaknesses for me to capitalize. In my point of view, his range game forces most characters to change their basic gameplan. And that st00pid +, is there some kind of option select offense so that I won't randomly get hit by it without hisitating (which is begging to be thrown)?

EDIT:
KiwE:
Crap, you were right - he can still block/evede after I blocked +. Aoi is ok since she can low throw the freak but for the others, they have to go through so much trouble... bleh...

Now that you mention it, I haven't thought of 'yo mamma jokes for VF yet. hmm...
Let me try one:
"Yo mamma is soo fat - whenever Kage does his one throw wherin he switches sides on her in the center of the water stage, he gets ringed out!"
Crap, I need to shorten this >_<

 

Silly rabbit, tricks are for kids

Oh, and, thanks for the Naruto. Here's a sample of the avatars I told you about