Newbie - Fairly inexperienced player - Questions

Hello. I'm a pretty inexperienced VF player. I actually own all the Virtua Fighter games, but due to having nobody to really play with, the finer points of gameplay were lost on me.

Now that I have people to play with, along with Quest Mode in VF4E, I have a new reason to master my favorite characters.

I guess what I'm looking for is two fold:

1) A description of each character and what their strengths and major weaknesses are. I have a general idea, but I'd like an experts point of view.

2) Tier ranking list. I'm just curious about that one.

FYI, I've been playing Wolf for the last few days (just got the game) and I'm about 300 matches in. I'm starting to pick up on some things... combos, basic strats... but there are some things in the Tutorial that still haven't really come in handy. I guess that will come when I hit higher ranking opponents in Quest, eh?

Anyway, I have serious interest in playing Goh and Vanessa as well. I used to play Jeffry all the time, but now, for some reason, I haven't even tried him out. I'm mainly concentrating on Wolf and playing a bit of Goh.

Anyway, anyone who can lend me some insight would be appreciated.

L/O

 

click here to avoid any possible flames

and one more thing

welcome to the boards, btw.

 

GO GO GKAIZER


<font color="blue"> FLAME SHIELD ACTIVATED </font>

 

Yeah, I had already been there. The B & C documents don't completely apply for Evolution, right? The character selection guide half-answers my question, mainly because the other character I'm so interested in (Goh) isn't in those versions...

And based on the second suggestion there (the topic) I don't belong in this forum at all, I suppose. I can't contribute anything at my level, I suppose, and asking questions is... well... out of the question.

Thanks anyway.

 

You can ask questions. But asking for a comprehensive list of characters and weaknesses is asking for a thread to explode in mayhem if I ever saw one. I'll toss out some ideas that I've gathered, breifly, for each character. Bear in mind that I'm not an 'expert' - I'm a newbie as well. This thread will probably get locked or deleted, but it will also help me figure out what I've learned about each character as well, so here it goes... ( * indicates the two characters I've played more than 500 times.)

Akira - Pros: Heavy, fast hitter, floats like a rock, capable of damaging juggles. Useful throw selection.
Cons: Nearly 100% linear attacks, movelist has high emphasis on mid attacks and punch-based attacks. Also has the hardest inputs in the game, if that's a factor for you.

Pai - Pros: Fast, strikes from across the universe, good mixup selection, wide selection of throw options and defensive options, one of the best low attacks in the game (punch leading to bokutai).
Cons: Fairly weak, floats like a ballon.

Lau - Pros: Strong, fast chains, good juggler.
Cons: ??Not a good long range selection?? Your finger falls off from hitting ppp in juggles (Haven't seen great weaknesses in Lau)

*Lei Fei - Pros: Nearly every stance has a sabaki attack/avoidance trait. Lots of crumple/stagger/ knockback. Fairly strong, great at long and medium range, fairly good juggle selection. Autopunch reversal from IN stance is great to use once you've conditioned opponents.
Cons - Stances limit mobility, attack options, and evade capability. Worst jab in the game, worst throw selection. Learning curve is steep. Also one of the 'slower' characters. Worst point blank options in the game.

Wolf - Not much experience here. Pros: massive throw arsenal, many stun attacks, and has a good poke start selection. Throws hit like a freight train. Floats like a stone.
Cons: ??? (I get my ass beat by him) ?Short rushes?

Vanessa: Pros - great rushing capability, good at poking from close and medium.
Cons: Haven't seen any glaring cons for her, either.

Lion: Pros - cheesy poking bastard, one of the fastest in the game, can fight very well from crouching, huge low attack assortment, juggles pretty good.
Cons: Doesn't hit very hard, but he hits LOTS.

Kage: Pros: If ever there was a block of cheese, this guy is it. The majority of his attacks seem to leave you at a disadvantage even when blocked. Can poke from all but extreme range. Confusing angles of attack for inexperienced players. Ringout master - unless it's a cage, you can end up out of the ring, even if it has high walls. Juggles out the wazoo.
Cons: He covers lots of ground with his moves, in various directions, so getting evaded can leave you in a bad position. Most of his moves also close with his opponent, but he's better at medium range than point blank. (that's about all the negative I've seen from him)

Jeffry: Pros: Slams hard, hits hard, lots of knockdown/float power, and fairly damaging juggles, even if they're short. Also floats like a rock.
Cons: Has a ten move list, and many of those ten attacks leave you strung out badly if blocked. But when they hit, they hurt.

Brad: Pros: Tons of full and half spinning moves make evading rushes a pain unless you're very familiar with his moves. Seems to have fairly good juggles. Good when on the offensive.
Cons: D+P beats 99.9% of his sway attacks. Not that great a throw selection. Not many defensive options.

Goh: Pros: Can't comment much here. His strength seems to lie in his stuns and staggers, which lead to throws or juggles - he's not the greatest juggler, but it's still more damage.
Cons: Seems to be one of the slower characters.

*Aoi: Pros: Fast. Best defensive options I've ever seen - can counter 99.95% of the moves in the game. Great at mind games. One of the best throw selections, if not the best. Many evading/stunning attacks.
Cons: Striking attacks are fairly weak, juggles are fairly weak. Not many spinning attacks. Striking attack selection is probably the smallest in the game. Floats like a baloon.

Jacky: Pros: Great poking selection, lots of half spinning moves, has good get-out-of-Dodge-because-my-combo-didn't-hit shuffle.
Cons: ??? (haven't found any - he's another one that whips on me)

Shun: Pros: strange angles of attack, one of the fastest mid attacks. Fairly good at juggling. Some useful sabaki/evasive attacks.
Cons: not all of his moves are available until he's drunk X times. Has fast moves, but also has some abominably slow ones. Stances limit mobility and move selection. Sometimes going for drinks when selecting moves will lead you to mistakes.

Sarah: Pros: Flamingo stance is a big cheater (I have problems with it). Good juggles. Capable of starting rushes from close or medium, with punches or kicks. Fairly fast.
Cons: Fairly straightforward fighting style - relies on move range and speed, and flamingo cheese - not much room for deception out of the ordinary. Also seems to hit towards the weaker end of the spectrum.

 

Well thank you for that. That's somewhat what I was looking for. Basically, I've read through FAQs, posts, and other things to find this information out, but nothing that really described what I was looking for.

I appreciate you typing all that out. That was very nice of you. I guess now I just need to keep quiet and lurk. I had hoped to find a place to interact, but since I don't have anything insightful to contribute, I'll just hang out.

Thanks.

 

This might help.

/KiwE

 

[ QUOTE ]
LaserOption said:

The character selection guide half-answers my question, mainly because the other character I'm so interested in (Goh) isn't in those versions...

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you Kiwe, but I had already looked in that guide and didn't find Goh or Brad, so, like I said, it didn't completely answer my question. However, it is a very good chart to have as a reference, so thanks for mentioning it.

 

Hi there

Welcome to the boards. Don't worry about people /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif... what they were getting at is that you should probably try to keep your questions more specific but by all means keep asking them.

Anyway, I play Wolf and Goh and a bit of Vanessa. Certainly the thing to do with Wolf is to keep your distance until you are ready to throw. Take advantage of any whiffed moves and use things like cancelling to elicit them. The thing to watch out for is when people rush you with a barrage of close range striking attacks. If this happens you will find and , are your best friends. At a higher level you will find that thow escapes are essential because Wolf is very reliant on + which is a guaranteed throw move.

Goh is a different kettle of fish entirely. Of course his throws are good but he doesn't have anywhere near the range of Wolf. He has some good close and mid range pokes and staggers (such as, , ) and that set up guessing games. + is particularly good against fuzzy guarding because it is a bit slower than normal throws. +, and + are particularly good at taking advantage of a recovering opponent too.

I'm not that good with Vanessa yet but in offensive stance she has some good catch throw/strike guessing games set up by things such as

Good luck

Robin

 

[ QUOTE ]
Well thank you for that. That's somewhat what I was looking for. Basically, I've read through FAQs, posts, and other things to find this information out, but nothing that really described what I was looking for.

I appreciate you typing all that out. That was very nice of you. I guess now I just need to keep quiet and lurk. I had hoped to find a place to interact, but since I don't have anything insightful to contribute, I'll just hang out.


[/ QUOTE ]

The only issue I saw with your post is that you were asking for general info on ?thirteen? characters. Even the little list I typed up took some time, and I didn't spend very long thinking about each character. You're more likely to get (favorable) responses with more focused questions. If someone asked you for an overview of all fifty states in the US, you'd be a little overwhelmed, too.

Oh, one other thing. Nearly every BBS has at least one person who has nothing better to do than to flame new posters. It's like an initiation rite. Don't take it personally and get your feelings hurt.

So go ahead and ask your questions. It's hard to come up with a stupid question. At worst, you'll get your thread locked and a post linking to another thread. Just realize that the more specific your question is, the better the information you're likely to get. "What combos can follow up Lei-Fei's +?" is a lot easier to answer than "What are some combos for every character?"

Welcome to the board, and the flame retardant suits are in the closet to the right of the door if you need them. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

Thanks for your replies.

Yes, with Wolf I have a much easier time. His ease of play definetly wins me more victories than I've had with Goh. However, I like Goh's defensive style. The problem is with characters like Lion and Lau. Those two drive me nuts with their combos. With Wolf I can usually run them over, but with Goh standing back and playing poking defense usually earns me a couple of boots to the head. My major problem is that when I get into grab stance my opponent is usually already struggling, so I can't get my major throws past the first stage in a lot of cases. I'm the persistent type, though, and I'm determined to get better with him.

Vanessa, like you I haven't played her all that much. I'm also considering Shun, but that's on the back-burner right now. Wolf is cemented in my charachers list alread (I'm a pro-wrestling fan, and I've been playing him since part 1), and Goh is quickly drying.

Yes, Shaolin, I realize that I might have been asking a lot, but I did a search and I checked the documents and I found nothing that was just a breakdown like that Character Selection Guide that included Brad and Goh, and also had more specific, and less overall information. Something like what you did was more along the lines of what I was looking for. Mainly I was looking to be pointed in the right direction, or get some experienced opinions. I have enough to go on now that I can use as a starting point.

Thanks again for your replies, guys.

 

If you're having trouble dealing with a certain type of play, then keep trying. The game is balanced enough so that there is always a way to beat what the opponent is doing. If the opponent is doing a lot of heavy combo starters, play defensively, doing faster attacks, or taking defensive maneuvers after an attack of yours is blocked. Wait until you are at a large advantage (like after a punch hits, for instance) before going for larger attacks (knee, shrm) or throws. Even though Wolf is a thrower, you should not try to throw more than you would with another character. Wait for the opportunity, either a guranteed throw situation, or when you believe the opponent will guard, then throw. Check out some media to get some general ideas of good flows with wolf, he can be played many ways.

 

I'm definetly referring more to Goh than Wolf there. Wolf I've been having good luck with that. I learned pretty fast that throwing wasn't going to win me games if that's what I went for. I knew that from most other 3d fighters, too. Whiffed throws usually equal a free combo for your opponent, after all. I have gotten into a rhythm with Wolf's striking game, and I'm learning new strategies from playing Quest mode, too.

Goh, though, is the one I'm having the trouble with characters like Lau and Lion (Sarah, too, with her damn flamingo stance).

In the end, though, I'm just gonna stick with Wolf for now. I need to take things one step at a time. Thanks for the advice, SiYko.

 

I love grapplers in fighting games in general. I try to play pretty much all of them that I come across. While most grapplers kinda feel blah- there are some that really stand out. Zangief is of course the quintessential. And also within this class of really fun to play grapplers, there are also Alex, Potemkin, and Wolf /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Wolf essentials, imho-

f+p+g - the best catch throw imho, and a really good move in general

the hcb elbow- yeah, we all know about this one. but if the first one is blocked, don't do the second, or they will
duck the second and punish you bad. or reverse you on the 2nd P- e.g, all DS Vanessa has to do is let go of the joystick to catch the 2nd p.

short shoulder - his floater, basically. may be his knee will get good again in FT.

f,d+k - you're screwed if blocked, but good stats otherwise. hits pretty often for some reason, esp against humans

b+p - yeah nice. only bad point is that it's a high.

db+p - a frame slower than the b+p, but it's a safe mid that crouch staggers.

f+p - do this on stagger, and you get a crumble

D,df+p - similar to Vanessa's

p+k - hits more often than it looks like it should, charge sometimes for that deer-in-headlights effect

and of course, all of his throws /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

he has other good ones, but the above are what I use the most often

in quest, all Wolf has to do is f,f+p and ground throw. lame. /versus/images/graemlins/frown.gif

Goh and Jeff are kinda interesting, but I can't get into them for some reason in Evo. But they look a lot more interesting in FT, particularly Jeff. /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

Ah, a fellow grappler lover. Yes, I played Zangief so much in our local arcades I became known as 'Big Russian', a handle I carried for many years. My love affair with arcades ended with the competition, and as such, the Russian rests.

However, VF4E has really rekindled my competitive spirit. I'm looking forward to trying to find new players in my area.

At any rate, thanks for the advice. I had pretty much had most of that down, but it's another thing completely using it in competition. In Quest, I try to fight as I would with anyone else instead of cheesing my opponents.

My problem with the catch throw is reversals. Seems to get reversed more often than not. I find myself capitalizing on using the Giant Swing as a punisher for whiffed moves and occasionally I'm able to stick one in after evading some canned combos. I use the Jackhammer and the Tiger Driver most often when the opponent guards (high and low, respectively) and on guaranteed throws for speed.

And yes, I've discovered the fun of using the chop (+) quite quickly. I throw it out sometimes to catch them off guard, but what I love is that charged version. Sometimes they don't quite know how to react and I get the stagger, + for the crumple, then ++ for the Tiger Driver. At least, that's what I've done up until now.

I also use the Rolling Sobat (or whatever they call + in the game) to set up two shoulders and a ground throw, though I imagine that the ground throw is something I probably won't be able to count on in competition (tech rolls), so I'll likely follow it up with a charge (+) or something...

Anyway, sorry to go on like that. I'm still trying out new things and experimenting.

 

try these two Wolf combos; they're easy to avoid, but still fun and damaging:
+(full charge) -> -> +

same as above but end with the KS (+) instead of the Giant Swing.

one more thing, try to do the Giant swing motion as fast as possible to tack on an extra 20 pts of dmg. you'll know if you did it correctly when the camera shows Wolf's back as the throw starts.

 

Ah, I didn't realize that it made a difference (the Swing). That's cool.

Ah, so the doesn't beatdown after the stagger, huh? Yeah, that does seem like fun, but as with all full charged chops, I'm really taking a crap-shoot on whether or not I'll be demolished for trying it. =| Thanks for the tip.

I just bought an arcade stick today, so I'll be spending some time re-learning the basics. Wish me luck. /versus/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

Just remember that nothing is guaranteed after+.

With goh, sarah is really hard but you need to pick your defensive moves. sarah = jacky =+ lion = +. that's all.

Robin

 

Really? Nothing is guaranteed? I guess the computer opponents are weak strugglers then... What's the best stagger attack to use for setting up combos, then?

 

the only stumble/stagger move i can think of at the moment with Goh is his +. and the full charge + staggers on block.