Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no hope)

There are no illegal moves. If the game allows you to do it, then it will be done. If its a online ranked fight, some ppl want to win by any means necessary. It doesn't matter how cheap, how much spammin, and glitchin they have to do. Its all about that win. If they've found some move that online lags or glitches will give them the advantage with, they'll use over and over again for the whole 3-to 5 rounds. It doesn't matter how nasty it looks, or how funny it looks or how cheap it obviously is, as long as they get the win.

Online Ranked matches are like street fights, anything goes as long as I can physically do it and you can't stop it, its all about me winning and you losing(no matter what gimmick I'm using) I think as long as there are leaderboards that show win/losses then online ranked fights will typically be ugly street fights.

The problem is street fights are usually not fun, and don't bring out the best in fighting games like VF. Non ranked player matches seem to bring out the best, the most fantastic sequences and combos. Players take more risks and are willing to try out new things. But that's not so in the street fight, each player sticks to what they think will work everytime.

I don't think there is any hope in keeping online ranked matches free of street fighting, so why not just let ranked matches be fought in VS mode or in Quest mode. Let Online be player matches that have leaderboards that are reset weekly or monthly. That way, everyone will probably feel more motivated to play.

I think if they took ranked matches offline that would actually
make online play more enjoyable, instead of logging on getting prepared to deal with who knows what cheap move is coming next[/size], the quality of play would be higher if everyone knows that the leader boards are temporary and will be regularly reset

I've noticed when leaderboards are reguarly reset, many street fighters just don't come back.

I've also noticed when players are facing each other in a live tournament with live spectators that street fighting simply doesn't occur hmmm......

 

Virtua Fighter 5 General Discussion
Online play being discussed
You don't play VF online

My stance on this matter is that you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

Wow, LOL, Quickdraw Mcgraw LOL. It is correct that I'm on a PSN and VF has no online on PSN. It is also correct I have many friends and family that have XBL and they do play VF on XBL. and I have watched many many matches on XBL at a friends house, at my brothers house,etc.

Further, what's in my post is certainly true for most quality fighting games that have an online component, surely as smart as you obviously are, you've heard of reasoning by analogy

I play Tekken 6 online, SCIV online, EA's MMA online, UFC's 2010 online, MK online, FNR4 online, so even if my statements are by extrapolation they are what they are.

So Seidon, whether than your usual unsuccessful attack at me, give your opinion on the matter at hand.

Are online ranked matches like street fights? (Yes/No)
Would it be better to save ranked matches for offline vs mode?
Would it make game play better if online was player matches only?
Would it be more fun to reset leaderboards weekly/monthly?

and as is so often the case, your stance on the matter is wrong?

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

No.
No.
No.
Doesn't matter.

Also, thanks for responding in kind to my supposed attack. I just don't think you're experienced enough to comment on the state of competitive VF in general let alone the specifics of online/offline play.

Enjoy your fantasy land, mate


lol

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

Thanx m8 that was all me was asking for. You're opinion Was that so hard Again for the record I'm certain I have as much or more competitive play as you do. I don't play VF online because on the PS3 there is no online, on the other hand, many live competitions many, many Secondly, as stated I play many other fighting games online, and I've noticed the same thing about them all. Online ranked matches amount to street fighting. I've personally witnessed much VF on XBL and have seen street fighting with my own eyes.

So what you think about my experience is not really relevant in this case.

So based on your answers to my questions, I take it that you're a street fighter when it comes to online ranked matches

@Marlyjay Don't h8, congratulate

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

Master Po get on xbox live so we can play.

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

I'm disappointed too, he hasn't written an essay yet.

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

Soooooooo, Marlyjay, should I take it from your post and oh so subtle sarcasm that on VF5 online which I don't play that there is

No Spamming
No Cheap moves that are afforded by online lag
No online glitching
No sequences that work online, but would be punished offline
No situations where online lag is abused to the benefit of one player over another
No online pullers (they're about to lose, so they pull because they don't want to damage their record)
No frame anomalies that can be abused by one player over another


Well, well, well. Then, if that's the case, then VF is more of a masterpiece than I thought. And the VF5 online (which I don't play) has accomplished something that no other fighting game has been able to do with their online, and perhaps the scores of VF5 XBL ranked matches that I've seen
with my own eyes are anomalies.

Which means that my analogy of online rank matches being like street fights simply doesn't apply to VF5 Online because none of things that happen in other fighting games online happen in VF5online XBL which if I played it I would know right Marlyjay?

Which means that I'm wasting the VFDC community's time in asking whether online fighting games would be better off if ranking matches were left out, or if leaderboards were reset weekly or monthly. Or if non ranked player matches or tournaments were the only kind of online play. In a way you and Seidon are suggesting that VF5 online has no real problems. At least that's the latent consequence of you being
right and me being wrong. Wow! That's FN good news.

Since VF5 online ranked matches according to Seidon and Marlyjay don't suffer any of the woes of lag that the other major fighting games suffer, then my questions are not relevant and are a clear demonstration that since I don't play VF5 XBL online I have no clue as to what I'm talking about.

Well, well, well, first let me apologize to my fellow VFDCers,

I had no idea that lag did not affect VF5 online. I had no idea that there are no ways to take advantage of or abuse online play mechanics in VF5. I had no idea that cheap online moves, sequences, combos, spamming have no impact whatsoever in VF5online. So by induction according to
Seidon and Marlyjay VF5 online XBL is, is., well more
like an online fighting Nirvana... And since I don't fight VF5 online I'm missing out... DAMN!

So I with draw my questions. This is also the best possible news I could have ever hoped for. What this means is that when VF5FS comes out or when VF6 comes out for consoles, I will be able to look forward to an online experience free from the problems that all the other fighting games have online. So while I apologize for wasting the community's time on one hand, I'm excited on the other hand! Thank you Seidon and Marlyjay I had no idea. I guess if I played VF5 online then I would have known that when it comes right down to it, there is no difference between offline VF5 and online VF5 (at least not differences that can be exploited by anyone)[/size] during ranked matches

So, I'll just add this whole experience to my study in losing. Everytime I lose I perfect my skills a little further. But in this case the fact that VF5 online XBL
has no lag according to Marlyjay and Seidon at least no lag that can be abused during a ranked match, is a win for me in the long run.


Now I know, when I want the truth(that is when I can handle it) just step to Marlyjay and Seidon and they'll set me straight.

The biggest lesson I've learned today about Marlyjay and Seidon....

If you don't ask, they won't tell.


@Marlyjay of course you do realize general covers everything, including the special case of VF5 XBL online. And since my post was forward looking to VF5 PSN online and typically about fighting games in general no real reason to stick it in the XBL thread.

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

Not quite as long as the usual. Masterpo, don't you know if you can't express yourself in at least 800 words, that you cannot be taken seriously on this board? I want to take you seriously. Thoroughly explain your point of view with your next reply sir.

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

I can some what see where Masterpo is coming from when he states that everyone will try cheap tactics and gimmicks all day to win on ranked. He's right, people do attempt gimmicks to get any win they can. However, the good thing about VF is gimmicks don't get you anywhere as far as it would any said fighting game online or not.

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

Is it just me, or are all fighting games about learning these gimmicks and basically being better at utilizing them than your opponent?

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

For Offline play You're exactly right. But... the "Online capability" is somewhat new to fighting games. Online introduces lag and frame anomalies.

The lag and frame anomalies can create advantages and disadvantages in the game in ways unintended and unanticipated by the game's original developers.

Street fighting in this context is when someone exploits the lag and frame anomalies in anyway they can simply to get a win in ranked mode.

That is, a person is playing the game in a way that is
unintended and unanticipated by the game's original developers in order to rank up.

Street fighting online ordinarily discourages people from even playing ranked matches. So in many fighting games people opt to just play player matches.

So are the ranks that people get using street fighting really deserved? Abusing the network connection to one person's advantage or another person's disadvantage just so you can
rank up. Is that what the game developers intended?

1) Should the concept of 'Rank Matches' be reserved for
offline vs mode or quest mode play?

2) Should the concept of online tournaments replace rank
matches online?

3) Would resetting the leader boards for player matches
every month encourage more people to play player matches

Offline VS modes you see who you're playing, you see what sticks are involved.

Online there is a network between players that can change the balance of the game because of network latency, routing tricks, hacked sticks, etc.

I'm just wondering what can be done to reduce the amount of street fighting in online fighting games. Which I think would make the community bigger....

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

Wait you mean throwing hadoukens and shit is bad?

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

No, he means online is not the same as offline. He's just going about it in a roundabout way.

He's wondering if there's anything that can be done to stop exploiters exploiting the specific advantages and disadvantages of playing online over offline.

The answer was unexplicitly given by Tricky in that you can't. ("Is it just me, or are all fighting games about learning these gimmicks and basically being better at utilizing them than your opponent?") Fighting game players will find and utilize anything and everything that works, even if this is specific to the evironment they're playing in. Introducing gentleman's agreement type things is impossible because its unenforcable.

The best you can do is regard online and off as two seperate entities.

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

I agree with most of this! But maybe there is a fix.

1) drop ranked mode matches from online entirely

2) replace online ranked matches with:

mirror matches,
iron man matches,
venus matches,
the rest of the underground tournaments from VF4Evo

3) Add tournament mode, where initial brackets are filled in
first come first serve (8-to-12) players

4) Bring Quest Challenges online. Instead of executing challenges against the AI, the online players attempt to execute challenges against each other

5) Reset the leaderboards periodically. Many glitchers, boosters, abusers, spammers, don't like to have to come back
and put their names in lights twice.

6) Allow spectators in non ranked player matches whether you're fighting or not. cheaters, abusers, boosters, street fighters tend to only do their thing in one-on-one situations. When they're being watched by spectators that tend to play differently (my observation)

7) If we have to keep ranked online, then go with a simple
belt system where there are no more than say 10 ranks.
Perhaps 1rst dan to 10th dan and to rank up not only do
you have to win matches you have to complete the online
quest mode challenges that go with that rank. Then we make
sure that the quest mode challenges really require
skill and mastery as you rank up, no master - no belt!

I think these suggestions would work. Of course its only a guess on my part since PS3 VF5 has no online, and I don't play VF5 on XBL. But from what I've seen and what I hear about VF5 XBL its not a large vibrant community with competition no matter when you long on. I hear there are some cliques where you get some competition from time, to time, but in general its pretty slim pickins. (That's just what I heard)

 

Re: Online Rank Fighting is Street Fighting (no ho

That is what I was driving at, good man.