Pai Chan vs the Cast

I saw a few of the pai vs sarah and few other characters so I figured I might start a threat for all specific strats regarding Pai's match up again whole cast all in 1 place to centralize things in this 1 area on 1 thread. I wouldn't want to see the Pai section with too many Pai vs ??? threads it would create too much clutter. If someone could find all the matchup info they want in 1 area to help our developing Pai players that want to improve their knowledge of the game.

I would throw something out first and I am quite a few questions too but I want to hear what my fellow Pai players have to ask first. Anyone with any real Pai knowledge can answer questions too because I know I don't have all the answer and I am sure someone out there does so we can all learn from each other and improve our games with Pai at the same time. I am sure you people had questions on this matter for some time this will be the place to bring it out and any good info the better pai players here might want to share can be brought up before someone asks about it too. It is all about the community and we all have to do our part to make VF that much better overall.

Someone had to make a thread like this so i figured I would step up and initiate things on this matter. There is already sections for Pai combos and the specifics of pai's moves in general so I figured this section would be needed at some point as well.

 

Any advice for Pai vs. Goh would be appreciated. I often play with a Goh player who's stronger than I am, so any tips would be appreciated.

 

What is goh doing that kills you so much that would help us determine what tactics would work best for you

 

I'll make some mental notes next time I play him and get back to you. It's been a week or so, so the most recent matches aren't fresh in my mind.

 

I might be somewhat off, since I really only play against one Pai-player, but I do play Goh, so hopefully this might help.

Bokutai vs Goh is mostly suicidal if the opponent can react to it. 3K,P launch and 4K hitthrow will get you. Not sure about Pais 66P+K~boku on hit, but so far I've had success against the other transitions. Unless you know something I don't, or the Goh player doesn't play reactively against it, don't use it.

Pai's reversals are poisonous for Goh. The guaranteed 9KK after a reversal nets ~50 dmg everytime you land one and probably over 80% of Goh's strikes fall under the categories that Pai can reverse. Of course, don't go throwing them everywhere blindly but if you notice any sort of habit that you can punish with a reversal, go for it. Making players doupt their own choises and hesitate is really good. And if they don't, just do it again.

If you are evading VS Goh, you should evade more towards his stomach mostly. He has safe and powerful options towards his back (4P,P and 66P) while towards his front he has 1K and 4K+G, both of which carry way more risk. There's other circulars but they are so slow you should be able to evade dash guard or ECD them pretty safely. Watch out for Goh's 66K+G though, since it can tag you from canceled evades sometimes, if you stand guard.

Goh is very good at whiffpunishing but he struggles (at least in my hands) against an opponent who keep their distance. I'm not quite sure how well Pai can capitalize on that, but if she can you could try that. You're forcing the Goh to snail towards you carefully or risk running into pokes or throwing out risky moves (Goh's most ranged move is 66K which is slow and linear. From closer you he has 33P and 4K but those aren't completely without faults either).
I'm not telling to backdash all the time, but in a neutral situation with some space inbetween the characters, try keeping it that way. It might just pay off, especially if you have the lifelead.

If the Goh player is racking up damage on you using his sabakis, it's probably time to think about your own habits and break them a bit. Pai has at least her 3P+K and FC 3P+K which are both excellent moves by their own right but they also cannot be sabakied by Goh. There's probably more but from the top of my head right now only those come to mind.

And if you're getting hit by Goh's CH 6K a lot, stop pressing buttons at bad situations and block or evade instead.

Hope it's some use. If you provide a more specific problem, you'll probably get a more specific answer.
Also, I guess this is a rather vague answer and I'm really not too familiar with the match-up, so critique is welcome.

 

Mid reversals are great against Goh, at least for me. Maybe I'm better than average with them because I'm a DOA player lol. Practicing that will definitely help you against him since a lot of his great moves are mids.

 

I use a lot of moves that keeps him away. Like 3 P+K and I choose to close or keep the distance depending on the situation.

Some Goh players overused 3PP especially to counter some of pai's mix up, so step twice and land the biggest combo you can. Some players won't makes 3PP mistakes twice and then try to catch/grab ofter the 1st hit... So be careful with the second evade and/or doing P+K during evade to break these attempts.

Some of his moves beats 9K so replace it: by 6P,3K...

For those who play pai like I am with an aggressive play style and close up strategy don't forget that Goh is strong in these situations. So you'll have to change your tactic... Or at least find a good alternate tactic between: "spacing tactic" and "close combat tactic".

A good Goh player is a nightmare. Must really work on the match up.

 

Whats the best way to punish after Jacky's flip kick? I find that after block, Jacky is at a reasonably safe distance and I can punish with any combos so I just dash in and throw.

Does Pai have any better options

 

P (while still floating) 3K P P => ring out (not the most effective combo but travels a lot) or going to the Wall, then DM to be on his side on wake up.

Depending how fast you react... If you block you should be ready to punish!

 

Why not take a full 66K,P float instead of that? There's some time to dash in for that too.

 

66K,P will always hit Jacky after the flip kick but I also think that 33K+G or 333K+G will hit him still. You can buffer the crouching dash and do her launcher just fine by doing he is at such a big disadvantage that it might work. I have set the Jacky AI to defend after the flip kick and they can't before the launcher hits them even after the crouching dash Launcher. The training offline won't always work online consistently depending on how bad the lag is in the game. It can work online though in the right situation

 

If you are in this situation. Mostly the JA player is defending. Trying to break on offensive mementum. So you have to care about his position in the ring (I refer to a situation where JA is going to defend with the wall near his back) . That's why I focus on RO or bringing him to the wall. RO is an instant win. Wall game is hell of a good situation with Pai.

If he's trying to kill any 2P attempts with the flip kick by "guessing that you'll made one" EVADE and you'll be able to do a combo with a ground bounce.

You can still use 1 P+K; the animation is cool. ^^

 

Thanks for the advice guys.

In dodjo 66PK works fine and with a bit practice i got the timing right for 3K+G. I can't get P (while still floating) 3KPP to work but will keep at it.

Guess I just need to learn to react better during matches.

 

3K+G from max range flip is near impossible while 66K,P always reaches without so much as a need to dash even from max range. 66K,P also deals more damage (at least from my 5 minute combo testing: 3K+G, 6K+G, P, WS P+K,P vs 66K,P, P, PP4PK.

Unless Jacky is flipping with a wall right behind his back why would you ever use anything but 66K,P to punish it?

Floating him with P is not possible on guard. And P, 3KPP does a measly 40ish damage even if you manage it after evade or whiff. You want ringouts after evading or whiffing? 66K,P, P, PPKK. More damage, better carry.

66K,P

 

66KP, P, 3KPP for 78 damage both stance, work everytime after blocked flip kick.^^
Don't listen to Ben_ Le_ Sac !!!

 

On dit la même chose. LOL

 

Best punish for that is

3---- 6------ 2 ----- You could do without the 2 but it's more safe if the connection is abit laggy plus that works on jacky and u get a couple extra damage

Im one who always trys for more damage so, if they dont get up quickly after the 335 go over to them and do 3

 

3K+G would best be used offline with no lag being an issue and is best used for style points if you want to go that route. The more reliable way of doing it is 66KP because it requires no buffering and it is guaranteed even in the laggiest of matches overall. As I said before it can work I have the timing down to land a consistent 3K+G launcher against flip kick offline easily but I wouldn't dare try it online unless I were really brave or I thought the Jacky player lacked any defensive ability and online defense is hampered considerably so it might work possible depending on the connection. If you can consistently get it to work online even in horrible lag good luck with that.

 

It always works for me- Always

 

to add to the keep your distance i find that if you keep your self just far enough 4 is amazing