Stopping the rush

Okay, so I'll admit: I'm a noob. I'm workin hard on my Vanessa, and I'm still getting better playin against the guys at LLG in columbus. But the real problem is that when I play anyone else, I get completely annihilated. Even when I play complete newbies. It's all because I can't stop the button mash, and I've no clue how to do it or what I'm doin wrong.

I know, there's a zen art of knowing what moves your opponents are capable of, and at what times. But I just can't capitalize enough on those circumstances, and by the time I can, I've already absorbed enough damage to be completely annihilated.

I'm a Vanessa player, and I know she's got good defensive techs. So I'm askin for a little advice on how to stop the newbie rush, because I feel like a complete ass every time I eat it.

 

ok, this might sound really basic but blocking is a good place to start. Eventually your opponent will be forced to try throwing you which is where you should start to attack.

learn each characters guaranteed throw moves and capitalise on them. (more importantly learn what moves look like they give a guaranteed throw but really don't)

Like the other guy said, will usually stop a rush in it's tracks.

If the other player doesn't have many circular techhniques, you can try sidestepping which gives you a big advantage if successful, but you need good timing. (Note: sidestepping is essential for playing against akira)

Once you have got the hang of all of them, try vanessa's counters etc. the timing is very tricky and you need to know what is coming but with a bit of practice you will get there.

finally, try to remember that if the other player leads with punches all you have to do is stand there and you will grab their arm.

good luck

robin

 

[ QUOTE ]
Pntsnfng_Joe said:

Okay, so I'll admit: I'm a noob. I'm workin hard on my Vanessa, and I'm still getting better playin against the guys at LLG in columbus. But the real problem is that when I play anyone else, I get completely annihilated. Even when I play complete newbies. It's all because I can't stop the button mash, and I've no clue how to do it or what I'm doin wrong.

I know, there's a zen art of knowing what moves your opponents are capable of, and at what times. But I just can't capitalize enough on those circumstances, and by the time I can, I've already absorbed enough damage to be completely annihilated.

I'm a Vanessa player, and I know she's got good defensive techs. So I'm askin for a little advice on how to stop the newbie rush, because I feel like a complete ass every time I eat it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Stopping the rush. Here's a simple rule. If you get to fight against someone who attacks no matter what, throws won't work unless you block a throw counterable move cause they will attack(or mash on buttons) even in -7. What you can do is try not to go for a throw but go for a quick attack like P, dP, elbow, side kick after you block their move. Only a few moves give advantage even they are blocked, so the chances are, you will most likely get a counter hit. Then Keep on attacking with another quick move until they freeze up.
If they don't freeze up, you will win that match because they will keep on getting hit by your attacks now, and if they do freeze up, you go for a throw next time.

 

Assuming that those button mashers usually use punchs, you can also just do nothing and then use her auto hand holds (see her movelist on Defensive Style Reversal) to slow them down and punish them. If they have a very predictable pattern, use reversals (+, +, or +). That might be able to make them have second thoughts about just button mashing. These are a bit more riskier than what others have posted because you are completely open if you guessed wrong on the reversals and can get MCed.

 

Problem with the reversals is that they only work on single-fisted attacks (no dbplm, which a noob isn't likely to do anyways), and linear kicks n punches. She doesn't have a + either.

Good advice everyone. Now I need to find some opposition that's a bit nearer to my level, or even just some noobs, so I can try it out on. I've tried usin the handhold approach before, but every time I do they decide to use a kick instead /versus/images/graemlins/mad.gif Meh, bein a noob sucks.

 

Effective use of sabakis and inashis helps as well. Learn what counter's what, work on the timing, and go from there /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

Just to reiterate maddy--against button mashers: block, counter with an attack .

 

Problem I've been having: Block, eat another attack when I counter.

 

You use vane ? Use +. Quick and hits them back. The best thing against a newbie is to keep doing that move over and over, until they start blocking. Other good moves with vane... + by it self is partially circular, mid, and quite fast. Use that when you block something of a decent size. Also + is nice because it's even faster and can interrupt people who are constantly rushing after you block. Use the rule of 2, if they eat a move twice, they will probably block, then rush and throw.

I used to have problems against new players. Then I understood that you really just have to keep your cool, look for them to do the same moves over and over. Once you figure out their pattern, crush them. Also, change up your patterns. I think that's like, the #1 thing in this game, not being predictable. Unlike most games, everything in this game has some sort of viable counter, so if you're predictable, you're screwed.

 

You're too slow! Go to Training, Challenge, and the Throwing session. Use Vanessa OS and practice throw-countering or (better yet ).

If your newbie opponent is doing a bunch of canned strings, consider dodge attacks. Or lots of -> attack.

 

+ works, but not in a series if all they try is standing PPPK combos. If it hits, uncharged, it'll leave both players even, and since most standing P attacks are 14 frames or less, vane's + comes out at a slower 16 frames, so I eat an MC.

+[p] just has horrible range. Only works if they're right up in my face, and usually I only try usin it when I'm at a large enough disadvantage that I eat their next attack as MC too. Thanks for the advice, at least it got me to look more closely at her movelist and take note of the guard/hit/MC properties of her attacks.

Yeah, it's a Ver.A list, but most of the moves are close to correct.

 

Well first, most s are 12 frames, only Vane's OS is 14. And you should learn the other characters strings, usually type strings are very punishable is blocked, so just block it and take half their life bar. If it finished standing, 270 them, if it ends crouching, low throw them. Either way, it's like 35-40%.

But anywho, + isn't likely to score a normal hit (which leaves you even). It's either going to stagger them, score a CH, or get blocked. Maddy's advice is the best - just block something and do +. Also you should do backdash-->+ a lot. If + gets blocked, PAY CLOSE ATTENTION to what they do. If they tend to throw, just go for DS ++-->+ or something until they stop throwing. If they attack, just block and then you have advantage again and attack/throw them.

This is all pretty basic stuff, I think the most important thing to do is learn the other charas strings and know when you have advantage and what you can get away with.

 

Also:

Here's a good training excersise to up your speed/reaction time.

Just have a training dummy do + repeadedly, like 5 times shoud be enough.

Then go to playback settings and put it on 100& and hit playback.

Go into OS, then block the first + and try to interrupt the next with +. You have plenty of advantage to do it, but you have to react quickly. This will train you to quickly use advantage when you have it.

 

I personally think that inashis and sabakis is fairly risky against people who mash. To repeat what some of the other posts have stated, blocking and low punch are the two best options. But to expand on that idea, you must also know WHEN to use them.

Here is a very basic explaination of when you should use them.

If you just got hit, simply block until either they finished a canned string or had a throw counterable move blocked. If you can throw, do a simple directional throw. Alot of newbs still know to mash p+g so do a directional throw. If you don't have a chance to throw, ie. not throw counterable, low punch at this point. If they rush you down and attack all the time then they will be MC'ed. At this point, if you know they like to block after getting hit, throw. If they attack senselessly, you can go for a launcher. Good options are vane's or +, or in OS (Neutral). Either combo from there or take advantage of the stagger opportunity. For staggers, either do launchers if they mash, or run up and throw if they guard.

Now, if you get blocked while attacking, chances are your opponent will start his or her attacks. Against newbs, you can go for vane's dodge attack, it's quick and one of the best in the game. Another thing you can look for is what they like to use when counterattacking. Alot of pai or lau masher would do strings, now if you patterns like that. You can simply low punch after you get blocked and beat out the attack since it's high. One other thing to watch out for, many newb players still have a general sense of throwing. Sometimes they will throw even when it's not really throw counterable moves, but 'looks' like it. Many mid disadvantage on block moves "look" throw counterable, and many newbs will throw thinking that it is. The only way to safely prevent the throw or attack is ETEG, and you can also try dodge attack. A launcher is also a risky option, but most newbs will begin to pick up on these little things quickly once they see what you are doing. So if you do a launcher on their throw attempt in this situation, they will likely not do it again next time. Similarily, if you guard too much, they will begin to throw. Use this idea to mentally control what they do.

Hope that helps you.

 

ETEG >me

Yeah...it boils down to my yomi, which is pretty dispicable right now. Time to work on that...now to find a real life noob that wont get frustrated if I win a few rounds...

 

u should play jimmy i heard he sux at vf

 

You may find switching to her offensive stance gives you access to more speed and aggressive rushes yourself. If you can get a few good flows going in offensive you might get the rushers to guard more.

Don't forget Vane's attacks directly out of a guard. If you are constantly guarding rushes anyways, wait until you are even on guard or anticipate a slower starter. Not only will you stop the rush but you'll probably score a counterhit, a crumple, and an excellent opportunity for added damage. If they are indeed newbies you can safely go for the low throw on crumple.

 

Lolol...I just found something out the other day, and nearly fell out of my chair when I found it.

There's a tutorial mission on stopping the rush. And they actually call it just that, "Stopping the Rush". It's several missions all tied together.

So next time, instead of just STFW, I should STFG /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

(Just a helpful note to anyone else)