Dead or Alive 5: Last Round

Right. I can't say too much about her since I've only had a handful of matches with her so far. And I can't say how good or bad the players I played were. But this has been my experience and mindset using her so far.

I've been going into the matches trying to use her vulnerability to throws on block to my advantage. The major buzz going around her is she's very easy to throw punish since most of her moves on block prove that. So that alone may naturally have people thinking "well shoot, I'm just going to block and/or block after my string gets blocked and wait to throw punish her all day since she can't do anything about it". Ok. Well what happens when I start my offense with her launch throw into combos instead of just blindly attacking first? What happens when I cancel my strings into other moves or delay my strings at different speeds and start landing counter hits on peoples throw or attack attemps?

Ok now we're starting to open people up, making them want to do things and starting a guessing game. After starting her offense with a few launch throws into whatever combo, suddenly, waiting for me to attack doesn't seem like the best of options, lol. So now, maybe I can start blocking and waiting for THEIR throw punishable moves to be thrown out! Now that I'm not finishing my strings, maybe they suddenly become safe since they gave up their advantage waiting for me to throw out the rest of it.

Yea she has those non string moves that are punishable by attacks on top of throws. But those are moves that (in my opinion) you don't want to use until you stun them. One thing I think people may be overlooking is how strong her PKKK, and KKK are. With KKK, the first kick is 12 frames, and if it lands, the other two K's follow up into a natural combo. The last two K's can even be delayed a very hit checkable time apart on all three K's and it'll STILL be a guaranteed 5 hit combo. Or you can stop at the second K and be at +11.

While the first K in PKKK isn't a natural combo on NH, it is on CH. Her P being 9frames obviously helps a lot, lol. And while she can be thrown after any K on block if you decide to not finish. There's enough K's in there to keep them honest and maybe not go for a throw asap after the first or second K. Which in turn can make it safe on block, or allow you to score a CH by PK'ng twice in a row (P, K, G, P, K). There's a few things you can do with that.

Her only safe mid on block is her 66P, P, P+K since the second P can't be held. Only safe f you get the teleport though.

Besides that some moves you just may have to take a risk with. Mainly her 1P since it's -15 on hit and you can get low thrown if you decide not to follow up with the second P, or take too long to. I rarely use that move. Depending on what happened the first or second time I threw it out in a round. Best thing about it is it starts low. And obviously the follow up P if it connects. But the second P is suuuper risky. Yet a great reward if it lands.

That's how I've been playing her. Or trying to anyways, hahah.. To me, she's a very yomi based character that doesn't just go out there and do the work for you, and can be very strong if you make the right reads and your teleports are on point. I've never played Bass or anyone like that. But I'm guessing it's similar to them, to an extent. I have less than 0 knowledge on them though, so that last thing I just pulled out the air, lol.

Couple other moves I'd touch on. But I'm out of time. One last thing I'll say though. Like I said, I don't know the skill or knowledge level of the people I've played against using her. But using Phase definitely made those people want to block. In those handful of matches, people blocked more there than the whole 3-4 months I've been playing this online, lol. But I don't care how people play. People mashing should be the easiest ones to beat. I'm just sayin though.

 

Well that's just a mirror match. You can do that in pretty much any FG, right? If the game is providing well-rounded tools for all characters (i.e. is not totally broken), the player making the better decisions should win more regardless of the characters used.

 

I can help you with that.

It does actually properly punish low punches with subaki. I'm not sure if there is any button delay on your end but it does indeed parry those low punches for the follow-up P after it. Before, the P wouldn't connect via slopes if the opponent was on the opposite end facing you up a slope. It would just miss completely which they fixed.

Yup I figured as much, the online has gotten to you. 6KP (>) can be punished but there is a online buffering issue with like a delay. Preferably grabs will whiff if timed wrong via online as well. If the opponent has gotten away with 6KP on block and managed to hit a button such as 66P right after it with you following 3P and beats you out...it was definitely online.

This is one of the reasons why it's hard for players from another game (VF for example) are having a hard time because the online just downright gives them bs so they are likely to be confused on what is going on.

Around 0:53 I parried the low punch for the follow-up P.


I'll throw in a couple random matches:

 

Hmm. I noticed in that Brad video with the low punch subaki follow up, it was in March, and just wondering if maybe the updates since then may have messed with it unintentionally like the Leon throw infinite. Or if it worked against spinning low backfist and not jabs. I tried to replicate it against that same attack and also Hitomi's low back fist n low punches and I still can't get the follow up to come out. Timing or mashing . But against high kicks and jabs, I get it every time. Could you try it in dojo mode and tell me if it works for you? If it does. I'll be hella confused, lol. Cause I cannot get it to come out.

 

As far as the other thing. It's more of the block stun of the defender and recovery time of the attacker being basically non existent. Seeing as the cpu can retaliate 5 times faster after blocking that vs the elbow and moves that are -2 on block.. And I'm just wonderin how many other moves are like that.. Probably not many, just a lil curious though.

 

@DestructionBomb I really enjoyed those matches. I think I asked before, but do you use a stick or pad? I'm curious because you slow escape so fast. On stuns that can be slow escaped I can never recover so quickly no matter how much butter I'm trying to churn out of my stick. What am I doing wrong?

 

You have to spin the stick. After 1 spin you should be at 90% max speed at least.

As for the lag, make sure you don't have simulated lag in offline modes enabled in the options.

 

Entertainment at it's finest! @DestructionBomb troll videos are always 300% lolz, but this one is just too much. It's 9:34am and I wasn't ready for this. Man I can't stop laughing!

"Kill that son of a bitch!"

 

You still have your copy of DoA5U? If so, can you get the follow up to come out after a subaki'd low punch.?

 

Tested it now on Phase 4's 2P, still works. Perhaps it's a mistimed on your end? Works fine for me so far. Actually as a matter of fact, they made his subaki much more sensitive from what the patch notes details said..so the follow-up P should be easier I believe.

On pad (Not the dualshock/xbox) The SFIV pad with the Seth picture on it. I use stick as well but the motions affect me online a bit. It's......weird. Can't really explain it but I cannot play the stick online, could be just me. Will adjust to it eventually.

But yeah, what Sorwah said.

 

I've never had a problem getting the follow to come out which is why I was kind of shocked by your video. I still have my copy so I'll test it out next time I fire up my Xbox and test it for you.

Damn..... patch incoming lol I haven't updated yet

 

Yea man. I seriously can NOT get that follow up to come out at all! I can't say it could be a timing issue because that follow up requires no timing at all. Just as long as you push some time during that subaki window. Even if you subaki a late in the animation of the subaki. I'm wondering if it's an Xbox thing. DestructionBomb says it's all gravy for him. I can follow up ever single time on a high punch, but never on a low punch. I'm super curious to if it works for you. Cause I just can't do it.

 

Wow don't know what changed, but my results are the same as yours. I CANNOT get the follow up to come out after low punch Subaki.

This has to be a bug TN missed or came with the latest update.

 

I'll check it out when I get a chance, I thought it may have been a bug before the latest patch but will see.

 

That is very weird, I am on playstation by the way. That's definitely something to look at if it's on Xbox. I still find it weird though since it's the same update..unless there's other minor differences from playstation..but that wouldn't make any sense really since they both need to share the same balance update. If it doesn't come out at all then that's definitely something they should look into.

 

Has anyone even tried it on PlayStation to see if it works?

Knowing what I know about the system files, I don't see it as a high chance there'd be moveset differences in each platform.

 

I have a very hard time slow escaping too. I feel like I get at least three rotations in, but still don't come out of the stun..

And not speaking about that aspect. I have fun with this game, but sometimes it seems sloppy the way things turn out with the properties of moves and stuff. Small things like Akiras P, K not being a natural combo to attempt to punish things. Land a 2P with him to be at +1.. With so many moves that high crush/go through em. Doesn't seem like much you can do with that since a jab would be fastest attack for Akira, and all his mids would just lose to any jabs people throw out.. Game feels all over the place sometimes. Frame amd move property wise.

 

Yeah on or offline that's often how I feel when I try to understand why things work the way they do in DOA. Prior to DOA4 thoughts like this never crossed my mind.

Sometimes I feel like the devs are way more into the "yeah that looks really cool and people will like it" factor than the "yeah that's really cool and they will like it, but how do we balance this across the board".

 

D-Bomb says it works for him.

 

Yea. That, and/or they're like "f it, let it go through or dodge things to make it more user friendly so the game isn't so strict for casual players so it can still be fun for them." Kind of like in FS where if someone evades you and tries to retaliate, if you just keep swinging, you have a decent chance of hitting them first with the new hit tracking.

Some wild stuff be happening in this, lol. But I love the support TN shows the game and its fans. It seems unmatched. I just wish the game played better, hahah.