Virtua Fighter vs Dead or Alive discussion thread

The fanpage on facebook has been updated with Jackys story http://www.facebook.com/VirtuaFighterXDeadOrAlive

 

There is nothing wrong with a gay Akira.

 

Some of the things they included in the customisation options I just really can't understand. Instead of filling the selection with cool, hardcore items they just filled it with junk. Some of the sections in the customisation I just blank completely now because I know there is never anything in them worth adding.

 

Just saw this article from a thread someone created on here last year.

http://mynintendonews.com/2012/02/1...n-a-dead-or-alive-x-virtua-fighter-crossover/

 

I definitely think a crossover would work. Use VF game mechanics with DoA's stages. Danger Zones like electified walls and cliffs make the game interesting.

 

I think I use to see you on the doa3 forum on gametalk.com several years ago.

 

LOL! Very possibly! I did post under the same screen name. A lot of interesting people on that site, to say the least.

You bring up some good points. I think each series has its stronger and weaker aspects. I think you are right that VF is more of a Tournament Fighter. Though that is not to say that DoA doesn't have it's place among hardcore competitive players and pro-level tournament fighters. Believe me I've seen some competitive matches that hold their own against the likes of VF, SC, and Tekken matches! But I agree that some of the cinematic and environmental "bells and whistles" that DoA has can be a turnoff to VF fans who want a more straight-forward fighting experience.

That said, personally, my favorite series is DoA. I love VF, though too, and without it, DoA would not exist (as the original DoA used the VF fighting engine). Or at the very least, if it existed, it would be a very different game! TN paid tribute to that fact by inviting Sarah, Akira, and Pai to join the DoA cast in DoA5, even incorporating Akira and Sarah into the Story Mode. So I would love for there to be a full fledged cross-over.

I'd like to respond to some of your points about the execution end...

I would tend to agree about some of the Doa characters being flashy with some of the teleportation and other ninpo maneuvers. Obviously, the ninjas in DoA are arguably the best fighters in the DoA series. But I can still see how they would fit into the VF universe quite nicely, even if some of their "flashier moves" need to be toned down a notch or two. I'm thinking that Kasumi, my girl Ayane, and Hayabusa would need to be in. They are the trademark characters of the series. Hayabusa can have a rivalry with Kage-Maru. I would love to see that! Ayane and Eileen are both orphans so there is some possible plot to be developed from that. Plus they both have similar similar quick striking fighting styles that utilize back-flip kicks and throws where they climb-up on the shoulders of their opponents and kick them in the heads! So really they compliment each-other nicely.

Besides the ninjas the rest of the cast has more standard martial arts styles that I think would be a perfect fit in VF. Shun-Di and Brad Wong in a battle to who has the best drunken Kung-Fu! And La Mariposa and El Blaze... C'mon! It's a match made in Fighting Game Heaven!

I agree with you there. I think a fighting engine that combined elements would be ideal. Really I don't think it would be hard to reach a compromize as many of the commands for both games are actually the same aside from the counter-system that DoA utilizes, and I'd be willing to sacrifice that for a fun cross-over! Though I think the properties of many of the moves would need to be changed on both sides. DoA has a lot of single strikes that knock people across the screen, so those would probably have to me changed or incorporate similar moves for the VF characters.

There is no denying the reputation that DoA, deservedly, has. One particular Tekken fan, who's name I won't mention, said something along the lines of, DoA is the perverted uncle of fighters. Everybody acknowleges it. Nobody likes to talk about it. Even I had to laugh at that, because there is some truth to it, though it is an exaggeration. Yes the DoA girls are all smokin' hot. Yes none of them have a bra size smaller than a c-cup. And yes the deveplopers put too much time into the "physics", skimpy outfits/swimwear, and salacious camera angles. But really this is only an aspect of what the game is about. At it's heart DoA is a great fighter with some colorful characters. And for me personally, I would be just as happy without all that "adult" content in the cross-over. DoA3 and Dimensions were rated T. There's no reason why the cross-over can't have some taste in the presentation of the female DoA fighters.

 

The stuff that I posted about in the VF6 thread to make it more visually appealing can be applied in this game, I guess, but you can make a game a visual spectacle while remaining "hardcore". VF is fun for different people for different reasons. Myke mentioned his reasons but for someone like myself, it's as simple as the fact that defense is so active in this game compared to anything out there, still, after all this time.

You are always doing two things at once which makes it like virtua fighting on both sides of the sticks. No other game has this component.

 

Oooh I like the idea! I remember watching a Kasumi Vs Ayane trailer then when the match ended the familiar sound of VF continue chime + Akira's made me say "WHAT THE F@#%"?! Then you saw him retain most of his VF moves.

Maybe they can give all the DoA characters their offensive holds but just don't allow it mid combo so it acts like Akira's reversals.

DoA gets bashed by a lot of people who haven't played it. I think the offensive hold system just adds another layer of complexity to the game - you can throw/continue stun on people who like to abuse it just as you would for people who mindlessly do defensive moves in Final Showdown.

 

I like that idea. This could definitely work as some DoA characters such as Lei Fang already have reversals as alternate holds.

 

Sorry I meant defensive holds but the offensive holds could be like Wolf's catch throw.

 

I think I posted this in another thread quite some time ago, but here it is again:

I think these 2 series as a crossover is meant to be, especially since they have the same story premise:
An evil corporation hosts a fighting tournament in order to kidnap the fighters in hopes of creating the ultimate fighter.

I would love to see the following if it truly gets made:
-Choose to enable/disable holds (aka reversals for all characters). Basically a way of fighting either doa or vf style.
-Choose to limit how much access of a stage u can access as in enable/disable Ring Outs.
-Character customization.
-If no customization is featured:
-Allow multiple outfits each of them having alternate versions/color swaps for each costume slot to prevent the so called "laziness" of the developer just wasting a costume slot with a color swap version of another costume.

 

Never played DoA1 on the PS1, but watching that vid of the old game, those back-and-forth parries look real smooth instead of being the pre-programmed big throws that holds turned into starting from DoA2. They're better than Pai's parries (the 0-damage reversals). Unlike Pai's, here there's no pause in the momentum just smooth cinematic exchanges.

If DoAxVF gets made, the DoA holds definitely need to turn into these DoA1 parries, rather than say all become like Aoi's reversal holds. This way, the DoA characters' holds can still retain lenient timing, without giving them too much power to control the game.

Because Aoi's powerful but expert reversals require way too much skill for enticing DoA players to try out VF-style gameplay with DoA characters. If I was a DoA fan, I'd be up in arms if DoAxVF turned my game's holds into something "impossible to use" like Aoi's reversals.

 

Execution for this is really simple if you ask me.

Make it basically VF but with dead or alive aesthetics.

• Dynamic camera angles on almost all throws, save for the ones that look more devastating without that treatment.
• Keep ring outs but also have explosive finishes. Where as if you knocked someone off a ramp, instead knock them into an electrical generator to cause a cinematic finish.
• Multi-tiered stages
• Introduce power blows
• Introduce a seperate tag mode.
• Update classic Dead or Alive and VF stages for the game
• Build the soundtrack for the game with the best tracks from older VF/DOA's

As long as Team Ninja and AM2 come to the understanding that what Dead or Alive isnt the hold system but more the aesthetics, characters and the "power blows" than the development of the game will be something both communities will enjoy.

Because if you talk to people over at FSD and have them describe the perfect DOA game. . .their pretty much describing playing VF with Aoi.

 

You won't want that, DoA holds in the first one was performed by pressing a button (could've been two) but it stopped every attack. If you did parry, your opponent can also parry your attack. Then you can parry their attack, it can become an endless circle of parrying. With DoA2, you had to guess the level of attack - high, mid or low. Pretty much like Akira's reversals where the input to counter an elbow is the same for a knee attack. I think to keep the game like a DoA game, hey should have reversals. But just don't allow it to be done mid combo.

I think you're being a bit snobby towards DoA players. Its not like people who like DoA is incapable of playing VF. Isn't Aoi reversals performed by pressing 4+ (3 and 2 depending on type of attack?). That's one more button than how you would do a hold in DoA. Holds don't have to be done mid combo, it can be done before the start of the string too.

 

Didn't know DoA1's parries didn't have levels. Ofc levels should be part of it. The part I meant should be like DoA1 was that it caused no damage, and was quick with no pause so the pace of the game doesn't stop.
DoA2+ reversals are basically like Aoi's reversals, except 10x easier to do. It would be hard to incorporate without being too powerful or too unlike DoA.

It's not about levels or number of buttons, it's about the timing. DoA reversals have very lenient timing, so the mindgame comes from altering attack levels from strings with several different paths, or long delays between attacks in a string. What is unique for some VF characters, is the default for all DoA characters.
You try to change that by making reversals have tiny windows, like Aoi? Now what is unique about Aoi, is now default for all DoA characters. And it's hard, so it becomes high level rather than 1/3 of the basic game. Doesn't work either.
I know how lenient DoA reversal windows are. I had 2 DoA games (1 on DC, 1 on XB).

 

But anyone can learn the timing if they want... most people I've played often use it as soon as they are at a disadvantage so any mid attacks automatically get countered - a bit of a no brainer way to use it.

hmm... I agree with your point on saturating what was a unique skill to certain characters. Maybe it can act like a sabaki? So Like Jean, you have the 4++ version or you have the 236+ version - the former you can throw him. Also, some of them could act like Wolf's catch throw so as long as the move hasn't reached the "hit" frame then the throw could be successful?

I've got DoA 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and ultimate .

Something else SEGA could benefit from this is that Team Ninja usually does a good job marketing to the Western world - how many people knew DoA5 was coming as opposed to VF5FS? They want to involve the West in their games, like I feel as if the DoA5's sound track was aimed at the western audience. So if this game does happen, Team Ninja would do some awesome campaigns to help raise the awareness of VF and invite more players to try out VF! Which is always a good thing.