about frames

what are frames? and how do they work? . how do i count them is there a FAQ for this? if there is can somebody give me a link but if you know what it is can you like explain how it works?

 

1 frame = 1/60 of a second.

It's what we use to measure how long a move takes to execute and how long it takes to recover etc.

Example: Akira's takes 14 frames to execute so it takes 14/60 of a second to come out.

That's basically it.

 

and the awesome article that teaches you everything you need to know about frames

http://virtuafighter.com/view.php?section=vf4&file=vf4ft_frames_guide.html

pretty much, as said 1 frame = 1/60th of a second. the only values that *really* matter are the execution time, and the +/- frames after a hit has been blocked, hit, or counter hit.

There is however a slight importance of the duration of attack for when it whiffs or is evaded, but since it's impossible to actually determine at what time something was evaded (and therefore what the adv/disadv situation is) you just have to rely on visuals.

 

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vanity said:

and the awesome article that teaches you everything you need to know about frames

http://virtuafighter.com/view.php?section=vf4&file=vf4ft_frames_guide.html

pretty much, as said 1 frame = 1/60th of a second. the only values that *really* matter are the execution time, and the +/- frames after a hit has been blocked, hit, or counter hit.

There is however a slight importance of the duration of attack for when it whiffs or is evaded, but since it's impossible to actually determine at what time something was evaded (and therefore what the adv/disadv situation is) you just have to rely on visuals.

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so is it hard to count frames?

 

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Elite said:
1 frame = 1/60 of a second.

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Btw, anyone got an idea how this works on the PAL version of the game? I play the European version in NTSC mode, but if you play it in PAL mode; does it become 1/50th of a second or do they recalculate or .. ?

 

Don't think of it so much as counting frames... it's basically recalling the basic rates of popular moves like how much of a disadvantage that a blocked double palm creates or the advantage gained when successfully connecting a low punch... etc etc. Also, certain defensive techniques effectively work in a particular frame window like doing Throw Escape-Guard (TEG) when you are at a 8 frame disadvantage (-8).

 

You shouldn't really try to 'count the frames' in terms of watching a move and seeing how many frames it took to execute/recover etc.
You should study the 'frame data' for which ever character you use (and indeed every character, so that you know how best to punish a move), so that you already know what the frames on the move are, the moment they are executed. The best way I found of learning this, was looking at the frame data of my chosen character, and then every time a situation arises where you are thinking 'what is the best thing to do in this situation' look at the frames of all the moves involved, and make your decision based on what you find.

example

You are playing as Jacky, and your opponent is Akira.

Say your opponent does Double Palm and you guard it. Right now you are wanting to know how best to punish the move, so you look at the frame data of of Akira's Double Palm, and you will find out that it is -14 on guard. This means you want to do your most powerful move that is 14 frames or faster. Now you look at Jacky's frame data, and you will find out that the best move to use here would be the Smash Straight combo, as this combo is the most powerful one he has that take takes less than 14 frames to execute.

After doing this for a while, you should start to notice that you can remember what the best move to do in this situation, and in all other situations. This is when you will be able to automatically recognise the frames on a move as soon as you see it, and can take the best course of action without having to refer to the frame data anymore.
Just keep practicing and you will learn it as you go along.....

 

ic , thanx alot guys for the info.. and uhh one more thing can somebody tell me how to do a throw escape cause i was trying to find it in the manual it was there but it didn't say how to do it..its not in training mode either so yea what is are the commands on how to do a throw escape??is it just like recovering form a stagger or something?

 

lmao? There is plenty of resources on how to throw escape. go to training --> trial, and I'm pretty sure lessons like 10 - 16 or something are dedicated for throw escapes.

edit - and sorry if i've come off a bit harsh, but throw escapes in vf are equally essential and difficult. it takes tons of training to get multiple throw escapes down, and after you've done it in training mode, odds are you're going to go back into quest and not apply any of it.

so... practice practice practice, condition condition condition /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

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vanity said:

lmao? There is plenty of resources on how to throw escape. go to training --> trial, and I'm pretty sure lessons like 10 - 16 or something are dedicated for throw escapes.

edit - and sorry if i've come off a bit harsh, but throw escapes in vf are equally essential and difficult. it takes tons of training to get multiple throw escapes down, and after you've done it in training mode, odds are you're going to go back into quest and not apply any of it.

so... practice practice practice, condition condition condition /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

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yea it just happened to me i trained and couldn't apply any of it in quest mode , i guess my reflexes aren't that good ..... o well i m still gonna practice tho cause it wouldn't hurt if i try right?

 

Personally, I wouldn't worry about it. Throw escapes are the most advanced/difficult defensive technique to pick up, and if you're a beginner, being able to throw escape a lot isn't going to make you good at vf... you'll just be good at throw escaping. For now, just condition yourself to do floaters consistently, and different series - and your offensive game in general.

 

i have good offense but i notice i bearly have any defensive ablilties.lol..well like i can evade pretty good and block and alittle parry but i just can't escape from a throw

 

What's this "floaters" nonsense you keep going on about? There's more to the game than big moves you know.

 

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vanity said:

Personally, I wouldn't worry about it. Throw escapes are the most advanced/difficult defensive technique to pick up, and if you're a beginner, being able to throw escape a lot isn't going to make you good at vf... you'll just be good at throw escaping. For now, just condition yourself to do floaters consistently, and different series - and your offensive game in general.

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Wow, I couldn't make any sense from that incoherent babble you call a post. "UH DUR I'LL JUST THROW OUT RANDOM FLOATERS WITHOUT USING ANY DEFENSE TECHNIQUES WHATSOEVER!!!1111!SHIFT+ONE!!"

Anyways... I'd say learning how to throw escape is ESSENTIAL for a beginner... not as in like EDTEG but more of just trying to save your ass when you fall into some deep poo. I say just learn the top 2 throws of each player and the last direction of said throws... That way (without forehand knowledge of your opponent) you can at least eliminate some dangerous options your opponent has.

 

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Elite said:

What's this "floaters" nonsense you keep going on about? There's more to the game than big moves you know.

[/ QUOTE ] No, the idea behind floaters - where you hit the floater, and you carry it on with a sequence - that is essential. It's the basic idea of "doing everything for a reason". If you aren't playing a game where every move you throw out, you throw out for a purpose - knowing what it will beat of your opponent's options, you will (should) lose.

And I still disagree with throw escapes being integral for beginners, if you're just starting out the game, there's no way in hell you're going to apply it - I don't care how much you practice.

 

In principle I agree with Vanity here.

For a beginner, the importance of TE depends on what chara one is using and one's overall playstyle.

Charas focusing mainly on fast pokes or people with a machi playstyle can do pretty well without worrying too much about TE.

So when I play Jacky, overall I have to use less TE than when I play Jeffry.

Nonetheless, if you wanna get to a decent level of VF skill, you may as well start learing TE sooner rather than later.

 

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StoneColdSerb said:

In principle I agree with Vanity here.

For a beginner, the importance of TE depends on what chara one is using and one's overall playstyle.

Charas focusing mainly on fast pokes or people with a machi playstyle can do pretty well without worrying too much about TE.

So when I play Jacky, overall I have to use less TE than when I play Jeffry.

Nonetheless, if you wanna get to a decent level of VF skill, you may as well start learing TE sooner rather than later.

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i guess its not important for a begginer but i had trouble with this one 8th dan wold who kept doing that one throw where he swings you around so yea i was really gettuing annyoed by that thats why i started to wonder how to leearn throw escapes so yea

 

I play Vanessa and i dont use TEs /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

As mentioned before, it does not hurt to learn TE sooner rather than later.

Having said that, if you find yourself getting thrown a lot, even by the lower AI ranks, you may want to think about WHY you are getting thrown, i.e. what situations you end up which enable your opponent to throw you.

Obviously, when you throw out moves which guarantee your opponent a throw if he blocks them, then it's useful to combine them with the necessary defensive techniques, including TE (btw, there's a really useful TE guide by Drift++ in the VF4 documents section om this site)

Nonetheless, outside of throw guaranteed situations, you have a lot of other options to help you not get thrown. Stay mobile, use crouch dashes, back dashes, poke and use your character's big lauchers to punish your opponent should they attempt to throw you in a not-guaranteed situation.

When I was mainly playing Quest mode, I remember bringing several charas to Champion rank without ever really bothering about TE. (But I don't encourage you to do the same, as you will have to learn TE eventually.)

 

Just wondering.. Why does Jeff's uf+K+G beat rising attacks? Damage is 20, so it's kinda strange.. Always thought 21 dmg minimum is requirement for that. When you time it correctly, it gives MC. Is there some frames when even 20 dmg moves can beat rising attacks? I've tried it with other 20 dmg moves, such as DE & SDE, but haven't succeeded..