Anyone wanna help out a scrub?

Discussion in 'The Vault' started by Guest, Jul 9, 2001.

  1. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Well, you know. I know a decent amount of combos and such, but I hardly know how to use them. I'm looking to play as Kage or Aoi, so any faqs or anything I should start with? Any help appreciated. Thanks.
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Well, until VFDC is up and running again, you'll probably want to go to vfzone.com. You'll find all the FAQs and guides you'll ever need, as well as a few surprises.

    There's a few other VF websites that I can't remember right now, but you're in good hands here. Other than that, all anyone can suggest is that you find some good joysticks, a few friends (forget the computer), and play, play, play.

    Daniel Thomas
     
  3. Chanchai

    Chanchai Well-Known Member

    Well, I'm assuming you're asking for help on VF3tb (which I think is cool).

    If you can find a way to get a grasp on how the game flows, "how it's played" (or at least the logical order and branches of things), and experiment quite a bit with your character.... I honestly think you can train on the computer. In fact, I'm stuck training against the computer almost all the time and hardly get to play people. Not that I'm that good or anything, I have a long way to go, but I think that if you can "think realistically" in terms of what is applicable in the game, and control yourself to fight against the computer on solid ground, emphasizing good habits and realistic advantages, you can at least get a lot better while practicing with just a CPU opponent.

    Unfortunately, there are things that usually come from only experience, but there are many examples of players who have been training in their lonesome or with one sparring partner, and are capable of handling some of the best players in the traveling VFer-US at least (from my understanding, Sumeragi comes to mind).

    As far as VF3tb is concerned, learn how to block, learn how to follow up a good defense with a good offense (counter), figure out what works and what doesn't (be "realistic" when you fight the computer, you should know when something will not always work on a human). Learn the places where mid attacks, low attacks, and throws will be a good idea.

    Sigh... giving out very general advice is pretty tough... email me if you think I could possibly help you and if you want that. Hopefully I'll have the time to write a response (I warn you, I tend to write emails that are even larger than my posts).

    -Chanchai
     
  4. Mr. Bungle

    Mr. Bungle Well-Known Member

    <A target="_blank" HREF=http://world.std.com/~opus/vf3tb_kage_guide_(rsw).txt>http://world.std.com/~opus/vf3tb_kage_guide_(rsw).txt</A> might help...
     
  5. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Oh, yes, I finally remembered this one after an eternity of searching. It's my favorite VF3 site after VFDC (of course).

    www.krisamico.com/vf3

    This is an old site dedicated to Virtua Fighter 3 strategy and techniques that has been an invaluable source of help. Kris, who sadly no longer follows VF (but kept the site up), offers numerous techniques with all the characters, and specific examples of his ideas, with loads of photos showing every step of the way. If you want a glimpse of the immense depth of gameplay that the VF series offers, this is the perfect place to look.

    Keep in touch with how you're progressing, okay?
     
  6. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Hey, thanks everyone. I got some friends that like fighting games, but the main problem is they are Namco/Capcom/SNK fanatics. Not that there's anything WRONG with that (I like Soul Calibur, love Capcom and SNK), but it'll be hard trying to get them into VF3TB. Until then, I'll just mess with the computer.

    Oh, and yes, I'm talking about VF3TB for the Dreamcast. Heh, there probably isn't a single VF machine (of any VF) within a half hour long drive from here.

    Anyway, thanks for the advice. I'll have to experiment with both Kage and Aoi for some time before I'll make a decision, but right now I'm leaning toward Aoi.
     
  7. Guest

    Guest Guest

    This is some advice I'll end up taking as well. Every so often, I learn a whole lot about VF3tb. Of course, the main issue is to be competitive, I still have to learn a bucketload. Recently, I've been learning a lot more about how to play it effectively. Surprisingly, I've been doing the same thing as proposed here. Playing against the computer realistically. A big thing I had to learn is that you must be very careful not to attempt to go off-the-wall and try to land long combo strings. You'll get pounded for that. VF3TB made me want to do that for a while. But it also is the Capcom/SNK/Namco experience that got me into that groove. Those games have lots of easy to see opportunities to simply rush in and combo away. Ok, maybe not on a Vs. level, but far beyond what VF opponents may let you get away with. Even the computer shows one the error of that type of thinking. The way Master Counters are handled and such here silence any spastic aggression, in a hurry. So though I consider myself a lower skill player, in the game; I tend to agree that even the computer doesn't do a bad job of keeping your mind thinking on a realistic level.

    Needless to say, I'm definitely going to read all that I can read. I've recently bought a joystick controller. Funny enough, now that I have one, I'm completely hooked on VF3TB. The joystick makes all the difference in making the game a much more fun experience. It's almost as drastic as playing Virtual On with Twin Sticks as opposed to a standard controller. I've taken a liking to Akira, and I really want to learn to be at least intermediate with Aoi. Anyway, I've been reading every strategy faq on Akira I can get my hands on. Problem is, many that I read are move lists with individual moves mentioned, but they completely don't seem to give me many pointers about good effective pressure and defensive strategies with him. Of course, It could be that I've just been reading the wrong ones. I'll probably be a big question ask, here. So don't hate me if I ask about something many people think should be common knowledge. The amount of real live people; in my area, that know anything about VF is almost nil. It's hard enough to even find good local Daytona players.
     
  8. Chanchai

    Chanchai Well-Known Member

    Quotes on flow (or something like that)...

    Here's what I think is good to understand or even just read (if you already understand even). These say essentially the same thing, but are quoted from two different sources. It regards the flow of VF3 (and you will notice that flowcharts, if you read them, are generally constructed in this way).

    First quote comes from Rich Williams' recently released Kage Faq (a most excellent faq imo). On a sidenote, this is written in his thoughts on flowcharts and keeping the initiative (Rich has a "distaste" for flowcharts, essentially he writes what you generally need to understand about them):

    "...They are all almost exactly the same on a certain level, and follow the basic principals in VF: throw or low attack if the opponent stands or dodges; attack mid if the opponent crouches; guard, dodge or execute a quick move if you expect an attack from the opponent...and so on. "

    Following is basically the same thing, a bit more into detail and also covers initiative (who gets to attack who--theoretically of course). It was written by Hiro back in October as advice to Cause and a big reminder to me (who just learned and forgot it at that time).

    "What one should know is how the game is made.
    1.The use of throws and middle level attacks; When you see the opp standing, grab him. If he is crouching, throw a middle level attack.
    (Low level attacks can be used instead of throws. Of course, it is not true, since throws come out instantaneously whereas low level attacks don't.)

    2.Flow of the game; one has to know whether it is his turn to attack or not. At the beginning of each round, two are even. But, when your move is defended, it is the opp's turn to attack you, not your turn to attack him. Conversely, when you defend, the opp's move, it is your turn to attack him. (Sometimes, you are in a case where it is guaranteed that you can grab him, etc.) At this point, one can learn how to defend well after your move is defended. (Since you know the opp will attack you, you should try to defend.) The word "defend" used here is not necessarily just to press G, but it includes d G, b E, and throw escapes as well. (of course there are more.)
    Also, you can teach the person why P or d P is sometimes effective as a leading jab. After P or d P hits the opp, your have an advantage of 1(?) fr (never mind the exact figures here.) It means you can keep attacking. Even if it is defended, you have only a disadvantage of a few frames. Thus, you can choose to attack or defend here. Note that since the opp is hit by P or d P, he sometimes hesitates to attack back right away. Since 1 frames is only one over sixtieth second, in some sense you still have an adavantage.
    Here, one can learn what is guaranteed to do after defending the opp's move. Don't need to know all of them. Only the major ones: knee, Jacky's elbow-spin-kick, etc.
    "

    Anyways, as far as I know, this stuff is common knowledge to seasoned players (and probably also martial arts serial novel readers/versus/images/icons/tongue.gif, they tend to go on about the concepts of countering as far as I know). However, maybe it's become too much of common knowledge enough to be neglected? Neglected enough that hardly anyone explains it directly in general? Anyways, it is easily overlooked in places where people somehow win against scrubby competition that don't think things through, supplying fuel for a longterm bad habit.... Well, you might want to read the above quotes a few times every once in awhile if you don't think you fully understand them yet. They are a part of playing "realistically" against a CPU or even a scrubby opponent that exposes the same weakness all the time. Better to train solid than to train in the "imbred" style (hammering solely on a local weakness which will probably not occur anywhere else, exposing patterns that are probably exclusive to your local competition, things like that). Anyways, I hope this stuff helps you guys out. Enjoy/versus/images/icons/smile.gif

    -Chanchai
     
  9. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Erm, just wondering, what kind of joystick should I get? I've been looking for a decent one. All I have that comes close is an ASCII fighting pad. Then again, I could always go the insane route and turn my now-broken Saturn Analog pad into a decent joystick using some instructions. After i make it, I could use it with the Saturn-DC controller adapter I'm getting soon (mainly because I just got a pair of Saturn Twin Sticks that I want to use with VOOT).
     
  10. ghostdog

    ghostdog Well-Known Member

    The amount of real live people; in my area, that know anything about VF is almost nil. It's hard enough to even find good local Daytona players.

    Daytona?!! I live in Jacksonville. Maybe we could hook up for a coupla sessions? Lemme know something!


    -<font color=white>Ghost</font color=white><font color=blue>DOG</font color=blue>
     
  11. Hayai_JiJi

    Hayai_JiJi Well-Known Member

    The SEGA arcade sticks should be your first choice but are insanely hard to find. MAS sticks are my personal preference as you can get one for every game system out there and they are very close to American arcade controls.

    Under the surface of the most jaded cynic lies a dissappointed idealist- George Carlin
     
  12. ghostdog

    ghostdog Well-Known Member

    Try eBay. I got an Agetec arcade stick from ebay.com for about $49 (s&h abt $6).
    Ebay also has a couple of VOOT twin sticks, but they cost more.


    -<font color=white>Ghost</font color=white><font color=blue>DOG</font color=blue>
     
  13. Guest

    Guest Guest

    the sega arcade stick is awesome fro dc. hardcoregaing still has only Lion Vf3 FAQ which has tips from ICE-9, HIRO, BigCat, Jason and others... beware its links almost all go to porno sites now though.
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Well, the Enforcers by TopMax is a good and cheap way to go. Just make sure you test them out when you get them home. Some places seem to sell non-fully functional Arcade sticks(regardless of who makes them). Perhaps due to poor shipping quality. The best thing about them is that they are often found for 20-25 dollars. Yep, the price of either a 3rd party or Sega brand Dreamcast Controller. The reason they are so cheap is that many stores are trying to get rid of their existing stock of DC arcade sticks, so they group them all under 1 cheap selling SKU number. They are also the easiest arcade sticks to find, as they seem to be the only ones, lying around in stores, these days. Make no mistake, the controller quality is very high, if the color choice isn't the best. The plastic coating hides the fact that all the important parts are made with good strong metal. My only controller caveat would be that they are a little light for my tastes. They rate very high in durability and comfort. Probably the best comfort if using your lap. If not, then that factor isn't important. It has a useless rumble feature built-in, and a fairly useless button turbo feature. The stick is using the all-familiar Microswitch technology. The one that clicks. The stick feels a bit looser than the Sega one.

    However, making your on arcade stick is really the best way to go. You can use the best parts, and the best parts are even dirt cheap. You won't save any money, since you have to buy some controller to make it.; but you can make it so that the arcade stick outlives you. One of my reasons for getting the Topmax Enforcer sticks is that I plan to use them as an easier way to make arcade sticks(not to mention they weren't any more expensive than the controllers themselves). Standard controllers are a bit harder to soldier, due to their size and complexity. However, you do gain one advantage of using the circuit board from a controller. You can make an arcade stick compatible with games that weren't made compatible with the arcade sticks. Not that you would expect to run into any non-arcade stick using game you would want to use arcade sticks with. Stuff like RPGs and Analogue games.
     
  15. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Hmm. I game for Daytona. We should figure a time to meet.
     
  16. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Heh, well, I seem to have lost the instructions for building one... Could someone give me a link? Thanks. I figure I'll go with building one from my broken Saturn 3D pad (the analog is a little off and the R trigger doesn't work).
     
  17. ghostdog

    ghostdog Well-Known Member

    Anytime during the weekend is fine.
    Next weekend, or any other after that.
    Actually, the earlier, the better (late morning, noon?).
    Send me a private msg. Go to user list, find and click <font color=orange>ghostdog</font color=orange> for user profile. Look to the bottom of the page.


    -<font color=white>Ghost</font color=white></font color=blue>DOG</font color=blue>
     
  18. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

    PSN:
    Myke623
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    Myke623
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    Tip of the day: Clickable usernames will take you directly to that user's profile. So there's no need to go searching through the user list if you know exactly who you want; just find a post of theirs, click on their username, et voila.
     
  19. Guest

    Guest Guest

    At the start of the each round, both players are at a neutral position, neither
    having any advantage over the other player. Once the fight starts however,
    there WILL always be ONE who has the advantage. A simple example:Lion attacks,
    and the opponent successfully guards ( blocks ) it, then he has the advantage.
    Even if both of you are using the same character, and both of you execute the
    same move at the same time, his move will hit you, and yours would not hit.
    When your move has been guarded , it may not necessarily be a good idea to keep
    attacking. Sometimes, it may be necessary for you to go from offensive to
    defensive instead. Lion’s choices here are guard, escape or ungrab(throw
    reversal).


    Once the opponent has the advantage, you would have to guess at what he will
    do. If you think he is going to use a middle level attack, then defend against
    it. Once it is blocked, then the advantage is yours since it would be your turn
    to attack. If you think he is going to use a low level attack, do the same
    thing. Crouch and defend. If you think that he is going for a throw, then use
    an attack. By attacking, you cannot be grabbed. So you should not go trying to
    throw an opponent who is attacking you with a frenzy. Finally, if you think
    that he is going to use a slow attack, then you should use a quick attack such
    as a punch or elbow to cut it. These are the usual cases,there are exceptions,
    such as a punch or (d/f+P) which can maintain your turn and interupt a throw
    attempt. Be sure to read the fuzzy guard section to learn another throw
    interrupt tactic that is important.

    found this in vfzone
     
  20. Hayai_JiJi

    Hayai_JiJi Well-Known Member

    I believe that is from nycat's VF3 Lion FAQ just to give credit where its due.

    Under the surface of the most jaded cynic lies a dissappointed idealist- George Carlin
     

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