Application of Wolf's ROAR/RAW stance

The Raw stance has the ability to Sabaki:

High Punches
Mid Punches
High Elbows
Mid Elbows

Raw stance will not Sabaki:

Knock-down class attacks of these above listed classes
Charged variants of the above classes also
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No matter what you (succesfully) Sabaki, you have four options from that point on (five if you count standing neutral, but that in strongly not recommended). These options are:

-P+K+G (Sabaki) P

This move will hit for 20 damage on a normal hit, and has the ability to give you enough frame initiative (+8), to attempt a gaurenteed throw. The way to get the maximum frame advantage from the move is to land it with an MC. From there, it is just like Jacky's Pak Sao options, you can throw or attack, the advantage that Wolf has, is that he has much higher damaging throws, and the surprise exchange throw (db+P+G) which is a highly useful tool near ring edges and walls. Some notes to take about throwing, is that you cannot hesitate, and if you plan on using, either dfdf+P+G or the Giant Swing, you need to buffer in the CD input of the throw relatively fast, and the Giant Swing, must be the 100 damage variation (If I remember correctly, there is a replay on the Evo disc, of BunBun Maru using the GS after RAW P MC, when he is facing Kurita). A drawback to using the P follow up, is that it can lose to attack series, or moves that are faster than it, because the actual p follow up is not guarenteed. On a normal hit however, you should sometimes consider throwing, because you will still be at an advantage, and if the opponent evades, they will lose to throw, you can also delay a striking attack, ideally the Toe Kick Stunner, and it will connect if properly timed. Keep in mind, this follow up also hits at the high level, meaning the opponent has the ability to duck under the move, and counter-attack from there.

-P+K+G (Sabaki) K

This is a low kick, and it similar to Wolf's standing Low Drop Kick. On a normal hit (remember this is low, so the opponent cannot high guard the attack, they must crouch and guard it) the move will stagger the opponent, but because Wolf is recovering from the attack, it is hard to press the initiative from this move on normal hit, what you really want is an MC hit. On an MC hit, you have the same potential for combos for Wolf's normal Low Drop Kick. Depending on what attack series the opponent is using, the kick might not hit, the optimal condition you are aiming for is, if you expect your opponent to use a series that has high attacks in it, which the move will interupt for an MC.

P+K+G (Sabaki) P+G

This is the catch throw follow up, and is an extremely useful tool of the stance. Most attacks of PPP style series are going to take lower priority than the catch throw, meaning that you have a high potential to connect with the catch (the catch throw will also succede if the opponent high guards). Once you succesfully connect with the catch throw, you have the exact same options as the normal catch throw. So it is basically choosing which direction to input, based upon factors of the match (and which direction you think your opponent will input).

P+K+G (Sabaki) P+K+G

This is the most (if ever) underused follow to the RAW stance, for several reasons. First of all, it has no (direct) damage potential to it. Second of all, if the opponent discontinues (or doesn't start) their attack series, you are presented with basically 50 odd frames of recovery, which is terrible. The only (potential) use I have found for this option, is that if the opponet's attack series has moves that potentially defeat the other possible follow ups from the stance, you can perform another RAW stance, and sabaki the next hit in their attack series, until you think you have a sufficient (or safe) enough oppening to attempt another follow up than P+K+G.
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RAW follow ups are really character dependant, becuase you can expect a Jacky, Lau, Vanessa, Kage type player to use their PPP style attack series, rather than a Goh or Akira player.

Also, some characters present ideal openings for using the raw stance, such as Lau players who love moving in with the lunging knife, or elbow festivals, or Akira players who cannot lay off those high p's, Kage players who use df+p and elbow, ppb+p etc. Don't expect Sarah, Pai, or Lei to use to many things that can be Sabakied (sp) with the Raw stance.

Keep in mind that a Raw that is openly attempted against no attack, is counterable by basically every move (?) and throw interuptable (?).
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When to use Raw:

Basically, when you are at a small disadvantage, and you expect that your opponent will attempt a class that is appropriate to be Sabakied (sp) with Raw, then you should attempt it (remeber that you can buffer in potential throw escape commands during the initial Raw stances execution).

If the opponent is prone to using moves that Raw works against, you should attempt to use Raw against them appropriately. Like mentioned above, DE, pp,f+p Akira players, lunging knife Lau's, f+p Jacky players, if your yomi is good enough, you can usually catch the opponent with a Raw sabaki.
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When to (almost) never use the Raw stance:

when you have the advantage, especially a considerable one, don't use Raw. The purpose of Raw is to regain the initiative, by taking advantage of your opponent attempting a class attack that Raw can sabaki. However, if you have the advantage already, it is unnecessary to waste frames on Raw stance, especially when you have much better options. Also, if you are at an advantage, and you perform Raw stance, if the opponent is high guarding, evading (or evade attacking), or using ARE , you are setting yourself up to lose the initiative. When you have the advantage, you should really be concerned with pushing any Nitaku advantage you can impose onto your opponent, enfore a hit or throw game, don't waste the advantage on Raw stance.

At long distances, well obviously you need to be in range to Sabaki the attacks, but don't shun this off as 'obvious' information, because it doesn't take that much of a range difference between an attack hitting you, or you getting the Sabaki. Learning to judge distance (for applying it to using Raw) if essential, so be aware when your opponent is at a longer range, and moves in for a lunging knife, don't go into stance immediately, make sure he is in proper range to get the Sabaki.
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Your turn, questions, comments, concerns, etc.

 

You're forgetting a very useful situation to use RAW. That is after you block the first attack of a series. For example, Lau's ,. You can input RAW right after you block . This is very useful and not as risky imo as doing it as a yomi device. (Although in effect doing moves of this sort requires guessing, but interrupting predictable attack series imo is "safer".

Also, RAW follow ups are not really sabaki attacks, this is evident from the fact that wolf can be interrupted when doing the RAW followup attacks. The follow ups have the same execution speed as their normal counterpart. Just that doing it from RAW will normally always get you a mC or MC hit since it is executed while the opponent is still executing the move that is canceled by RAW.

/versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

Yah I guess I kinda indirectly mentioned it, but never really came out and said it, my bad. Of course if you expect that a player is going to continue an attack series, such as PPP , or Lau's elbow palm series, you could use Raw. Of course you have to take into account that if the opponent decides not to follow up with the second attack of the canned combo, that you are put at a serious disadvantage (only if you attempt the Raw stance). I am sure that players will 'fall' for this, but once they adapt, and mix up their canned combo series (that have Raw applicable moves in them) you must also (adapt), and the Yomi cycle begins (again).

This complicates things too, as some attack series, similar to the one you mentioned (but not the exact same) will actually beat many of Raw's follow up options, so you have to be wary of those as well. Like if a Jacky player throws out p, he has several options to follow that up (including discontinuing the series), some of those options contain attacks under classes that cannot be Sabakied by Raw stance, so watch out for those as well.
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Pfft, I use that series all the time, how'd I miss it?Timmah! But thanks very much, I appreciate it, that was the kind of response I was looking for, thanks.

 

wow, thx. one comment that i'll add is that IMHNoobieO, RAW has very similar applications as Goh's P+K sabaki/inashi. and i've personally been using it pretty much the same way.

 

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RAW has very similar applications as Goh's P+K sabaki/inashi. and i've personally been using it pretty much the same way.

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Yes, they are very similar, anyone else notice the (bizzare) coincidence, at least from I can tell, that many Wolf users will use Goh as their secondary. Or am I imaging things as well?
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I am not sure if this was ever mentioned on VFDC, so.... I was playing Quest using Wolf today, and I was facing an Akira player. He threw out p+k+g, to which I used the Raw stance, I am not sure what input I used after it, probably either p+g or p, but he continued with the hit-throw animations, and successfully landed them both, but the damage meter only counted the last 2 hits of the SpoD, or at least that's what the life bar showed. I will try to recreate the event again, and also experiment around with hit-throws vs Raw, but have you ever seen this or anything like it?

 

well IMHO i consider that to be something normal, because to be quite honest, i don't take RAW as being sabaki class, sabaki ALWAYS interrupts any follow ups to the move that was just sabaki'ed, on the other hand, RAW does not, what i think is that RAW is just a move that negates damage to wolf, but is considered as taking the hit anyways, that is why charged moves and knockdown hits will screw RAW over (wich btw does NOT happen with regular sabaki)..

if you consider what i've just said, it makes perfect sense that even SPOD can be continued after wolf negating the damage to the first hit