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At what point does a throw or launcher become guaranteed?

Discussion in 'Dojo' started by DigitlSamurai, Sep 1, 2013.

  1. DigitlSamurai

    DigitlSamurai Well-Known Member

    PSN:
    DigitlSamurai
    XBL:
    DgtlSamurai KOF
    How much of a frame disadvantage does my opponent have to be at?
     
  2. WiZzYx

    WiZzYx Well-Known Member

    PSN:
    WiZzYx3DG
    XBL:
    WiZzYx3DG
    An attack -11 on block? :p
     
  3. DigitlSamurai

    DigitlSamurai Well-Known Member

    PSN:
    DigitlSamurai
    XBL:
    DgtlSamurai KOF
    What about a guaranteed launcher? -11 only guarantees a throw.
     
  4. Mister

    Mister Well-Known Member Content Manager Wolf Content Manager Sarah Content Manager Aoi

    -10 Throw attempt will connects as punishment, but your opponent can still input the right escape

    -11 garantes [P][K] for characters like Eileen, Pai, Kage and Lion (they have a 11F punch).

    -12 garantees a [P][K] for everyone else (besides taka who will punish you with [P][P][P] ?!?!)

    -13 read above plus some characters have 13f exectution moves that are good for punishment too (like kage's [4][P][K] )

    -14 usually an elbow class hit will do the job.

    -15 from here many characters starts to have really fun, because it's not uncommon to have 15f combo starters (Wolf has [4][P] for example).

    I can go on with the list, but the fastest way to know what you want to know is going to the command list section of the character you want to punish, list them for how much they leave your opponent on block and just read if the values is equal or major to the move you wanna use to punish him.

    I know you use jacky, and jacky and you want to land The High Angle Upper Kick [6][K] which is 17f execution, just look for moves that are -17 or more on guard.

    This is for punishing things ON BLOCK

    there's also a chance to punish things after a dodge; for example if you dodge a really slow move you can try to punish first with [P][K]. If that lands 100% of the time, you can then try to punish that move with something that is 14f exectution (for jacky [6][P][K]). Then if that lands move on to a slower move, if not keep with that.

    And last you can also punish on whiff. Let's say your opponent use an high move when you'r crouched. There's a chance that, if you react fast enough, you may punish that whiffed attack. This applies a lot with Jacky and @Pana will confirmi it. Repeat the process i listed before and try to find what moves is the best punisher for every move that whiffs.

    I also thing that we can deduce if a move is punishable or not by the total frames has, but punishing requires also reflexes, otherwise you'll waste time.
     
    MarlyJay and DigitlSamurai like this.
  5. Tricky

    Tricky "9000; Eileen Flow Dojoer" Content Manager Eileen

    Myke likes this.
  6. Manjimaru

    Manjimaru Grumpy old man

    PSN:
    manjimaruFI
    XBL:
    freedfrmtheReal
    The fastest launchers that launch on recovery counter (as a punish) tend to be around 14 frames fast and high. Examples: Akira, Goh, Lau 46P. Not all characters have such fast launchers though.

    The fastest mid-hitting launchers that launch on recovery hit (punishing a move that recovers crouching) tend to be around 16 frames fast. Examples Sarah serpent cannon (2P+KK), Jacky beat knuckle (P+KP), Lei 9K+G etc. Not all characters have such. So as far as the fastest and best punishes go, it depends on character you are playing. Pretty much everyone has a 17-18 frame midhitting normal hit launcher though. All except.. Kage and Lion I think? Not sure about Aoi.
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2013
    Mister likes this.
  7. kingo

    kingo My bitch G0d3L is a scrub Content Manager Aoi

    PSN:
    kingofvf5
    XBL:
    kingofvf4
    Yes, Aoi has 2 mid normal hit launchers 66K and 33P+K, 18 exe. but requires perfect buffering to work at -18.
     

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