Dealing with linny at the start of the round

I just got back from perhaps my longest VF session so far here in the land of the rising sun. There was some dude with a 10th dan leifei, sarah, and kage as well as 8th dan jacky. At first he destroyed me pretty bad but I started to get used to him and what he would do.

His Sarah gave me the most problems. He had really good movement and would almost always start the roudn off with a backdash or a linny. (linny = backdash -> dodge -> crouchdash). It got kind of annoying because it limited to what I could do at the beginning of the round. I play Shun and his b+p, while great for dealing with dodgers, was out of range. I tried waiting to attack with a mid while he crouched dashed back in but he would normally fuzzy guard it. During the match it wasn't that big of a problem because he didn't have the distance and if he tried to linny after a tech roll a b+p would hit even after the backdash. But at the start of the round it became kind of annoying, especially because I'm working to be more offensive but with him doing that the safest thing I could do was either backdash or sit there and block. I tried waiting until after the dodge for either a mid or throw on my part but neither seemed particuarly effective. Any comments?

 

Sometimes you can just dash forward and throw.

 

could you drink in his face and not even make him want to give you time like that? also what about shun's new + (i think thats it) where he can either do the leaping backfist attack which crumples or the low double foot sweep, that wouldn't be a bad start and the backfist could catch him dashing back in from a backdash or the kic variant could get him if he comes right in.

 

If you said "I'm going to attack at the begining of every round", maybe he caught on and started doing this... Seriously maybe you should just backdash and drink... or at least backdash... you arn't going to be able to hit every opponent at the begining of every match, but you also arn't going to be able to backdash and drink saftely at the begining of every match...

if you could CD 270 on sticks maybe that would be good too... or maybe cd attack, or forward dash attack?

-Alex

 

Just a thought, i think this is basically how to deal with fuzzy guard.

Backdash ECD is hard to catch, so be aggressive against it most of the time is not recommended imho. SuperG's idea of drinking is good since if he is doing it all the time, might as well make him pay for it. But, i think you can try FD, d/bKK sometimes, cuz if he do Backdash ECD all the time, the key thing here is that he fuzzy guard with the CD, if you try FD and throw, the timing window to catch him is prolly too small to be reliable. Delay throw is an option, though again the timing will depend on your opnt, and is about as risky as d/b KK (depend on the oppt, i wouldn't fall after this, might as well do E-TEs...).

If he is blocking your d/b KK, then you are being yomied completely, since the motion of d/b kk and u+KG is hard to "see and block" by reflex, if he blocks d/b KK (i doubt most ppl would do that on 1st try though... i would eat that instead of u+KG), he can't block u+KG (for most human anyway... i think...)

anyway you prolly know all this alrdy, i think the key is you are just dealing with a fuzzy guard situation. Of course it all depend on your personality/style, imho i wouldn't go aggressive on it (fuzzy guard is design to deal with aggressive/fast oppt reaction)

 

You could also try u/f+++ and see if you can surprise him for a throw or side kick, chowan, or mule kick. A simple drink is also a good recomendation...I am sure he does not want to see you turn into a bing cherry too quickly.

 

Thanks for the help. I was a bit overwhelmed at the beginning because any attack I seemed to do either got dodged or I ate a d/f,d/f+k at the beginning of the round. It really seemed like, at least against him, being defensive at the beginning of the round was the best option.

And another question, what is the exact input to do a linny? is it b,b->u|d->d/f,d/f? If I started to use it myself then I'd have a better understanding of what it is and how to beat it. Thanks!

 

This is my fight fire with fire against boring-ass play maneuver, and also works like a charm with what you mentioned.

The input is a bit tricky at first, but you'll catch on:

++->wait

BTW -- did you get those pics of that showcase I wanted?

 

Haha sounds like me playing Shou's sarah --- a few things I learned from him

-Sarah's df df k launcher is mid weight p counterable (i mispoke before).. so maybe p throw, throw, pk, who knows

-Sarah's bulldog throw evades linear attacks, so either duck that or attack with b+p or something (i would sometimes yomi the throw and go for df+ppp YEAH but would get thrown by that one anyway)

-Shou's machi tatics involved getting in the lead, dancing around until you whiffed an attack and then hitting df df k for a big ass stance specific combo... it's not like you have to beat the lenny at the beginning of the match - if the person you are playing against is a turtle, turtle back... shun is perfect for that too, because he can drink no matter how far away he is from the opponent... anyway I found I did better against Shou if i was just patient...

-Alex

 

d/b+p+k+g - sounds exciting! Seriously, that's what it felt like. During the match there were times when we'd just both be there blocking.

Supergolden has the right idea - that's exactly what it would be like. Make a mistake and eat a dragon cannon combo of death. He didn't do anything fancy really. Just safe canned combos he could stop half way to poke or throw. I did learn alot though playing him and am better off for it, although playing his other characters were a lot more fun since they weren't so annoying.

 

Yeah, well, unfortunately this is the way a lot of people play. Sometimes, I've played people that will literally DASH back a few steps at the first of every match. I eventually just stand there or start drinking from the first of the match. That is one good thing w/ Shun -- you can sucker people into actually coming after you by taking swigs. The main reason I like him, b/c I hate boring matches, and backdashing at the first of every round (or doing the exact same thing of anything at the first of every ) is just boring.

 

I didn't have enough time to read other answers so I don't know is this old thing but one way to start a round is to do and throw! Sometimes throw is risky so remember to change your tactic. Doing full spinning move instead of throw is also good if your opponent likes to use evading throw escape-guard.

 

i would try one of several things. first, a good old / into throw would stop his pretty dancing ass right quick. drinking is also a great option. if your drinks permit, start the round with HCF (to sit) and bust out (you can always fall by pressing at the end of that). sarah can be quite a bitch against shun, as so many of his moves have very shitty recovery. try sucking him in with a drink, or a simple when youve already trained him to suspect a , as youd be surprised how many times they get a big hard on and wanna come in and SMACK your spinning drunk old ass. fight fire with fire my friend. and oh yeah, if you can dodge his , throw in a quick chowan and bust his shit up....sarah floats real high.