Drinking Academy

At Last! A complete drinking resource for Shun in Final Showdown! Stuff this thread covers can and WILL be part of VF wiki project too! (Shun specifics) I'll try to compile stuff here too in a readable fashion (first post).

As you may know, Shun gains more moves and power by added drinks so it's imperative to know how to drink and when. Lots of threads (and move list on top of the page of course) already have covered different aspects of Shun's drinking system but no single über resource has seen light yet. Put ALL drinking related stuff here, please!

Things that will be covered will be at least:

- drinking moves themselves and their attributes
- moves and situations when specific drinking moves are preferable/guaranteed during a round (and which are not)
- after round drinking (very important!)
- self-sobering moves and their uses
- combo and wall mechanics and how they work in relationship with drinking
- specific versus character drinking and booze preserving strategies (those pesky sobering moves and COMBOS!!!)
- post your own drinking tips HERE!


I'll try to wrap some of those things up myself too but everything is open to questions, erratums and contributions ! Let's get (really) wasted !

EDIT: The thread is now sticky as well, simply because what is stickier for Shun than his drinking game?

 

Good stuff, I like the idea of this thread.

I thought I'd write a quick summary of drink sacrifice/self sobering moves. Won't be anything new to experienced players but might give some insight to newbies as to why you would sacrifice your hard earned intoxication.

:

Seemingly not that great a move, but put in perspective it's got strong stats. Full circular mids are usually at least punch counterable (think Jacky's , or Lion's ) as your opponent is pretty much limited to only a standing guard as a defensive option. This circular however is only -7, making it reasonably safe. The attack knocks down the opponent towards Shun's back, which you can also take advantage of if angled near a wall/ring edge.

:

For a move that floats this is pretty ridiculous - 17 frame exe is fast enough to use straight from a counter or elbow, and on guard you'll gain an advantage of +4!

, :

It's rare in VF for a low attack to launch for a combo - It's even rarer that such an attack isn't counterable on guard. Try to hit-check the first kick, if it's blocked stop the string to avoid the vulnerability of the followup high kick, and losing another 3 DP.

 

Back off and start doing 6P+K+G, opponent will be too scared to approach in fear of the followups and you get free drinks. Online certified!

 

Here are the Shun DP gaining moves with some analysis:


Gyou'inshu (+1 DP)

- 50 total frames and no add-ons so it's a sitting duck in close range but simple and perfectly usable during stuns, knockdowns, wall stuns, far away etc. Remember to do this always when possible, no excuses.




Kasen Gyou'in aka KG (+1 DP)

- a move that's designed for close range and mid string drinking. This is actually a stance that has evasive properties (crouches under high class attacks) and has three possible follow ups in addition to always getting that lovely 1 DP. Refer to stances thread for more information on the moves and strings that allow for KG and about it's follow ups:
http://virtuafighter.com/threads/shun-special-stances-strategy.16363/#post-330486

- it's evasive properties basically mean it ducks under high attacks during it's drinking animation, allowing possibly for instant retaliation. Do not try against PPP strings and such, as Shun gets hit then. Ducking standing with it doesn't allow for Kasen to hit but it's only -3 and has some pushback. Kasen (on block -8) is his old evade attack, full circular high and and launches on NH. Lastly, Kasen is a block break for +10, use against yutori (turtle blocking). For more info check the link above.

- for strictly drinking purposes, it's important to note that adds 1 DP slightly faster than . This may be good to know for squeezing that one final after round drink after some slow recovering KO moves.


- , (+1 DP) is a certified combo ender after some combos (without eating too much of Shun's combo dmg) which switches to KG just for that 1 DP in exchange of the last of the string. This is generally the most common way to drink during combos (other than the dead obvious flop launcher -> ). Use it for squeezing out those singular DPs for threshold DP numbers in certain combos (for 4, 6, 8, 10 DP generally).




Gyou'in Haishu to BT Soukokukyu (DP +2)
, cancels action, enters Soukokukyu (SOU), and automatically drinks (DP +2) unless you do a move

- this one is a weird one in many ways. For starters, it feels a bit awkward to execute at first, turns Shun's back for opponent and allows for it's own interesting mind games from BT SOU in case you DO NOT wait the drink to execute.

- before of right after the drink you can go for a hit confirmable mid-mid with linear to half-circ (covers Shun's front). The kick will sideturn opponent on NH for +5 and CH for +9, block is only -8. Just do the punch for Shun to enter SOU for more options there.

- the only option in GH is (safe with -8 on block) a mid flop launcher (follow with + combos).

- the + is as awkward somersault kick to OUS stance () which goes over low attacks and lightly staggers on block. If you do not go to OUS, Shun does a kip-up from the floor which takes forever. Because of the stagger Shun is pretty safe though.

- the 2K option is a punishable low (-15) that is notoriously hard to see and knocks down but also linear.

- GH's ultimate use and benefit is in post round drinking. Combining GH with another BT drink or after (or ) will clock 3-4 DPs easily post round after a plethora of slower recovering KO attacks, so it is THE drinking skill Shun player MUST learn in order to boost those DPs post round. I find pretty easy to do first and input GH second for a final BT . Different combination are possible (like changing your alignation with / ), just remember to put that GH into somewhere post round if there is time. Be aware also that some KO moves may allow for 1 DP more from BT in ring out situations when opponent stumbles out, for 5 DP (these specific situations will be covered later).

- a more efficient way to get post round drinks is getting into BT SOU from string. When any or the punches finishes the opponent, you can immediatedly and drink three times for a total of 5 DPs. Note that timing is strict and you need 2/4/6 DPs in order to do the after any of the three punches of the string (2 DP for 1st one, 4 DP for and 6 DP for ).

- generally, if you see any of the punches hit or trust the opponent wants to block anyway (for fear the P+K mid string ender that launches), you can try + for those aforementioned BT SOU mixups.

- Also, you can use a similar BT drink move in SOU stance by pressing ++. Nice when a wary opponent backdashes a little so you can enjoy a nice 1 DP sip. Does not allow BT SOU drink cancel though, so is more risky than the normal version.




Seishi Gyou'in (DP +3)
(hit)
- a 21 exe hit-throw for 54 dmg on NH. Slow half circular with good dmg and 3 DPs. Use this near walls and on rising opponents (okizeme).




Tenshin Souchushou (DP +0 to +5)

- has super slow 32 exe, but ducks highs like nothing and is Shun's option for taking (up to) 5 DPs instead of greater damage after stomach crumbles, wall stuns and flop launchers. With NH opponent can quick recover but Shun also can retaliate with or ( to OUS) for combo opportunity () or interruption-to-OUS stance ( and ). The is the easiest to execute of the best DP options (+7 DP) for post-KO drinking. ( and [2P] generally require front hits and a quick to ).




Kaibou Hanbi (DP +0 to +5)
(SOU)
- first hit is an awesome high half circular sabaki that staggers and second hit a knock down mid with crazy (but still quick recoverable and actually punishable) pushback. With similar after hit options as with NH, try get as many DPs as you can stomach before opponent tries to counter attack. Those who block the first part are often easy to throw cause they fear the (fully evadable) mid part. The mid part is also +4 on block so beats 12f punches.

- use the sabaki part when you wait for about anything else than a high/mid or a front evade in SOU. Which is useally not much.

- the knock down mid punch sure is linear but it's also +4 on block! This will grant a free 236P launcher against all attacking 12f opponents, which is really duper.

 

Shun's throw game is an integral part of his DP game and it's changed somewhat from previous games. There are three throws now that Shun can use to boost his DP count.


Suiho Tenshinchu (+2 DP)

- still one of the best neutral throws in the game, even with a DP nerf from +4 to +2 DP. Changes aligment almost 180 degrees. One of the easiest ways still to get some drinks, as beginners may not break at all and intermediate players often have an inclination of breaking stronger throws. May allow (depending on opponents remaining life) for one or two additional drinks on KO, so remember to do one P+K+G and then 6P+K+G for safe 1 DP or for 2 DPs when the last push does the KO.


Tenshin Gyou'in Sousuimon (+4 DP)

- one of your main boozing tools, period. With a meager 35 dmg compared to other throw options, it's a juicy example of exchanging dmg and generating new mojo and mind games with extra DPs. Low dmg is no 'problem' since Shun's [throwing] game rises from sucky to pretty good after just a couple of anyway. If your opponent seems resistant to Shun's flurry of punches and/or you need a DP lead, always go for it first. After a KO, it may allow for +3 DPs after for a total of 7 DP so is a great choice as a round ender too. The first part of the throw does minuscule damage, which actually makes it even better post-KO drinking technique. Pushes straight forward, opponents head down, feet towards.


Gouhai Senbu (10+ drinks, +4 DP)

- as 10 DP is close to an overkill, this serves as one of the ultimate tools of final devastation of your opponent than an everyday drinking tool. Allows for two (2) additional DPs on KO too. This throw is the reason why Shun's throw tactics change drastically with different DP counts, in addition with lovely (requirement 6 DP).


Toushu Richu (opponent back to full wall, +6 DP)

- no DP requirements, high wall dmg and SIX drinking points make this a killer. The ups are probably meant to be a (sad) compensation for Shun's bad wall combo dmg potential. But hits is the best non-combo (mind Jacky) wall throw in the game, period. If you see enemy freezing near high wall, ALWAYS go for it. The bad thing is that wise opponents always try to break it, and other stronger Shun throw options near the wall end wall pressure dead (which is a waste). But even breaking it keeps the aligment favourable, just pushing Shun away a bit. A potential game changing throw.


Kanshouri (opponent back, +6 DP)

- another +6 DP monstrosity, but getting a fair shot is even harder than above. Sometimes it works after if opponent does nothing waiting a certain combo (or Aoi doing that annoying BT mid reversal !). Some moves like Jacky's annoying can be countered with ducking and immediatedly executing the BT throw for immensely enjoyable and guaranteed results.


Note that if opponent breaks throw, Shun loses 3 DP.

 

After Knock Out Drinking (Oh the Pleasure!)

Getting a good dose of booze after a KO is very important for Shun. Usually, you should be able to clock 3-4 DPs and with some knowledge, yet 5, 6 or even 7 are not too hard either. See this common scenario: the round went down the toilet, as Jean just destroyed your DPs with stupid combos and you barely had him by the balls with your superior shenanigans. How do you knock him out AND put your divine intoxication back on track ? The answer is post-round drinking or more specifically after knock-out drinking.

The following examples are not all-encompassing but rather a wacky start and a general introduction. I'll also cover only flat ground "normal" situations for now. All readers are invited to contribute and comment, as always. I'd love to hear from side situations, walls KOs, ring out DP tactics, character specifics, etc ! There is a lot to be covered and I've only written about the most common ones.



+1 DP =
-
-

- try to get at least [6[P[+[K[+[G (which has slightly faster startup) no matter how little time you seem to have. One common scarce time situation is P+G throw KO, when you may get one or two DPs, depending on how much your opponent had life left. If in general situation you see some extra time left, do [P[+[K[+[G first and then [6[P[+[K[+[G as it clocks it's DP earlier.




+2 DP =
-
- ,
- ,
- ,
-

- different possibilities, with slight speed differences. Be economical, do what feels natural/cool whatever. Usually two times or then suffices, but seems always the fastest and allows for a quick third too if time allows.




+3 DP =
- ,
- , , ,
- , ,
-

- here as well many possibilities, but speed differences are obvious. , is fastest and allows for fourth DP in many cases too, even with for a side change (which takes a bit more time but rarely leads to less DPs). Next fastest is , (to Oushin), but the problem here is that in many cases fourth DP could have been made with and there is time for fifth DP only in some stupid ring out situations.




+4 DP =
- , x 2
- , ,
-
- (requires 10 DP)

- along with 3 DP situations, this should be your most common one in finishing move wise and the max DP situation post KO that involves non situations. Out of two possible ways, I prefer since it allows for different combinations, another is easy to do and may be slightly faster too.




+5 DP =
- ,
- (as itself of after a stun or a flop KO)
- (any does the KO)
- Knock Out (any ), (when you have required drinks to do the move), x 2
- SOU ,
- ,
- ,
-
- BT
- *enter the KO move*

- as you can see, there are a world of possibilities and I'm sure there are more. Some of the easiest are , , and and also the most important. Those 11f s are nice ones too. Post your own moves and I'll add them!




+6 DP =
- , ,
- (high wall version)

- wall throw is awesomesauce & perhaps a reason for lacklustre wall combo dmg Shun has and is both nasty & easy . Others maybe?




+7 DP =
- , ,
- , , ,
- , , ,

- hitting that linear 32 exe mid , even with it's evading props, should be the grand slam but you may ask why and , the best moves in the game, score that too? Well, you need to time exactly when 5 DPs are loaded or the last one misses. It's not that easy.




+8 DP =
- , ,

- the max I'm sure. Remember to wait the animation to finish until pressing . Immediatedly unlocks some of the best Shun's moves & combos for your pleasure.




My big tip for beginners is that make a habit of using immediatedly after a knockout or for easy FIVE drinks. These have the least risk involved per DPs gained for sure. If you can score , first learn to do on reaction after a KO. After you got that, you can drink once before for relatively easy SIX drinks. Never be predictable, ie fishing 3K all the time! Any flop combo launcher KO allows for ONE drink plus for 6 DPs overall.

In addition, learning widens one's drinking chances tremendously as it gives 2 DPs. Four DPs should be natural after a plethora of moves soon enough (see 3 & 4 DP section above).

 

Unlockable Moves by DP Points

As well as hitting more damage, Shun gets new moves unlocked after set amount of drinks. Below are the moves Shun gains by set DP amount and a short review of their relevance. I'll add specifics later (new frames, new move properties etc).




1 DP
- : a 24f sweep (the full circ one is 25f), covers back, on block -18 and -3 both on NH and on CH. Hard to see a point in this, but this move gets better later (at 6 and 7 DP).




2 DP
- : basically gets a mid mixup, which is very nice for many reasons. The part is a mid and can be delayed. On hit only -1 and floats on CH for a short combo. It's -7 on block though and always can be evaded. However, there is more to the move, as can be cancelled with 4 for BT SOU stance that has it's own options (the stance thread will have more details on BT SOU soon). Combos are wildly different depending on stance though. I see this move as an integral part of Shun's offence.




4 DP
- (): half-circular gets a similar treatment here with the same () mid/BT SOU mixups. Note that has nice range and with -2 on block is fine to throw now and then. At CH, gives +6 to play with cancel to BT SOU too. This all in addition to which always cancels [4 part into Kasen Gyou'in (GK) which has it's own mind games.

- (): same as above but inside a string. Same notes apply. Very useful in various combos.

- [P[+[K: that second string gets treatment here. Second is -9 on block curiously. At CH, +3 changes to -1 so a little less play room here but it's still nice. Opponent must block the second too if done pretty quick.

- CHOU : another mid derivative. Allows for combos after CHOU too.




5 DP
- (BT): a high catch throw, Shun's back towards opponent. Adds to Shun's BT options.




6 DP
- : an absolutely essential safe launcher. Special mid, so ducking works against it.

- : a new string, 14f punisher and an important combo filler.

- : the second sweep. More damage, but same stats as with the single version.

- : a new forward throw. Basically a launcher so needs a combo.

- : a high high low high string. Basically adds 1 KK after PP, similar G-cancels. Nice mix-up.

- : nearly identical to PP version. As before, adds to pushback and many combos. At 9 DP




7 DP
- : adds a knockdown as a third hit. Useful.




8 DP
- (): a delayable mid high mid string. Picks up from ground. Cancellable to GK after second and to OUS after the part. Adds to many combos. Easy to do.

- (): a long range flying headbutt. Oushin cancel adds okizeme.

- : an important combo extender. Can be delayed. The added can be hit-confirmed after first one staggering opponent (or doing it anyway). Picks of the ground too. Staple after wall hits too. Basically has many uses.

- (OUS): an Oushin version of .

- (CHOU): a CHOU version of .

- : an add-on high half circular punch to . Adds some more powerful combos.




10 DP
- (-2 DP): a safe mid full circular. A tool for beating defensive techs near wall or for a ringout.

- (-2 DP & -3 DP): a safe hit-checkable low-high launcher. Gets better combos at 13 DP. The one reason for Shun to get sober.

- : a 17f launcher that gives +4f on block, so 16f beats 12f punches.

- (OUS): a nice string in Oushin.

- (BT): a string in BT that ends in hit-throw. A bit of a gimmick. Second is special high which is nice.

- (+4 DP): a strong throw that adds four (4) drinks.




16 DP
- : a string that has some uses near walls, but the last part unsafe and the string has next to no use in combos.




As you can see, threshold numbers are 4, 6, 8 and 10 DPs as those unlock Shun's really useful moves. There are also several frame and property changes per drinks (which also affects many combos) and that will be covered in this thread later.

 

Forgot PPKK.
I'm fairly sure I've done P+G, 3P~4, P+K+G after a round if the throw kills them on the last hit (the one done by Shun, not hitting the ground. Actually, I'm not sure if there even a hit on hitting the ground for that matter...)
You'd get 2 for the throw and 3 after KO.

 

The best I got after in dojo was 2 DP with . No time for another I'm afraid.

 

Dojo lifebar settings 2 (they die and then the dojo resets)? It resets a lot faster than actual combat KO does. Which is pretty stupid, mind you.

 

I tried the same with Arcade mode and found enough time for only for max drinks after , no matter the life left or exe speed. I find the post KO drinking time between the modes identical, for example or KO allows for exact same amount of time for 7 DP drinking window (which is not long at all). Can you describe the exact situations where this does not apply in your experience ?

On the other hand, allows for 3 DP afterwards, if KO happens during the second part (as was noted in the throw section). This adds for 7 DP in total (and since first part does minuscule dmg, is actually a great way to get post KO drinks).

 

Hmm, also tried arcade and it seems I remember this one wrong. I'm probably confusing it with some other after KO situation, been a while since I Shunned.

Also looks like I remember the dojo KO wrong since the P+G, 3P~4 looks identical there. I could have sworn there was stuff that allowed me 1 more drink in actual battles than dojo testing but dunno.

Sorry about this. The list is still missing PPKK, though

 

You mean the Unlockable Moves list ? I have it in 6 DP section:
"- : a high high low high string. Basically adds 1 KK after PP, similar G-cancels. Nice mix-up."

 

LOL @ me. I remembered it was 8 and I checked 8 and 10 2-3 times for it. I'll get me coat...

 

I have some After Knock Out Drinking setups to add.

6 DP
Oushin (, Feet towards), ,

(only on CH) ,

(), ,

Zabantetsu () ,

(the old classic mule kick ) ,

(only on CH) , ,

,

Jumping (descending)

,

I use a few moves more, but I'm not sure there are guaranteed. I got to visit the lab.

 

The K is actually from back turned OUS just to be specific.

These are avoidable by a quick recovery I'm afraid. The 6 before P+K+G is not needed (thankfully).

If you got time, check and write some wall hit drink stuff, as this thread sorely needs them.