EmX, just ask me?

Below is a PM transcript between EmX, KoD and myself. It was started by KoD in response to EmX's recent bout of attacking and spamming in various threads. I'm posting this here to give him a taste of his own medicine. He seems to get off on logging private conversations then posting them publically, probably under the illusion that it actually makes him look good. So, I thought I'd give it a try too. Warning: this is pretty long (winded).


Subject: Just ask myke . . .
Posted by: KoD
Date: 09/01/08 07:16 AM

. . . if you really want to get banned from VFDC, he'd probably accommodate your request.

There's not much point in this whole "push the limits by posting as much trash as possible and see if i'll get banned" exercise otherwise. Short of reposting stuff for shang, I doubt it'll happen unless you man up and explicitly ask for it.
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Posted by: EmX

Yeah, I don't want to be banned man. I just went a little over the top with my performance posting. If it's getting too ridiculous for y'all I'll cut that shit out.
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Posted by: EmX

Like, primarily VFDC is way of communicating with other players and getting them to learn. But the bullshit I identified isn't going anywhere soon so I might as well make my contribution and make a few cheap and bitterly ironic quips while I still give a shit about VF. Y'know?
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Posted by: Myke

EmX, that was going "a little" over the top? Attacking and insulting people? There are more constructive ways to build a rivalry, or hype yourself, if that's what you really wanted. But if your only intention was to be a dick, well, that's not cool.

In your response to KoD here, it sounds like you're saying:

The problem isn't going anywhere soon so I might as well make it worse.

I respected your ideas put forward in the past mod discussions, even if I didn't necessarily agree with some of them, and I was sorry that you felt you just had to give up, rather than work with the group to reach some sort of compromise. But with the statement above, I'm both amazed and disappointed that you'd even engage in this thought process.

Your latest round of posts is a funny way of showing that you still "care" about VF.
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Posted by: EmX

Right, that compromise wasn't going to happen. That KoD called the very notion of enforcing a standard superfluous and that my ideas were largely ignored and never addressed comprehensively made me quit. I really don't care anymore, since apparently no one wants to put the time in except me. Western VF is stagnant, and as a leader of the community you have to assume some of the blame. We all do. And we obviously need a new methodology, especially since Sega has been benevolent enough to give us online play. Welp, said too much already.

Yes, I will be a hypocrite. I will provoke people and do the opposite of what they want of me to get them to show me their true colors. And really, if they want to feel hurt, that's their own business.
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Posted by: KoD

When's the last time you made a wiki edit? When's the last time myke or I made a wiki edit? Who is actually putting in time here?

Put the energy you're spending on posting useless stuff towards fixing the wolf strats.
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Posted by: EmX

Sorry, that ship sailed a long time ago. I'm done actually discussing VF5 with people on these forums as an end in itself. As you can see on my LJ, the dipshits moved in and wasted my time by not understanding all the points I was making. So no, I'm not going to add to the wiki unless there is a genuine attempt (not just namedropping) to bring people in outside of the community by at least a dedicated handful of people.

Thus: Why not make a zine-quality .pdf of all the wiki materials and command lists and have people print them out and distribute them at a low cost or for free for people who are interested in the game -- game shops, lan centers, etc. A sort of VFDC Mook, if you will. I would edit that and work on the Wolf section again if you can get enough interest. I may end up doing it myself if the people who work on the wiki give me permission. Paper is cheap, and copies are pretty cheap too. It doesn't have to be visually elaborate or cost us $5+ a pop to print. Just some text and combos and the like, since the brady guide is pretty damn pricey and doesn't show the whole picture regarding the game.
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Posted by: EmX

Why am I being ignored?

I deserve an answer.
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Posted by: Myke

EmX, that's a great suggestion to reach out to gamers who might not otherwise know about the site. But I have a few issues/questions with what you propose:

1. The content of the wiki isn't consistent, nor sufficiently complete across the characters IMHO. From what I've seen of the Brady guide, the character coverage is somewhat OK for people to get started in the game, and consistent in content for all characters. Wiki content is already print friendly, so I'm not sure how much extra work would be required there unless you're talking about a total re-format? But if the intention is draw in a new crowd, isn't there a risk of overwhelming them with this content? Imagine trying to digest a command list, or strategy article, or translation from arcadia for the very first time? So wouldn't a beginners or dummies guide to VF be more appropriate in achieving your goal, than handing out VF encyclopedias?

2. Why does this VFDC Mook need to be a requisite for you to work on the Wolf wiki? The reverse would make sense, but this doesn't. So it appears as though there's some agenda behind you wanting to contribute. Feel free to help me better understand your motives because to be honest with you, the mixed signals I'm receiving from you are confusing. One moment you're "done discussing VF5" on VFDC, the next you're spamming and flaming people in the forums, and now you want to contribute to the community bring in outside people using VFDC content.

3. Why do you need the buy-in from a "dedicated handful of people" before you'll even lift a finger in the wiki? Why is bringing in outside people a higher priority than attending to needs of the community that is here and now?

An unfortunate trend I've noticed around here is that people like to conjure up large scale ideas and projects, but rarely follow through to completion (I won't name names). Good luck to you if you decide to go ahead with this, but I'm not going to drop everything else I'm doing with VFDC right now to commit.

So what are you really waiting for aside from author permission? If you really think the wiki content is mature enough, then why not take some initiative and run with your idea? See how it works out?

I personally think the content isn't quite "ready" and would much prefer continuing my effort into fleshing it out. While I see the potential and value in spending effort to expand our community (doing Sega's Marketing job basically), I think it's more important to steady the ship first, so to speak.
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Posted by: EmX

because the community is full of gas huffing faggots myke, and frankly you're all a big fucking waste of time and huge, cocky scrubs about everything, none of us compete in japan, eric beat you 100%, etc. etc. etc.

The egos are too large and too thin. They are like gigantic fucking blisters waiting to pop and spill drama everywhere and waste my fucking time. So no, I am not going to put up with their horse shit. I'm not going to get drawn into it like all the top players did back in the day. I'm going to use your site as a means to get new people to play, and if that's not what you want to hear, then you can straight up IP ban me or worse.

my motive is simple: give people a go-to guide for the basics. I am not a terrible writer, so it won't be hard for me to copyedit all this stuff if you give me permission. It will at least be coherent and readable. If it is overwhelming, well, I can let people revise and resubmit at will. But I will distribute my copy in my area, so whatever.

no one's good myke, especially not in NAVF, and with VF5 being essentially a namco title (not going to argue this with you so don't bother, take it to the LJ if you wanna) it's even worse

whatever
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Posted by: EmX

just to pre-empt any pussy damage I might've caused: it's a fucking video game, get over it.
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Posted by: Myke

Was I rude or insulting in my reply to you?

I don't know who you're talking about when referring to these huge egos. You make it sound like the entire site is overrun with these people, and I'm not seeing it. Who's shit are you putting up with? Is there anyone you don't dislike here? I can't agree with you that nobody's good. There's certainly a handful of players in NA that I seriously consider to be good. If you're hoping to achieve some kind of nirvana where the majority of the US is on par with Japanese skill, then perhaps it's time to wake up, because it'll never happen.

So, what do you actually need for this go-to guide for the "basics"? Apart from gaining permission to use the Systems FAQ, or akai's post in the starter forum (which I have no doubt you'll receive) I don't see what's holding you back, I don't see why you need a dedicated force behind you, and I don't see why you're so angry about everything. Get writing already!?

Oh yeah, nice quip about Eric beating me "100%". Never mind that we only played like 3 or 4 games, that I had never really played VF5 competitively until arriving in Japan, or that it was the first time playing Ver.C. You can attack me and label me a gas huffing faggot that's a huge fucking waste of your time all you want. Maybe it makes you feel better about yourself or maybe you're not happy about your own skill level?

But to think that I would object to you using this site as a resource to attract new players is just ridiculuous.

Again, if you actually care about doing something positive and constructive for the scene, then I'm happy to continue this conversation. Otherwise, I have better things to do than get involved a shit slinging match with you.
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Posted by: EmX

Myke I'm going to beat you worse than Eric. One million in a row, against my alts. Not Wolf. You will be in literal tears if you have any illusions about VF being a legit competitive game anymore. VF5 sucks. Everyone of consequence says it sucks and I've proven pretty plausibly that it is some hot fucking garbage compared to VF2-VF4. Again, this is more of an LJ thing, since the actual content of the discussion is better-presented there.

I don't hate anyone here. That's far more than they deserve. They are just a very frustrating obstacle to me and my vision for the community (which is to have a whole lot of fun and not make into an excessively competitive circlejerk, or put the game on a pedestal). Trust me, I won't step on anyone's toes too badly from here on out, unless it's within the actual clique of people who play and are competent at the game. No one in NAVF will beat the tetsujin, and you won't either. You aren't telling me something new.

You were rude because you have such a hard time understanding what I say and you try to make it my fault entirely. Especially when you did put next to zero effort into paying attention to me when I bent over backwards to give you a reasonable proof that your methodology for running this forum is fatally flawed and has only degenerate externalities. The minuscule community of people who have the bare minimum of fundamentals to get by is case in point. Sorry if you don't agree. It's a cruel irony that someone from fucking Australia via Lebanon holds the keys when a hard majority of people here are from North America.

Ok, you don't think I'm worth a genuine effort. I do not care a bit sir. Stay the fuck outta the way.

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Posted by: EmX

Again, in person, it's all good. But I'm the way I am on forums because they are nothing to me. They mean very little. You seemed like a genuinely nice guy. You're the one who told me that I lost to Shang at Evo2k4 because I didn't know the switch followup, after all. I am just going to be cranky and excessively curt because my provocative style has literally no consequences and what I say online is nothing more than idle chatter to me. Again, I doubt I'll have many problems with yall in person, so don't make it like that.
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Posted by: KoD

Cant wait to meet you in person @ socal. I'm done talking to you online unless you want to talk about something productive (eg wolf wiki).
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Posted by: Myke

I've tried to remain civil in my replies, but you've seen fit not to be the same in return. You've even gone so far as to violently derail the topic at hand taking any chance you can to insult me and this community. This is my final reply to you.

<span style='font-size: 14pt'>ON TOPIC</span>

One minute you care about VF, the next you don't. Then you suggest an idea to help attract new players, now you tell me to get the fuck outta your way. Colour me confused. Again.

Let me try to state this, again, as simply as possible:

1. I liked your idea
2. I didn't think there was enough existing content on VFDC, aside from akai's starter forum post, ready for print to help new players ease into VF.
3. I suggested that you should run with the idea anyway, but I don't have the time to get involved in your project.

In summary: I acknowledged and agreed with your idea, offered an observation, and suggested you go ahead.

Again, I ask you, what's stopping you? Me? Why am I even being told to get the fuck outta your way? I'm not in your fucking way, so what exactly is your problem with me? Do you need help? Why not ask around?

I know I said I wouldn't get involved, but here, let me get you started:

1. Obtain author permission (which I'm sure won't be a problem)
2. Do some actual work

Pretty straightforward I thought. So instead of spending time thinking of new and creative ways of insulting people, like calling them a gas huffing faggot (which I've noticed you've used on more than one site), why don't you actually do something constructive?

<span style='font-size: 14pt'>OFF TOPIC</span>

Is this how you interpret a disagreement? That the other party just doesn't understand you and is thus rude? The "proof" you provided that the way "I run" the site was "fatally flawed" was not convincing enough, and more importantly, not applicable to a community such as ours. So, I understood you fully, respectfully disagreed and gave you reasons why. What happened next? You threw a fit and resigned as a mod.

Tell you what, when the site and the community inwardly spiral out of control and implode into nothingness, just as you foretold, I'll be sure to send you a postcard saying "You sure told me so!"

What's with the racist remark? What does my location or ethnicity have anything to do with anything we're discussing? You want irony? How about the fact I've probably met, played, helped and befriended more NA VFers than you? Maybe you think the site should be run by Americans, for Americans? Your prejudice, self-centeredness and arrogance is not appreciated.

Why do you insist on mentioning your "LJ" whenever the opportunity arises? I had a look and I laughed. It's good to see that the art of posting a private conversation hasn't been lost. You whining about Eileen is hilarious and only indicative of how much of a scrub you are. So there you have it, my total interest in your LJ begins and ends in this paragraph and I'd appreciate it if you don't bring it up again. You also look desperate for attention.

I've also noticed that you liked reminding us all how well you can write, but the only words you've bothered to commit to the community have amounted to nothing more than insults and attacks. Way to leave a legacy.

I didn't delete your "performance posts" so I have no idea what you're talking about. If this kind of moderator action ruffled your feathers so much, why not bother finding out who actually did it and take it up with them, rather than just accuse me? Had you still been a mod, I have no doubt that you would have banned such posting, never mind amputate the posts from the thread.

And on that subject, what a mistake of colossal proportions I made in appointing you a mod! What THE FUCK was I even thinking?

Yeah, no, it's not. You're a hypocrit not only by your actions, but also by your own admission. You think being a prick online has no consequences? Just because this is the internet, you think you can do what you want with impunity? Even though I met you at Evo, and thought you were cool, I can't say that I have any care for meeting you again. Whether or not this matters to you is for you to decide. But you might want to consider that if other people feel the same way toward you, what then? You attack the entire LA scene, so I'm wondering if you're realistically expecting their hospitality when or if you ever visit?

How would it feel not to be welcomed anywhere? How's that for a consequence?