First Look: VF5 on 360

Bang on the money there dude. If there isn't a mechanism for sharing information and social interaction it's just a bunch of fragmented players learning the same lessons for no reason.

 

I don't think Microsoft (see how I didn't use a $ there?) is going to suddenly decide to let people use a Japanese PS3 peripheral.

Unless some incredibly odd twist of fate happens, I think you and everyone else who still thinks the VSHG will work on the 360 as-is are in for a rude awakening.

 

Yep, and that's exactly what is happening with VF5.

VF5 is much less systematic and much more situational compared to VF4. A tutorial with a very general scope like VF4 is simply not going to cut it with VF5. It's very unlikely that VF5 will be able to include an in-depth tutorial mode with the game simply due to the overwhelming amount of details involved.

There really is little hope left for competitive play in the US when players are whining about including tutorials for a 5+ years old game.

 

I'm sorry for the interruption but... I heard they were measuring e-penises here...

 

Ths turorial is fr the new player. VF desperately needs new players. The turorial mode will at least let them know whats going on. Sometimes i get the feeling that vf players really dont care about expanding the umber of people who play.


Try to put some our self in some one elses shoes.

*NEw player gets game
*New payer goes through the tutorial mode
*Has fun beating the decent ai computer with the tech's learned from the tutorial
*Looks for human comp and finds vfdc.

A new competitive player is born.



it happened with me

 

- Exactly. The tutorial modes aren't there for the advanced gamers, but at least when a new players goes through the tutorial, they can begin to scratch the surface of the game. From there, hopefully, they'll be interested in learning more about VF's depth.

The VF series needs as many gamers as possible.

 

You guys somehow think we vets were never newbies.

My sole point is that VF scene doesn't need players who want to be spoon fed.

Hoping/Waiting for tutorials in-game to start learning the game is the attitude of a baby that wants to be spoon fed.

To be competitive in VF or any fighting game requires so much more than just knowledge and a few tutorials. How did you think players from VF2 or VF3 learned the game? Without internet, without people translating stuff, without resources from Japan, without any of the BS that people take it for granted.

Really, spoon fed players might as well just quit cause the scene doesn't need more of them.

What's the point of more players if they are just complacent or can't back up their big talks? Playing against these kinds of players is probably less fun than Quest mode in VF5. I might as well just do that if the competition is a bunch of babies who are not any better than the AI.

You act like not including tutorial mode means less players or less sales. That's why all these other more successful games have indepth tutorial/training mode right? That's why evo sold less than VF4, and the VF player base really exploded with evo right?

 

Well, whatever our views are...

The lack of a tutorial in VF5 is at least sort of a good opportunity for us as an English literate VF community to recompile and reorganize the VF5 online knowledgebase ^_^

Obviously Srider and Myke have done a lot as well as many others who have been translating articles, compiling the updated movelists and frame data, and writing guides.

For the moment at least, it's the first time since VF4:Evo's come out where the community is looked to for the information much more directly and our response isn't all "check out the training mode/tutorial." Though that is what we (myself included) do tend to tell people ("Check out VF4 Evo, great tutorial and challenge package) anyhow.

That said, I think there are a good number of us trying to compile stuff in the background for the VF community. In some ways, it's kind of nice going back to community as a source of even basic information. Sort of like the old VF2 (before my time), VF3, and early VF4 days ^_^

All that said, I have to admit that I have faith that by the end of summer, we'll have quite a bit of "organized" information out there. Whether it's more guides, the sticky threads covering things like "system," and well, maybe even more stuff.

For everyone that's already been doing their parts though, I salute you all.

Before VF5 comes out for 360, let's make sure most of the information is at least somewhat intuitive to access ^_^ This is the community's opportunity to step up strong again.

 

Wow, how did shang get ahold of srider's login password?

Is whining about whining any better than whining?

You make some good points about how the game is too disorganized and irrational to have a solid tutorial mode . . . but this "record mode doesn't matter cause you can just get friends to test stuff out" line of reasoning is just being an apologist for sega. Ditto for lack of hit checking / fuzzy guard challenges. Appropriate reflexes are still useful in VF5, no? Or is that just more unnecessary spoon-feeding?

 

I Have to agree with Srider and Chanchai, Ive been begging for this thread to be closed over the last week as there doesnt seem like there is much willingness from some people to read the information in VFDC which in my opnion is far more thougher then any tutorial has to offer. I doubht the 360 version will improve you much as VF player especially if you sit on your hands and expect it to spoonfeed you.

 

I don't see what the problem is -- at least where I am (San Diego), there is plenty of vs. competition. I plan on implementing what I've read here, what I learn/execute in dojo, and my basic skill set that comes from 10+ years of playing fighting games into my vs. matches.

Reading about fuzzy or ETEG or OM usage, etc. and getting the timing/feel of these techniques through hands on play are two different things. I've been lurking on these forums for months, trying to acclimate myself to the VF system and I feel like I understand the glossary of terms fairly well now. In practice, however, I am a total noob because I own a 360. Obviously, one develops a personal style through vs. play -- dojo is NOT the end all/be all of VF5. It seems to me to be nothing more than a tool, and a welcome tool at that. Not a savior feature, not a useless feature. So what's the argument about?

My .02 :>

 

The dojo mode in VF5 is great as it is.

Playing versus online aint gonna happen anytime soon and thats a good thing.

But I sure wish there was a community function in the game, so players could share information that way, saved replays, move demonstrations and techniques. That's the "tutorial" or training I would want to see in the game.

I wish VFDC could be part of the game or accessed in the game.

Well at least you can use the ps3 web browser to access VFDC. I will have to try that next time.

 

The Dojo mode is good for testing out combos and not much else. The free training in Evo with the record/play allowed you to do almost everything you could think of in terms of practice. I don't understand why some people are such apologists about. Ok if you don't think it's a big deal, but to argue AGAINST the inclusion of tutorials/better free training/etc....I just don't get that.

And to say that people should come HERE to look for info is laughable at the moment. Take your mouse pointer and scroll over to the left side. Now hold it over the link to the supposed "Virtua Fighter 5" section, what do you see? Right.

To find info here they need to wade through forum post after forum post, trying to discern the relevant from the irrelevant, how easy do you think that is for a beginner?

And I quite frankly don't see how VF5's "situational" play somehow hinders a tutorial that teaches basic things like the Evo tutorials did.

 

Yo can I just say this:

Who cares if this is better than PS3 VF5 or not? I just want the freaking game and not have to blow $600 to get it. Is that too bad of a thing?

As far as I'm concerned if this game has training, vs., record, and is arcade perfect I'm set.

 

Umm... don't ignore the small details of what I said.

I clearly stated that training mode is missing many important features. You can pretty much see my complaints about the game across various posts and threads. I'm not Sega's apologist.

Reflexes are trained through real matches, they can hardly be improved in training mode. How many times have I heard players say "but I can do it in training mode!...."

All I'm saying is that if they put what you want in the game, that's well and dandy. If they don't, stop bitching and just learn it the same way every Japanese arcade players learn it. Unless people like getting owned left and right by them and learn through second/third hand info.

 

Now we know who the fraud VF5 fans are and who the frauds are. If you didnt spent the $750+ for the game HDMI cable and system, Youre not a true VF fan. The priceisd no excuse . You all had over 8 months to set aside the $600. If you cant set aside a lousy $600 in eight months thats more of a personal problem than a VF loyalty problem. That said I agree that all this BS about which system has the better looking and playing Vf is Bullshit. If the Ai is better obviously the 360 one is better, but thats all subjective anyway is'nt it? Ive seen pics of the PS3 version that look just as anti aliased as well as the 360 pics so its really just subjective about which looks smoother The Ps3 stilllooks smooth in 1080p on a 40' screen so I doubt it can look much better on 360, especially since the baseline 360 has no HDMI cable output. . I mean some AI performances pale besides a players depending on how good that player is to begin with.
If I have to start over Quest mode again (who am I kidding ,I will) Ill Do it with Vanessa and Lei Fei, and Eileen,just to keep it fresh.

I had to get a X360 in DEc because Rainbow six was a must have and Ps3's vers got delayed, so at least VF5 will give me one more justification for the purchase.

 

Srider is right in the sense that the VF4 Evo tutorial is giving the wrong impression to newbies. One gets the impression that "This is the VF system...this is all there is to it" from the tutorial, when really, it's not even close.

However, it does give the very basics which is perfect for newbies. The tutorial just needs to make it clear that what it's teaching is just that, the basics.

What would be sweet is if Sega could dedicate a page to VFDC in the American/European manual. Something like "to learn more about VF, the VF system and to meet other players in your area, head over to VFDC". So, like an ad, but...Sega puts it in for free. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

Maybe even have an ad for the American tournament Evo 2k. Show the prizes and whatever. That may certainly inspire some players to play and get good at VF. =P

Sega also needs to really start focusing on advertising the game in NA. The PSN store and Live's Marketplace really give Sega the tools needed to get the VF name into millions of homes. Hell, why haven't they released a demo yet? Just have the following in the demo: El Blaze and Eileen, one costume each with some (like...5-10 each or something) items that you can use to pimp them out and have one stage available in VS mode (and like 3 arcade stages).

Release that demo on the PSN store and Live Marketplace and suddenly VF is in the minds of a tonne of gamers which should definitely increase sales. Increased sales=more players=more competition=better players and more opportunities to get better yourself.

Hell, Sega should even have trailers on PSN store and Marketplace which include interviews with famous Japanese players about how they did in some major tournament. Have shots of them collecting their checks and the overall atmosphere as well as their hands as they play in the finals (to show the speed of VF) and whatever. Basically, flood the PSN store and Marketplace with VF content (trailers, interviews, a demo, etc).

Sure, everyone here can help out as well by going to the local arcade and preaching VF's worth and what not, but let's face it, we are limited as individuals. Sega as a company can reach millions more.

Of course, flawless online play would be ideal for expanding the VF community, but that won't be happenig any time soon (if at all), but Sega needs to add something to attract more players... More modes like online replay sharing and like someone else said, an online VF.TV to stream replays of offline tournaments and the like. Maybe fun stuff like custom stages, AI training, whatever.

And maybe a story mode...

Ya, story mode is completely pointless, but it can't hurt to try. Bring some of the best writers in Sega, and write an awesome compelling story. Have some amazing CGI, etc...Or even just have some kind of movies (anime movies?) that can be unlocked in Quest mode which would give players a story.

Sure, it's completely pointless, but if it gets more players interested in the game without actually hurting the gameplay, I'm all for it.

So how does one go about asking Sega to release a demo of VF5? I remember Srider had a link to something where we can email Sega...Maybe I'll do that.

 

. . .

There is going to be a turorial mode this is almost confimed.

People can learn reflexes through training mode. Thats your opinion.


. . . at your comment "learn like ever other Japanese players". There is no comp to play against.....traveling across the us to find comp isnt....reasonable.

I think the point of this expansion of the game is to get new players. I dont know if you understand this strider but it is very difficut to get into this game..a promblem with most fighters. To get competent at this game you have to look online for second hand info on this site...most people wont do that. They wil use what is provided to them...basically nothing.

If the game doest have a tutorial/scripted situations...i will be disappointed...not because of the reason you think but because proably no new players will spring up.

 

Ok sweep the Leg the Argument is about SEGA spending time on BETTER NEW FEATURES for the 360 version of VF5 rather than a lousy dojo mode. Dojo mode was probally DONE already on the PS3 version, and just CUT so it wouldnt horn in on SEga JAPans atcade business. What SOME of us are saying, myself included is that SEGA would've done better by Adding online uploads and downloads of VF5 player made AI's and replays, and add
reply mode to ALL modes of play, and include ONLINE LEAder boards. They should add something that really enhances the playabilty and replay Value of the game (I know replay value is just a buzz word, because really VF5 has tons of replay value , but Sega needs to do something to warrant a SECOND purchase of the game). Currently theres only one AI routine per quest character, regardless of ringname so that needs to change as well. (granted thatd NEVEr get done by August).

What most of us are saying is if youre going to redo the game on the 360 DONT BE HALF ASSED about it. Most of us have been playing this since VF 1 and dont need a DOJO mode, and any one who's NEVEr played VF and claims they need Dojo mode is just a n00b (Unless youre 12 and the 360 is your first system)and will quit VF as soon as Mortal Kombat part 10 is released. The games been out 13 years. if youre not good at it now you NEVER will be.

 

I find a lot of complications to learning VF myself. I have Evo for the longest time and played through the tutorial and there is no doubt there is a lot of information there but the biggest barrier by far is no one around here plays the game (And I'm in the ATL, that's crazy!) I learned how to play SC from 3 sources, People, Forums, Training Mode pretty much in that order. Without the first two, the third doesn't mean to much in the end.

And personally, I for one, am tired of looking for information on these boards and seeing what seems to be a very well thought out and considered question answered in a response (look at VF4Evo practice) Yeah It's great but the computer can't put a humans emphasis on the tactics they present. I've been through Evo Practice, I've traveled and played players in the game with experience. I talked to those experienced players and got human input into the game and it helps me. Forums are a gateway to human experience. I think it's important to remember to share that as well as pointing out that Evo has a wonderful tutorial