FPS Discussion (was: /me gets out violin)

I've seen some crazy assed machine of a Quake player hack his models so effectively was shooting at rectangular blocks. Zero textures and graphical features.

Ah... that would be dangerously close to cheating. Sounds like yellow turrets and red mines for Tribes. =P


I'm worrying more about what joystick I'll be using to go with VF4 for PS2

I'm getting a 1P+2P joystick from Taiwan (segaduck's bringing it back for me) that is supposed to use arcade Japanese components. I'm also getting a Hori VF4 3-button stick so I can bring it with me to a friend's house. I'll be sure to post my findings once I get my hands on the sticks. (Heck maybe I can even test out the PS2 VF4 beta again, this time with joysticks).


There is no bitching about what CPU, Video Card, Internet Connection, Ping, Scripts, Cheating, Hacks, Season

Ah, a kindred spirit! While I'm a hardcore FPS gamer as well, one of the reasons why I love playing the VF and VO series is because, apart from joystick quality, everything's on a level playing field. No ping whiners, no script kiddies, no wall hacks, etc.

/versus/images/icons/smile.gif

Edit: Nothing wrong with a bit of OT discussion, but this sub-thread is now in General

 

Re: /me gets out violin

Ah... that would be dangerously close to cheating. Sounds like yellow turrets and red mines for Tribes. =P

I think that's just the r_drawflat command, I'm told the VF player Emil uses it for quake also. You can't hide in shadows that way also. Way off topic, but I don't have any VF nuggets at the moment to offset.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

I'm a TF/CS player 8 years of TF since the early BETAS. Dont play CS anymore due to cheating, gay 3GB monthly limit... TFC is for newbies.

I wouldn't really call it cheating. It was an even trade for defintion/perfomance. It was out in the open and at a public lan. He had some pissy little Pentium100. So he was generally appraised. Cause it certainly wan't pretty and he had machine/bot like accuracy.

Though I think everyone nowadays is extremely good at FPS nowadays and there's lots of resources and support for the game. Thus there is very little to distiguish elite and good players, and there are abundance of players in these categories. VF in general in western countries doesn't seem to have the same luxuries.

Still waiting for "Team Fortress 2: The waiting saga". Though I'm yet to be converted to Tribes1|2.... I play lots of Diablo2 LOD on USWEST.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

I think that's just the r_drawflat command, I'm told the VF player Emil uses it for quake also. You can't hide in shadows that way also. Way off topic, but I don't have any VF nuggets at the moment to offset.

Okay, I'm way off topic as well... but... just because a client-side variable is modifiable doesn't mean it's not cheating (or close to it). I'm all for bestweap binds and similar scripts, but some stuff just crosses the line...

In UT, before patch 436, you could call functions to modify impact hammer and playerclass weight properties such that you could hammerjump to heights not normally allowed by the game engine -- as a consequence, UT Assault games were all out of whack and tournament games had to be refereed to stop players from attempting crap like that.

(If you played UT a lot.... I thought rocketlaunching and dual hammerlaunching were perfectly legal, though, since it didn't require a clientside variable change, just good aiming and teamwork.)

 

Re: /me gets out violin

T1=good
Q1/2=good
Q3=okay
UT=good
T2=crap
TF2=um... is this ever going to be released?
Planetside=was shaping up to be great, until Dave Georgeson took the helm after leaving Dynamix. Now it's probably shite.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

It's still borderline cheating, or at least just an unfair advantage. If he uses r_drawflat (or whatever he did) so his computer can then chug Quake along at an acceptable rate, then he has an advantage over all the other players who are running along at an acceptable rate - because they're not using r_drawflat.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

Though, to be honest, any other port will be picked to pieces for graphicall inadiquicies.....I think sega should be critiqued, in that it will only push them further...

 

Re: /me gets out violin

Well he survived the LAN and scrutiny of all there.

You don't do that sorta stuff in public. He didn't get disqualified either.... This was long ago around 1995 or so.. I'm mean the other 200 or so gamers at the LAN came around to see his graphics and most were cool with it... It was bloody funny. I didn't think it gave that advantages such as see in the dark etc etc. But he did have an advantage in Frames Per Second thats for sure. But screwing up the graphics to that sorta level for an extremely minor fps advantage was ok at that time.

Things like Model Spikes(voodoo dolls), Pallete/Skin hacks, See thru walls, ping bombing, autoaim proxies... these are cheats..

scripts will be the age long debate... unless its an exploit as the HAMMER bug or something similar.

Thanks VF4 has none of that yet... version C is always for the better good. Console version will take the game to a whole new era.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

It's not cheating. Smooth fps and lan-like connections (or at least less than 150 ping) in quake is considered a given in any serious quake playing, right?. To not have it is like playing on a broken joystick in VF. So what if he has it and his opponents don't? Their failure to use or know the command and to willingly play with what amounts to a broken joystick is their fault. If it were a cheap command, ID would have nuked it or made it only server-side.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

I hate to contribute to offtopicness, but quake is something I like discussing and playing. I don't play anything lately except Q1, so I needn't bother getting into UT stuff, which is notorious anyway.

I checked all the console commands at www.planetquake.com/console/ and found that ID was pretty good about taking out anything that could be cheating. There are variables that modify movement speed, how much you 'stagger' when struck by a rocket/grenade, how much you fly through the air when hit in midair, how fast you're able to turn and strafe, etc. All were cut of of client side and many out of server side. Besides, if it IS r_drawflat... it sucks. The colors used to separate polys aren't very clear (there are only like 5 or I think) and so you often will see two walls meet and can't tell where one ends, etc.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

Ok this one sums it up!
Bunny hopping? Cheat or not?

Requires a fair amount of skill to do.. fairly huge advantage to complement a players already good game.

Is bunny hopping the next level of movement or a bug exploit?

 

Re: /me gets out violin

Originally a bug exploit, but it's not a cheat at all.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

bug exploit...hard to do...
not much use in the new versions cause 'luck' plays too big a factor..so..no cheat~

 

Re: /me gets out violin

Guess I fall into the same camp. It's tough to do and while the advantage is big, everyone can do it, so there ya go. Definitely not intended though - good example is in quake stage 1/1 (e1m1) - you can bunny hop over the acid pit. Obviously not how they wanted you to get over it. Ditto the jump to the silver key in the second stage. There are worse examples.

If anyone out there still has quake, and hasn't seen this shit, you must go to
http://quake2000.da.ru/misc/jump/index.shtml unless I screwed up the url.
Instructions plus showoff movies.
I have these zipped on the server.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

**sigh** (fond memories of 1000's of suicide deaths mastering the art of rocketing jumping, normal and cuss jumping in TF)

Did you play TeamFortress? Deathmatching never appealed to me.. Although its very important in TF the additional teamwork, tactics, classes and objectives made TF so much more fun than deathmatch/arena quake.

 

Re: /me gets out violin

I played like two seconds of TF. It was fun. I was a sniper/camper.