Goh's Shoulder ram

Hi guys! I'm quite noob with Goh. I've used the search command, I've watched a lot of movies, but Goh is quite difficult and I'm trying to improve my skill. I'm trying to use Shoulder Ram to counter, but i can't figure the right timing. What about you? /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Any other tip will be great /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Thanks!!!

 

Check out Creeds excellent Goh guide and all the other Goh related stuff at theis link:

http://virtuafighter.com/vf4/goh

Gohs shrm can be useful after a or a as these are primary weapons of setting up flows. To do it after a standing jab you'll need to modify it with a crouch dash, ie you'd need to input something like

> +

but after a , sinc you're already crouched you can just enter + to get the shrm out. Its also good to have have several different follow ups after a successful hit (you'll stagger your opponent) but Creeds covered many of these well.

 

Thanks! Really /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif It's training time! /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

I would refrain from using goh's shrm after low punch. It's good to use it in small~medium disadvantage situations because goh's shrm beats the opponent's low punch cleanly. You have to learn how to buffer the crouch dash inorder to do the shrm from standing.

 

Goh shoulder ram is somhow harder to buffer than akira's, prehaps you have to do it slower or somthing /versus/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

i never have a problem buffering the shoulder ram. i like to use it after or +.

 

Well if you use the shoulder ram after those then it's really quite simple to buffer it in, seeing all you have to do is + cuz both of the moves you listed end in crouch. Goh's shoulder ram is buffered the same way as Akira's, one shouldn't be harder than the other I don't think.

 

i already know this. tell Val that. he's the one who believes that Goh's requires special magic buffer timing.

 

That part WAS to him, I just didn't want to post a one liner. And for or + leading to shoulder ram, you might as well just go ~+. As you know has much faster execution than both of the ones you said earlier. Look, if you use + that's just trying to predict a , but +'s property evades anyway, so what's the point of that?? Plus it is rather punishable if you guess the opponent's moves wrong.

 

is a CH defensive tool whilest is offensive and with greater range - if it gets a normal hit you're -2 but your shldrm will beat a from the opponent. also gives wallstaggers and is hence a great pressuring tool next to walls. + only wins over things at small diss (up to -3?) and even then only short elbows mostly imo (if it's not for the CD motion making a high miss) so there's your point in doing + (along with greater payoff) - and if you miss you're pretty safe with the shldrm most of the time. The problem with + is that it's shitty timing dependent as compared to van's or wolfs lp cutter. It can, however, theoreticly give you a some nice payoffs. Don't do the in built catch after ever and I mean ever.

1)+>+>Combo (most dmg).
2)+>++
3)+>Dash in and throw / attack.

/KiwE (Would like a buff of the + for FT).

 

GTO ---- i dont see your point, the whole point of b,df+p is that it is a true low poke where as low P is a special low meaning that opp can block high and leave you at -4 rather than -2 if they block high against the b,df+p. well, that's not to say that it is somewhat better, they both have different uses.

b,df+p can be used as a backdash tool and it has good distance. you can even use it in offense as a simple low pressure poke and works very well, especially if you have your opponent frozen or staggered. the whole point of using shlrm afterward is that normal hit is what you will mostly get if you use it to break high guarders. you just happen to be at -2 so you break the reverse nitaku game by owning low P and short mids.

low P -- shlrm is a simple series with low P throw. (unlike b,df+p which you cant really use for a throw followup unless you gain MC). The downfall about low P in comparison is that it lacks distance, and leaves you at -4 blocked (high or low) shlrm will then beat short mids, but not low P. so it is a fast poke but cant be used well against pressurized guarders, like all people who abuse low P and get punished by reverse nitaku.

they have different uses, but low P series is standard for any character, you should already know how it's used..

EDIT:

as for b,df+p+k, natrually, it's a small risk with big reward as you get b+p+k launcher or ff+k+g hit throw guaranteed if you exicute early enough. --- it also switch your foot position and ducks high attacks so it can leave you and a nice safe position giving you good choices if you whiff but duck a high attack.

you also use this differently, for instance you block a safe move (i.e -2 or 3) and opp goes for low P to win at dis, instead of going for a small reward with df+p, you can guess a low sabaki and get a high damage launcer. just out of the player's choice really.

 

Hmm yeah my bad I see the possible rewards for and + outweigh the disadvantages and risks. But I still stand by the fact that or + into shoulder ram isn't always the brightest idea.

 

it's always worked for me. the only characters who tend to punish me for using it a little to liberally are Lei, Sarah and a very well played Shun.

 

=/ I would imagine the shoulder ram to be much more punishable, beyond just Lei Sarah and Shun. Guaranteed for anyone who has that at the very least. easily for Kage, for a floater leading to a 56 ish damage combo. I don't know I just never wanted to follow up with shoulder, well at least not against human players.

 

Huh?

[ QUOTE ]
=/ I would imagine the shoulder ram to be much more punishable, beyond just Lei Sarah and Shun. Guaranteed for anyone who has that at the very least... bla bla bla

[/ QUOTE ]

Just what are you talking about man? Shldrm isn't punchcounterable - it's -10 frames (only TC). What at P speed? Nani at alot of things.

Look, as explained prior; you normally get at normalhit which gets you -2. If you both do after that point his will win and CH yours. But since the shldrms properties, in thie situation (although it's slower in frames then 12) it will win over his fastest attack which would be . That's why it's a good mixup and that's what has been explained in this thread I think already.

/KiwE

 

ok, here's the deal.. say you are against someone with a short elbow like kage


---------- scenario 1

you do b,df+p --- you are at -2.

you go for a low P, opponent goes for a 14 frame elbow.

you get staggered, the opponent gets followup choices.

------------ scenario 2

you do b,df+p ---- you are at -2

you do shlrm

opponent goes for a 14 frame elbow

you duck the elbow and get large stagger

-----------

this is also applies to iff the opponent reacts with a low P instead, the same things will happen depending on what you do.

basically, the only attack you can do at this stage is shlrm, or you risk taking big damage --- it is shrlm or defensive measures, not offense. it totally cuts reverse choice game in half exept for characters with longer elbows like jacky (etc).. for these characters, it is about taking defense measures like P+K sabaki - throw escapes. or fuzzy guarding to avoid the choice against -2 disadvantage.

shrlm doesnt get a guaranteed attack on it, only throw, so sometimes you can even be lazy and attack if the opponent is too slow to react with throw (but not likely vs CPU - just stick to throw escapes)