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How many frames takes moves like 'crouch dash', 'turning around', 'enter to stance'..

Discussion in 'Dojo' started by 40i4, Sep 2, 2012.

  1. 40i4

    40i4 Well-Known Member

    PSN:
    mrxliiv
    XBL:
    xliiv360
    Like the topic..
    - 'crouch dash'
    - crouch
    - turning from 'back turnded'
    - turning from 'side turnded'
    - enter to stance (is it generall for all chars?)
    - enter to stance from move which has option for that ..

    I need this for this..
    Suppose i did blaze P on guard so i got +2 .. then i could contiune with 2_3PK (exe:14f) and beat opponents P(12f) (because equal frames with +2 adv., mine is biggger dmg)..
    Everthing is fine except 'crouch dash' takes frames, how many?
    I'd like to know analogous situation for other from upper list.
     
  2. AnimalStaccato

    AnimalStaccato Well-Known Member

    Backturned to normal=6 frames
    Sideturned to normal=3 frames
    Crouch whilst holding guard=1 frame
    Crouch dash=??
     
  3. Unicorn

    Unicorn Well-Known Masher Content Manager Wolf

    PSN:
    unicorn_cz
    XBL:
    unicorn cz
    1 frame to transit into crouching state vs attacks, 5 vs throws. You get 1 fram delay when buffering "from crouch" moves, but... if buffered really early in the buffer window, there is no delay
    1 frame to transit into crouching state vs attacks, 6 (??) vs throws.
    supposed to be 6 frames, but saw some testing which states it is 5. dunno how credible it was tough
    supposed to be 3 frames, but saw some testing which states it is 2. dunno how credible it was tough
    character/move dependant
    this should be in my 1st answer

    This is what I know/remember. I may be wrong, but hopefully I am not.

    edit: you may ask chanchai to look at your questions, he knows a lot about VF
     
  4. Manjimaru

    Manjimaru Grumpy old man

    PSN:
    manjimaruFI
    XBL:
    freedfrmtheReal
    7 frames to crouch from standing position with [2][G]. Hasnt changed since vanilla.

    If you press [2][G] while opponent is doing a high attack or low attack the crouching is instantaneous.

    ps. entering stances is different for each case.
     
  5. Chill

    Chill +40 DP Content Manager Shun Gold Supporter

    PSN:
    Chill58
    XBL:
    Chill PKG
    There are different stages to be aware of when turning around. So if you did an attack that left your character back-turned and then immediately held guard:

    - On the 4th frame you would transition from back-turned to side-turned
    - On the 6th frame you can begin guarding attacks but are still side-turned
    - On the 10th frame you are no longer side-turned

    This is from a theoretical even situation, so also include any frame advantage/disadvantage.
     
  6. Feck

    Feck Well-Known Member Content Manager Akira

    Pretty sure you can't avoid the one frame delay with standing moves inputted from crouching. Moves with inputs like [3][3][P] are also prone to 1f delay but this can be avoided by buffering.

    6f from backturned (with [2]+[G]?)
    3f from Sideturned
    7f Crouch
    5f Crouch Dash

    That all sounds right to me, not sure about Backwards Crouch Dash.
     
  7. Unicorn

    Unicorn Well-Known Masher Content Manager Wolf

    PSN:
    unicorn_cz
    XBL:
    unicorn cz
    Thx for clarification, I was under impression this was made 1 frame faster in FS, dunno why
    This is what I found about this topic in VFDC wiki (in glossary to be specific); I believe this works in FS in the some way it was working in Vanilla..?
     
  8. Feck

    Feck Well-Known Member Content Manager Akira

    Yep, that's not referring to standing moves from crouching. It's talking about moves with multiple directional inputs like [6][6][P], [3][3][P] etc.
     
  9. Unicorn

    Unicorn Well-Known Masher Content Manager Wolf

    PSN:
    unicorn_cz
    XBL:
    unicorn cz
    And how it works vice versa? I always tought that like this, I can avoid 1-frame delay if performing from crouch move inputted from standing state (what was in original question)?

    Edit: I just re-read what you post originally and I am afraid I am arguing with someone who agrees with me (about stand->crouch moves)..? If yes, I am sorry for my bad english and poor attention combined when reading your post-
     
  10. Feck

    Feck Well-Known Member Content Manager Akira



    Not sure what you're asking here but as for the OP's question then I have no idea. In the VF I play high moves don't beat [2][P] :p
     
  11. Unicorn

    Unicorn Well-Known Masher Content Manager Wolf

    PSN:
    unicorn_cz
    XBL:
    unicorn cz
    I mean if you buffer from-crouch move properly after standing-move in FS, can you avoid that 1-frame delay?
    Like in P into 2_3PK with Blaze the original post was asking about?

    I was always under impression you can avoid that 1-frame delay like it is described on VFDC wiki; but now I am confused.
     
  12. Feck

    Feck Well-Known Member Content Manager Akira

    Looks like I read his and your post wrong too. You seemed to be talking about inputting standing moves from a crouching state though, whereas he's talking about inputting from crouch moves from a standing state. My reading comprehension is terrible :)

    I think the 1f loss is always there when buffering from crouch moves from a standing position, not 100% sure though. Someone should be able to shed more light on it.
     
  13. Manjimaru

    Manjimaru Grumpy old man

    PSN:
    manjimaruFI
    XBL:
    freedfrmtheReal
    No you cannot. The minimum of 1 frame loss is always there when buffering a "from crouch" move from standing position. This is because while it is possible to do a from crouch-move from the first frame of crouchdash, you still NEED to initiate that crouch dash.

    As far as I know, there is no loss when doing a standing move from crouching however, unless you are forced to do a dash to avoid wrong move, in which case its propably same issue as with crouch dash.

    It is possible to avoid the 1 frame loss doing a move with multiple directional inputs however, by buffering the entire input. This is a different case from a situation where there is a crouch dash or normal dash required.
     
  14. 40i4

    40i4 Well-Known Member

    PSN:
    mrxliiv
    XBL:
    xliiv360
    Could we summarize it? with examples, because i'm a bit confused :D
     
  15. Feck

    Feck Well-Known Member Content Manager Akira

    You wasn't the only one :p

    Moves with mutliple directional inputs like [4][4], [6][6], [3][3] etc. = No 1f loss if buffered correctly, can be very difficult to buffer correctly in certain situations.

    From crouch moves buffered from standing = 1f loss even when buffered correctly. e.g Blaze [2_][3][P]+[K] from standing.

    Standing moves inputted from a crouching postion = no 1f loss unless the input for the standing move clashes with a crouching move input. e.g Inputting Akira [4][6][P] (standing palm) from crouching will result in double palm instead, to get [4][6][P] you'd need to input [6][6][4][6][P] or similar which would result in a 1f loss.

    That's about it right?
     
    Tricky likes this.
  16. Manjimaru

    Manjimaru Grumpy old man

    PSN:
    manjimaruFI
    XBL:
    freedfrmtheReal
    Yes, thats it. The 1f loss is caused by the obligatory dash of some sort. Whether its crouch dash needed to do a from crouch move, or a dash needed to do a standing move from crouch that would otherwise clash with a from crouch move input (like Akira standing palm and double palm). If you need that minimum 1 frame of dash, you got a 1 frame loss.
     
  17. Unicorn

    Unicorn Well-Known Masher Content Manager Wolf

    PSN:
    unicorn_cz
    XBL:
    unicorn cz
    After some rtesting, I can definitelly say that when it comes to BLOCKING, the REALL advantage against backturned opponent is not +6, but +5.
    If you are +12 and opponent is BT, then you will hit him with 17 frames move, but 18 frames move he will block (while sideturned).
     

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