I just received the U.S. version

Discussion in 'The Vault' started by ice-9, Oct 20, 1999.

  1. ice-9

    ice-9 Well-Known Member

    Been playing it for a bit, some quick impressions:

    1. Lighting seems to be better (on both characters and stages), but not much.
    2. Kage's hips look slightly better, Shun's still has problems.
    3. Training Mode not as annoying as the Japanese version, but not as comprehensive as FFM.

    Is the domestic version worth getting if you have the import? For most people, I'd say no. But for the truly hardcore, the training mode may make all the difference.

    Here's some interesting facts about some of Kage's more damaging "staple" combos:

    TFT -> knee -> P(G) -> P(G) -> P,P -> slide = 95 points damage

    TFT -> knee -> PK(G) -> b+K+G -> kageyaiba = 105 points damage; more powerful than I expected (done on Sarah)

    TFT -> knee-> P,P,K -> slide = 107 points damage; on less than perfect knees you may register 98 points damage instead

    TFT -> knee -> P(G) -> P,P,K -> slide = 107 points damage; it seems the extra punch version is mostly for show (done on Sarah)

    Other "standard" TFT combos (from non-perfect knees) = 84 points damage

    Note that the only TFT combo I listed above that I'm sure is 100% perfect is TFT -> knee -> P,P,K -> slide. Maybe I'm having a bad day, but it doesn't seem as though I can connect TFT -> knee -> P(G) -> P,P,K -> slide on Akira (which I usually can). The damage listed above was tested on Sarah.

    ice-9 | Sennin
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    knees...

    a "perfect" knee does 47 points (minor counter damage), and the opponent shoots higher up and forward more than if he got hit by a "imperfect" knee, which does the regular 38. in fact, all moves do an extra % damage after the tft if you hit within the correct time.

    i've never been able to lock down the exact time areas for when the CPU will consider it perfect or not, but it seems to me that earlier is better. if you buffer in a knee asap after the tft you'll get the 47 point knee, as opposed to waiting till the last frame and doing the knee.

    jeff, as a kage player, and one with a pretty good knee, and as someone who owns the arcade TB, you'll have to trust me when i say that the DC is completely full of shit when it comes to kage's TFT. TFTknee,ppk,slide never works like it does on the DC. NEVER. i've had the board for months now, and i've only been able to get knee,ppk,slide on level ground THREE TIMES (and with sarah). of course it's a different story with sloping ground, or with the lighter characters, but there's just no way you can do it as easily as on the DC. and TFT,knee,P,PPK,slide is not ever going to happen on any character on flat ground in the arcade version. ever.

    TFT, knee, P, b+P,K, df+K is my staple TFT combo on the arcade version. works on nearly all terrain and on all characters, and does 98-100 points.

    i don't know what's up with the TFT, knee, P, PPK, slide damage...maybe a punch missed? it can do up to 111 points, but it'll usually do 109. i have a huge list here: you'll see that seemingly identical combos do less or more damage, because of the air combo repetition rule in VF3.

    i'll end with the list, which will look completely fucked up on this board because for some reason everything i type or copy and paste comes out in html and/or a different font, and it never looks like it SHOULD...i'll also email you the list in case you want to put it up somewhere else on your page.

    -rich

    ----------------------
    <pre><font face=courier>

    Knee floats:



    Knee counts as the first hit. If done correctly it causes 47 points of damage.



    2nd hit(s) 3rd hit(s) 4th hit 5th hit Total damage

    -------------------------------------------------------------------

    F+P (8) b/d+K (15) -- -- 70

    F+P (8) d,u/f,K (15) -- -- 70

    F+P (8) F+PKG (6) d+K (10) -- 71

    F+P (8) d/f+P+K (18) -- -- 73

    F+P (8) F+P (6) F+P,P (12) -- 73

    F+P (8) F+PKG (6) d/f+K (13) -- 74

    F+P (8) F+PKG (6) b/d+K (14) -- 75

    F+P (8) F+P (6) FC, d/f+P (14) -- 75

    F+P (8) F+P (6) d+P+K (14) -- 75

    F+P (8) F+P (6) d,u/f,K (15) -- 76

    F+P (8) F+P (6) d/f+K (15) -- 76

    F+P (8) F+P (6) f,f+K (15) -- 76

    F+P (8) P (8) d+P+K (14) -- 77

    F+P (8) F+P (6) d/f+P+K (16) -- 77

    F+P (8) f+P+K,P+K (22) -- -- 77

    F+P (8) b,b+P (0) d+K (23) -- 78

    F+P (8) P (8) d,u/f,K (15) -- 78

    F+PKG (8) b/d+PK (25) -- -- 80

    F+P (8) P (8) f,f+K (17) -- 80

    F+PKG (8) b/d+PPP (25) -- -- 80

    d/f+K (17) f,f+K (17) -- -- 81

    d+P+K (15) f,f+K (21) -- -- 83

    F+PKG (8) u/f+K (15) [G] d/f+K (13) -- 83

    F+PPPb+K (36) -- -- -- 83

    F+P (8) F+P (6) run,K (23) -- 84

    F+P (8) F+P (6) F+P (6) f,f+K (17) 84

    F+P (8) f,f+K+G (30) -- -- 85

    F+P (8) f,f+P+K+G (30) -- -- 85

    F+PKG (8) f,d,d/f+P (30) -- -- 85

    F+P (8) d/f+K+G (30) -- -- 85

    F+P (8) P (8) run,K (23) -- 86

    F+P (8) F+P (6) P (7) f,f+K (18) 86

    F+PPP (24) f,f+K (15) -- -- 86

    F+P (8) F+PPK (33) -- -- 86

    d/f+K (17) run,K (23) -- -- 87

    F+PKG (8) b,b+K+G (9) d+K (23) -- 87

    F+P (8) F+PPPb+K (32) -- -- 87

    F+P (8) F+PKG (6) f,d,d/f+P (27) -- 88

    F+P (8) F+P (6) d/f+K+G (27) -- 88

    F+P (8) PPK (33) -- -- 88

    F+P (8) b+K+G (23) d+K (10) -- 88

    F+PPb+P (28) [G] d/f+K (13) -- -- 88

    F+PKG (8) u/f+K (15) f,f+K (19) -- 89

    F+PPPK (42) -- -- -- 89

    F+P (8) PPPb+K (34) -- -- 89

    F+P (8) P (8) d/f+K+G (27) -- 90

    F+P (8) f+P (16) f,f+K (19) -- 90

    F+P (8) d/f+K (17) f,f+K (18) -- 90

    F+P (8) F+P (6) F+P (6) run,K (23) 90

    F+PPb+P (28) f,f+K (15) -- -- 90

    F+PKG (8) b/d+PPK (36) -- -- 91

    F+P (8) d+P+K (15) f,f+K (18) -- 92

    F+PKG (8) F+K (19) f,f+K (22) -- 92

    F+PKG (8) b/u+K+G (38) -- -- 93

    F+PK (23) run,K (23) -- -- 93

    F+P (8) d+P+K (15) run,K (23) -- 93

    F+PPb+PK (46) -- -- -- 93

    F+P (8) F+PPPK (38) -- -- 93

    F+P (8) d/f+K (17) run,K (23) -- 95

    F+P (8) F+PPb+PK (40) -- -- 95

    F+P (8) PPPK (40) -- -- 95

    F+P (8) PPb+PK (42) -- -- 97

    F+P (8) F+PK (20) run,K (23) -- 98

    F+P (8) b+PK (32) d/f+K (13) -- 100

    F+P (8) PK (22) run,K (23) -- 100

    F+P (8) d+K+G (27) run,K (22) -- 104

    F+P (8) b+K+G (23) f,d,d/f+P (27) -- 105

    F+P (8) b+K+G (23) d/f+K+G (27) -- 105

    F+PPK (37) run,K (23) -- -- 107

    F+P (8) F+PPK (31) run,K (23) -- 109

    F+P (8) b+PK (32) run,K (23) -- 110

    F+P (8) PPK (33) run,K (23) -- 111



    Genyo (b+K+G) floats:



    Genyo counts as the first hit. If done correctly it does 37 points of damage.



    2nd hit(s) 3rd hit(s) 4th hit Total damage

    ----------------------------------------------------------

    P (8) d,u/f,K (15) -- 60

    P (8) f+P+K,P+K (22) -- 67

    P (8) P (8) d,u/f,K (15) 68

    u/b+K+G (37) -- -- 74

    PKG (8) f,d,d/f+P (30) -- 75

    PKG (8) f,f+P+K+G (30) -- 75

    d/b+PPK (40) -- -- 77

    P (8) PPK (33) -- 78

    PPPK (42) -- -- 79

    f,d,d/f+P (30) d/f+K [G] (13) -- 80

    d/b+PPPK (45) -- -- 82

    PK (23) run,K (23) -- 83

    PPb+PK (46) -- -- 83

    P (8) PPPK (40) -- 85

    d/b+PK (26) run,K (23) -- 86

    d/b+PPb+PK (49) -- -- 86

    f,d,d/f+P (30) f,d,d/f+P (23) -- 90

    P (8) b+K+G (23) f,d,d/f+P (27) 95

    P (8) b+K+G (23) d/f+K+G (27) 95

    PPK (37) run,K (23) -- 97

    </font>
    </pre>

    Almost all of the other knee combos can be done after the genyo anyway. The same goes for wall TFT, DP combos.
     
  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    jesus i hate web boards, all of them.

    "all moves do an extra % damage after the tft if you hit within the correct time"

    that's supposed to be an extra 25 percent.

    -rich
     
  4. Kruza

    Kruza Well-Known Member

    XBL:
    Kruza
    Hehe... now where have I seen this before? I still have all the info on these TFT combos that you've sent me last year by e-mail, Rich! And after all the months of trying... I still can't do a consistent TFT -> knee if my life depended on it! Dammit... I envy all of you TFT-combo-crazed Kage players that rarely has trouble pulling out this move whenever you want to! :)

    Kruza
     
  5. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

    PSN:
    Myke623
    XBL:
    Myke623
    Rich, I edited your list by surrounding it with "pre" and "font face=courier" tags so that it appears as it should, and is much more readable now. You and anyone else can do this in any future posts which require such formatting.

    <pre>__
    Myke
    </pre>
     
  6. ice-9

    ice-9 Well-Known Member

    Rich, I definitely do not dispute what you are saying. The sad thing is that VF3tb arcades have become so rare in the U.S., the Dreamcast version has become the de fact standard. You'll have to give me that.

    The reason why I don't think the extra P made a difference in damage is again, due to the difference in knees. Because Sarah floats a lot more than Akira, I didn't really need a spot on perfect knee to pull off the combo. Which would support your thesis nicely...Kage combos are messed up on the DC.

    I do think that knee combos are easier on DC, but it's also a lot more difficult to get consistent 100+ combos (i.e. you still need the perfect knee). The DC version is basically a lot more forgiving than the arcade. You can get TFT -> knee -> P,P,K -> slide without a perfect knee, but the damage you get would be similar to any other "standard" perfect knee combo. The "perfect" TFT -> knee -> P,P,K -> slide in the DC version yields the same damage (if not less) than the arcade version.

    It's been so long since I last played an arcade version of TB...I wonder if I would be able to adjust?

    ice-9 | Sennin
     
  7. ice-9

    ice-9 Well-Known Member

    I just got TFT -> knee -> P(G) -> P,P,K -> slide on a middle weight (Lau) pretty consistently.

    The damage I kept getting was 109 points.

    I also tried TFT -> knee -> P(G) -> b+P,K -> QD d/f+K

    It gave me 98 points on a 47 point damage knee.

    The key seems to be a perfect knee, and so far, the most damage I've been able to get is 47 points. This, however, isn't a sure indication of a perfect knee as I've gotten 47 pts off of an extremely late knee.

    It seems like a "standard" perfect knee combo such as TFT -> knee -> P(G) -> P,K -> slide yields 98 pts damage. On a less than perfect knee (I kept getting either 47 pts damage on the knee or 38 pts damage) and without the P(G) I kept getting 84 pts damage for the combo (TFT -> knee -> P,K -> slide).

    Hey, this is pretty cool. The training mode is a lot more useful than I thought. /images/icons/wink.gif I can't wait to try this on other characters...I've always wondered what the "strongest" staple combo is for each character (not that it's really all that important).

    ice-9 | Sennin
     
  8. Llanfair

    Llanfair Well-Known Member

    I hope this doesn't deter you, Jeff, but we're hoping to be playing some of that arcade VF3tb at Toronto.
    ;)

    Cheers,

    <font color=black> Llanfair the prized <font color=green>cabbage</font color=green></font color=black>
     
  9. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Hehez...... that would be great for him actually, since when he comes back to visit Singapore, a TB machine is all he's going to get for challenges. /images/icons/laugh.gif You guys in Toronto make sure he gets used to it again okay ??? /images/icons/smile.gif

    BTW, Jeff, I got some tactics I'm itching to try out on you. /images/icons/wink.gif Then you can go back, and try it on everyone else !!! /images/icons/tongue.gif
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    What a klutz I am.... that was me above. /images/icons/blush.gif

    -Rulakir
     
  11. ice-9

    ice-9 Well-Known Member

    Actually Rulakir, I should be meeting with you Singaporean players first before Toronto!

    ice-9 | Sennin
     
  12. Guest

    Guest Guest

    like i said, i've never been able to lock down when/how/why/where the difference lies in the mC damage (and man, i have tried for hours to see where it does lie). i should also repeat that it's the same deal with all moves after the TFT...experiment with the genyo, and you'll see what i mean. and there's no middle ground: it's either 25 percent extra, or base damage.

    in regards to the "standard 98" points that you seem to be getting, i can only offer one theory...since the 38 point knee usually leaves them closer and lower, then maybe the proximity damage for the slide, because it's closer (23 points off the base 30) makes up for it? maybe the 47 point knee, because it pushes them higher and farther, has it connect for 15 points. i'm sure if i worked it out on a calculator i'd probably find this idea completely wrong but i'm too damn lazy to find out.

    i'll modify my list for the knee,p,b+P,K,df+K. the 100 comes from the gamest, which is wrong. although...if the opponent gets up with an in-place rising attack, the heel swat will MC for much larger damage. too bad no one ever does.

    and chew on these: on my arcade tb records i have a 6-hit, 136 point combo for kage...anyone have any ideas on what the hell that was? i sure don't. also a 7-hit, 108 point combo for taka...no clue on that one either.

    -rich
     

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