Is there things like "Dirty" moves?

Discussion in 'Junky's Jungle' started by koro128, Oct 19, 2001.

  1. koro128

    koro128 Well-Known Member

    I'm sure we do not like moves like punch, followed by a throw.
    moves like Wolf's ring-out throw and KAge's d,d,G+K may be deem dirty tricks by many people.
    But i think those good players will be able to counter such moves.

    When the chill of winter comes to hell, only the fittest resist the Bell. - Navy SEAL
  2. feixaq

    feixaq Well-Known Member

    All those things you mentioned are perfectly valid in the VF world.

    AFAIK, there aren't any "dirty tricks" in VF4 ver.B like Akira's infinite ground punch in VF1, senbon punch in VF2.0, or Lion's uf+K in VF3 ver.A.

  3. Crew Wolf

    Crew Wolf Active Member

    Yeah, for dirty tricks, feel free to turn to Tekken 4. Throwing character balance out the window! If VF is anything, it's pretty damn well balanced. I've been raped by everyone from Aoi to Taka in my day.
    As far as the moves you mentioned, unfortunately I only recognize Wolf's giant swing. I have to admit it is pretty damn strong, but I would never say dirty. Especially with Kage's TFT. And now with the TR out of the swing, and sooo many walls, it's a bit tamer. But most of the moves you might call dirty are simply strong, reliable, and always anticipated. As long as it has some sort of weakness, I'm satisfied.


    ahem...Gooooo SEGA!!

    Ultimately, we're all dead men, sadly we cannot choose how, BUT we can decide how we meet that end in order that we are remembered as men.
  4. Genie47

    Genie47 Well-Known Member

    The punch-throw is very valid and very VF. Harks back to the ol' days of VF1. Not dirty, just nasty :)

    Every VF character guide strongly advises on mixing up. Punch-throw is one of the mixes. VF4 is pretty well ironed out. If there is a dirty move like in Lion's infinite pounce in VF3, I'm sure such usage will bring about distaste in people that they will not use it in versus matches. This community of players in general are good, decent and like clean fun. Don't worry and just play :)

    Chia Jin Ngee
    "...we live in the Age of Bacteria" - Stephen Jay Gould
  5. capercat

    capercat Well-Known Member

    i guess punch-throw still gets a bad rep with some people from back in the days of ticking (SF2 guile ... >_<). in tekken some people still make noises at me when i do that ... so thats my attitude ... not dirty just mean and sometimes effective.
    anyways kind of an interesting topic to a newbie ... don't want to go out and anger the experienced players who can help me learn ... so it's actually kind of good to know there are no dirty tactics that will allow me to win without learning ... inspires more respect in the game, if that is worth anything.
  6. ice-9

    ice-9 Well-Known Member

    > This community of players in general are good, decent and like clean fun. Don't worry and just play :)

    You gotta be kidding! I remember when I started out a LOT of Singaporean players were abusing Lion's u/f+K. Not to mention the freezing bug when that came out.
  7. SummAh

    SummAh Well-Known Member

    Aye Jeff..I remember those days..the pain~

    <font color=red>~~~ 'Flock off feather brain, or u can stick around and find out the hard way!/versus/images/icons/mad.gif~~~'
  8. Yamcha

    Yamcha Well-Known Member

    Not really, but I remember Almaci saying something about him doing u/f+K with Kage in Japan and it being frowned upon big time.
  9. SummAh

    SummAh Well-Known Member

    Re: Is there things like "Dirty" moves?

    I suppose at the end of the's a matter of personal taste.
    everyone's got a move they really hate ( bugs aside of coz)

    Sometimes I think Kage is designed to win...think abt it, TFT, a throw is almost every direction of ur stick, etc etc etc...
    TFT RO=cheap~

    But dyam..he's hard to use at high levels ( not to mention he can get kinda boring)

    Personally, I've always had a huge dislike for ppl who like to do P, P, then throw.

    Jeez...if ur intention is to throw me..then throw damn it ( watch my clip and u'll see what I mean)..I've always felt PP throw is like the old SF2 warrior...that's what made the Chibita Java Tea clip so impressive...supreme yomi..non of the PP..then push u outta the ring...

    Then again, I find people who do nothing but lotsa PPP, then switching to maybe a low k...make a mid level move...continue with a PPP to be realllllly 'boring and cheap'
    There's always sometimes better than PPP~!

    I also find Jacky's ESK to be a low comittment, high priority move. There's always a better option instead of the boring ESK~! Since the day I started playing VF3, I have hated this move and I find ppl who use Jacky n ESK all day to be realllllly " cheap" ( but heck..I will admit acknowledge their skills)

    Sometimes I think ppl call a move 'cheap' because they have died at the hands of that move so many times...the only way to vent their anger is to call it ' CHEAP'.

    Bugs aside of coz

    ( god, did I just annouced to the world I die at the hands of a PPP move quite often?) /versus/images/icons/shocked.gif

    <font color=red>~~~ 'Flock off feather brain, or u can stick around and find out the hard way!/versus/images/icons/mad.gif~~~'
  10. alantan

    alantan Well-Known Member

    u/f+K for kage in VF4b??

    I do not play Kage but is it the forward sommersalt kick? I think that move even when blocked leaves Kage with loads of initiative cuz I THINK I remember trying to P (lion) after blocking it and I got interrupted... I may be wrong though...
  11. Yamcha

    Yamcha Well-Known Member

    No he was talking about VF3, just the little hop jump. I was as puzzled as you are.
  12. gribbly

    gribbly Well-Known Member

    Personal taste, yeah, but my opinion is that there is no such thing as a dirty move (as long as it's not a bug -- I admit up front that sometimes the lines between bug, tuning imbalance, and simply a powerful move are sometimes very blurry).

    But in general if it's possible to do in the game, it's a valid strategy. Even ticking with Guile :) I get as upset as anybody when someone beats me with moves that are technically much easier than what I'm doing. It's natural, but it's also missing the point. These are *fighting* games, the object of any fight is to *win*.

    That's one of the things I like about VF -- it's more like a real fight than most other fighting games. The simple, quick, brutal moves are usually *waaay* more effective than the flashy and spectacular ones. Just like a real fight, being flashy is a quick way to get yourself hurt :)

    I'm getting OT aren't I? Anyway... if it's within the rules, it's not cheap, that's my opinion.

  13. Mr. Bungle

    Mr. Bungle Well-Known Member

    The van Halen kick? Well, in VF2 and VF3 this was a mid that was as fast as Akira's DE and SDE (10 frames). Faster than his own elbow. Always knocked down, didn't stagger, usually didn't float high enough for a float, little damage, but fast. It was pretty mC'able in VF3 but in VF2 it was uncounterable.

    So if it's back to uncounterable in VF4, and just as fast...I could see some of the pissier Japanese players with weird hang ups about move "fairness" complaining about the van Halen. Stupid, really.

    "A chem bla deshembla blurr fuh bli fouzh"
  14. Genie47

    Genie47 Well-Known Member

    When I say community, I mean the legitimate community here. Not the egoist out to bruise everyone.

    There will always be some kind of effective counter to such play. I dunno, but I try to be creative in my playing. Sarah's FL moves seem to add much flavor. Now trying to end my bouts with any FL move :)

    Hehe! People getting nightmares from Jacky players. I have them too ;)

    Chia Jin Ngee
    ...we live in the Age of Bacteria - Stephen Jay Gould
  15. Shadowdean

    Shadowdean Well-Known Member

    Hrmm...that is why flash kicks are so powerfull?

    "Victory can be anticipated, but not assured" Sun-Tzu
  16. koro128

    koro128 Well-Known Member

    THanks folks, didnt expect so many replies in a night but basically i agree any thing by the book is considered valid and fair. As I use kage, a lot of times i will use b,b,K+G and the usual follow ups. When fighting fast characters like Pai, Aoi or Lau, i'll have to use d+p to break up the momentum. it may seem cheap but definitely necessay and tactical :)

    In addition , quick get-ups in VF4 ensures that even pounces are not guaranteed anymore.

    Further more you dun need fancy moves, or even know new VF4 moves to beat an opponent. Last nite i was humbled at AMK by a Lau who basically uses moves from VF3 who is equally deadly. Lost 2 games to 1.

    afternoon i'll be making a trip down Bugis. Hope to exchange pointers with you guys later....

    When the chill of winter comes to hell, only the fittest resist the Bell. - Navy SEAL

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