Jeffry TKOD and other hit throws

Discussion in 'Jeffry' started by Zato, Apr 2, 2002.

  1. Zato

    Zato Member

    I have heard somewhere that Jeffry's TKOD is unstoppable if the toe kick connects. I interpreted that statement in such a way as to say that not only can the throw not be broken (with f+P or even df+P; I know this part is true BTW) but that the execution frames of the throw could not be interrupted. However, not only does the PS2 combo counter (which, except for downed attacks and stagger combos, I have found to be fairly accurate) not count the TKOD as a two hit but if you record a TKOD and replay it against yourself, you can interrupt the throw with a LP or other quick attack. Since there are no switch-ups from the toe kick, what is the point besides hoping that your opponent is slow? This is the case with Wolf's uf+P --> b+P+G as well.

    However, there are other hit throws such as Wolf's b+K+G --> P+G and Aoi's f,f+P --> P+G (I think; I don't play Aoi) that count as a combo on the counter and I have been unable to interrupt.

    Is my timing off or what? I can only get the TKOD (and Wolf's uf+P hit throw) to come out if I do them REALLY slow (Jeffry puts the leg he did the toe kick with back on the ground as I am hitting P+G).

    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. Tetra

    Tetra Well-Known Member

    That's the way i do tkod too. do the last part exactly when his foot is back on the ground. That's the only way i can do it anyway....
     
  3. Nutlog

    Nutlog Well-Known Member

    Um...there is a switch up for the toe, kick...pressing punch instead of the QCF+P+G gives the "hammer punch" move that will hit mid and stuff low punches 100%, unless you put extreme delay in.
     
  4. ice-9

    ice-9 Well-Known Member

    For the TKOD, your timing will actually depend on how the opponent struggles. The more he struggles, the later the timing. However, if timed correctly, it is guaranteed (that is the theory explained to me, at least). As you've noticed, the timing is very difficult to get down, especially against a smart human defender.

    You're probably better off just doing the d+K MC > throw. You're at +5 on MC, which means the throw opportunity isn't guaranteed, but it's still pretty good.
     
  5. fagan

    fagan Well-Known Member

    a new question

    i've been trying to get jeff's /versus/images/commands/b.gif/versus/images/commands/df.gif/versus/images/commands/g.gif/versus/images/commands/k.gif /versus/images/commands/d.gif/versus/images/commands/p.gif/versus/images/commands/g.gif hit throw to work but i can never time it right. even in slow mo training i still can't get the stupid move to work. i try to input it super fast: nothing. as soon as the headbutt hits: nothing. after the headbutt: nothing ... any tips on landing this move?

    thanks

    Fagan
     
  6. Sudden_Death

    Sudden_Death Well-Known Member

    Re: a new question

    its not gonna work, cause they took it out in ver B..unless you're playing ver C...then just do it slow
     
  7. Llanfair

    Llanfair Well-Known Member

    [ QUOTE ]
    For the TKOD, your timing will actually depend on how the opponent struggles. The more he struggles, the later the timing.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Really? I never knew this, nor have I noticed it. I get the TKoD at least once per match and I do the same timing every time - at least I think I do. /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif Nonetheless, if your opponent struggles their ass off but doesn't do a move, they'll get thrown. From what we've seen, in order to struggle out of it, from a normal hit, the opponent must perform a move. Simply struggling and dashing or coruching or dodging will get them thrown anyway.
     
  8. ice-9

    ice-9 Well-Known Member

    I'm not sure if what I wrote last year was correct either as I also always do the TKOD with the same timing (and land it frequently as well)...it was at least true for VF3 though.
     
  9. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

    PSN:
    Myke623
    XBL:
    Myke623
    If you MC with the toe kick, then the splash mountain is guaranteed with the right timing. As Llan said, and I'm sure ice-9 will now agree, you can't "struggle" to reduce recovery, but you can try doing an attack to stop Jeffry should he stuff up the timing.

    I remember a great video (probably from daioh) where a Jeffry player successfully pulled a TKoD. In the same, or next round, he landed the toe kick again, and his opponent reacted with /versus/images/commands/d.gif/versus/images/commands/p.gif in fear of another splash. Jeffry anticipated this and low threw the whiffed low punch. Beautiful.
     
  10. mindelixir

    mindelixir Well-Known Member

    That hit throw you speak of, it's /versus/images/commands/b.gif/versus/images/commands/p.gif/versus/images/commands/g.gif, not down,P,G.... and that's why its not working. Headbutt, toss.... I wish they left it in evo.... but unfortunatly they did not.
     
  11. GodEater

    GodEater Well-Known Member

    [ QUOTE ]
    I remember a great video (probably from daioh) where a Jeffry player successfully pulled a TKoD. In the same, or next round, he landed the toe kick again, and his opponent reacted with /versus/images/commands/d.gif+/versus/images/commands/p.gif in fear of another splash. Jeffry anticipated this and low threw the whiffed low punch. Beautiful.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    This is a tactic straight from VF1 where no matter how the toe kick connected the splash was not guaranteed. Kashiwa Jeffery used to use the toekick as a "I'm going to really hurt you now" set up. The MC guarantee of the toekick is great for Jeff now but the setups still remain.

    GE
     
  12. BK__

    BK__ Well-Known Member

    myke,

    the way you (and others) are disscussing the TKoD, it sounds like the way the exicution of wolf's /versus/images/commands/uf.gif+/versus/images/commands/p.gif ~ /versus/images/commands/f.gif+/versus/images/commands/p.gif+/versus/images/commands/g.gif would be, is this right? - correct me if i'm wrong, but it seems like an entire different story to hit throws such as his Toe Kick Stunner, or vanessa's /versus/images/commands/f.gif/versus/images/commands/f.gif+/versus/images/commands/k.gif+/versus/images/commands/g.gif ~ /versus/images/commands/f.gif+/versus/images/commands/p.gif+/versus/images/commands/g.gif.

    are there different types of hit throws or something? i find that wolf's /versus/images/commands/uf.gif+/versus/images/commands/p.gif ~ /versus/images/commands/f.gif+/versus/images/commands/p.gif+/versus/images/commands/g.gif seems to need either a dead opponent, or supremely strict timing, however, i never get the feeling it is ever guarenteed - or doable against a moving opponent. The toe kick stunner seems to *appear* unescapable in comparison, am i missing something about hit throws?

    interesting topic btw, sorry to spoil it with my n00bish thoughts ppl. /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
     
  13. kbcat

    kbcat Well-Known Member

    Wolf's /versus/images/commands/uf.gif+/versus/images/commands/p.gif/versus/images/commands/f.gif+/versus/images/commands/p.gif+/versus/images/commands/g.gif, and Jeff's /versus/images/commands/d.gif+/versus/images/commands/k.gif/versus/images/commands/d.gif/versus/images/commands/df.gif/versus/images/commands/f.gif+/versus/images/commands/p.gif+/versus/images/commands/g.gif are "old style" hit throws where in order to get the throw you have to wait for the move to recover before entering the throw command (Taka's hit throws in VF3 were the same).

    The consequence of this is that there are instances where the opponent recovers at the same time or before Wolf/Jeff -- so, the opponent can attack to put themselves into a state where the game won't allow them to be thrown. It may seem like these hit-throws are useless because of this, but they're not. Sega had the foresight to make them guarranteed on MC. Why are they guarranteed? Because Wolf/Jeff recovers before the opponent in these cases.

    All the others hit throws are "new style" where the throw command coincides with the move impacting the opponent. So all of those are guarranteed (if you meet the hit requirements -- i.e. on block, on MC, etc).


    cheers,
    kbcat
     
  14. fagan

    fagan Well-Known Member

    i was actualy looking at an old move list from ver C that had a /versus/images/commands/d.gif/versus/images/commands/p.gif/versus/images/commands/g.gif version of the hit throw listed, when i checked the move list today that move isn't there (cuz it doesn't exist /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif ... my bad

    Fagan
     

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