Korean Tekken Experts disappointed with T4

I know , it's a Vf-forum, but maybe you're interested to know what some tekken pro's think about the most famous VF-Rival

Some famous Tekken players seem to be very dissapointed with T4.Top-Player Park Suyong said he stoped playing T4.
Tekken-Expert Jang said that the game isn't enjoyable, because often you loose against bad players(button-mashers?), luck often decides the outcome of battles , Pro-player Gijae commented he won't continue to play T4,
Digital Lee mentioned that the japanese Tekken Elite thinks the same.....

many people say that in Tekken the probability is higher then in other fighters that a very good player looses against a less good player. maybe this gap has become even more little.

If this is the case , maybe there is a connection with the preasure the T4 team had, to bring the game out in time (VF4 launch)

source: Digital lee

question: Did you hear bad VF4 Feedback from famous Japanese Players(chibita & Co)


original german text:

ARCADE: Koreanische Profi-Tekken-Spieler sind mit Tekken 4 nicht zufrieden. So hat der Top-Player Park Suyong bereits das Handtuch geworfen und will nicht länger Tekken 4 spielen. Tekken-Experte Jang kommentiert, dass Tekken 4 keinen Spass macht und der Sieg zur Hälfte von Glück entschieden wird. Es seien keine Fähigkeiten für einen Sieg notwendig und Anfänger könnten jeden Hardcore-Experten besiegen. Profi-Klopper Gijae wird Tekken 4 ebenfalls nicht weiter spielen. Wie Digital Lee berichtet, denken die japanischen Elite-Spieler dasselbe und sind mit Tekken 4 unzufrieden.
cya


<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by nascarbryant on 08/13/01 07:47 PM (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[I posted this in the general forum, but it seems like most people bookmark the VF forum directly, so I'm posting here again just for the fun of it... plus I desperately need to get the "newbie" subtitle off my nick, so... =P]

I'm fast coming to the conclusion that in a sequel, you never please more than 50% of the old school hardcore players except in rare instances. I see the same pattern in Quake 1-->Q2-->Q3, Unreal 1-->UT, Daytona 1--> Daytona 2, Time Crisis 1 --> TC2, Tribes 1-->T2... now Virtua Fighter 3-->VF4 and Tekken 3/TTT-->T4.

The common trend seems to be that game developers are always on the lookout to expand the player base, and usually add more "balancing features" and nerf some tricks that experts used to employ to gain the upper hand... thereby making the game more "accessible"; this in turn makes the game more of a mainstream success but ends up alienating some old hands.

Heck, it's the same thing in the restaurant business... the push to go mainstream typically has an associated negative effect (In & Out vs McDonalds, Coffee Bean vs Starbucks... the list goes on).

And... my point being...? Nothing. Just an observation =)

 

certanly it's to early to make any conclusions. But it seems a liitle strange that a popular corean magazine points out that different famous tekken stars seem "very" dissapointed with the game, mentioning also the Japanese scene. And remember the japanese guy that told us that Tekken isn't so hot in japan. remember that T4 is a very cheap board and should have a wider spread then VF4.
I didn't here a lot of bad VF4 reports or did i maybe miss out something?

 

Um, I didn't mean to imply that VF4 is bad by any means... I love this game! =)

Just that more often than not, there's a general trend towards "balance" and "accessibility" in most sequels, and you usually see some griping associated with this trend.

(I don't know much about the Tekken series, I played T1 and T2 minimally.)

 

I think people are usually complaining (initially) about how the strongpoints of the game's prequel have changed. This is related to balancing a lot... but I think eventually, people find their way to playing the game on a stronger level and it sort of takes its own shape.

Even railgods in Quake 2 found trouble when a lot of people made their routes more efficient (gotta love strafe running, circle jumping, box hopping, slope jumping, and everything else). Again, stressing positional play over combat tactics in Quake 2 over Quake 1 (Quake 1 had strong positional play, but combat skillz could wipe out just about anyone in almost any case--thank goodness for prediction).

Tekken 4 looks like they've changed the way the game is played. In fact, it's probably less accessable than previous games. Balance seems to have changed into a balance of character-strength tactics. Most float combos of the TTT type do jack for damage now. Hwoarang does good damage if he carefully places his kicks, but if he floats his opponent, he practically does half the damage for twice the effort. I have not seen what Kazuya's strengh is yet, aside from probably pressuring an opponent with crazy forward movement (wavedashing) mixed with placed attacks, and then finally cornering the opponent into a wall or obstacle for stronger damage. Steve is a monster in regular play with attacks that seem to do a lot more than his opponents on the smaller level... Sway, hit. Jab, jab, hit. Pressure, pressure, pressure. However, in the long run, looks like he'll require a lot more successful attacks than a lot of other characters when they're strengths become unlocked. Ling can't move as much as she used to with success, but she can still move and certain well placed attacks with her are actually pretty strong. Craig does good damage when he grapples the opponent. Crap damage when he float combos with punch attacks... but when he floats and hits a guy with a kick, it's strong (which seems really interesting to me... looks like there are modifiers on each attack to define its role in the combo algorithm, instead of just a damage based combo algorithm).

What I'm thinking of Tekken 4.... Seems like each character will have a few games they have to play that are much different than other characters. It seems like the general poke, poke, poke, float-->massive damage float combo scheme is toned down to hell or almost gone. In its place, "know thy character." Though float combos look like they do squat damage now.... after watching Craig, I'm guessing that you have to find the right combos and know which attacks damage in floats and which attacks build the ground game. For a person like me, this is a really nice change in Tekken. But I can totally understand that this will turn off A LOT of Tekken 3 and TTT players. Again, this is only speculation, haven't played T4 yet.

-Chanchai

 

Go to the general forum to check out my response, with Chibita's name making a cameo.