Matrix Reloaded & Revolutions Synopsis + Explanation

sanjuro, u hit it right on the nail there

T1 is the best terminator movie.

sure t2 had liquid metal and over the top (but good) action,
T1 always seemed more refined to me.

i remember when i saw it for the first time when i was around the same age. me and my bros were rooting for the t-800 to kill sarah conner.

And the ploice station scene. man there hasnt been a scene to rival that since .

still, the most scariest scene (when your young) is seeing the exoskeleton of the terminator. back in those times, you didnt see it coming. goddamit that sent a shiver up my spine.


end note, matrix will never beat T1 or T2. T3, go figure.........

 

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end note, matrix will never beat T1 or T2. T3, go figure.........

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Yeah, that's fine provided you're aware that it's just your opinion and NOT fact.

Quite strangely, many critics of the Matrix films, or whatever films for that matter, have opinions on films...which is perfectly fine enough, problem is, they then go and turn these "so-called" opinions into "facts" (seemingly they have the magic power to turn an opinion into an actual fact) and then using these "facts" go on to say why such and such is so bad.

Unless my eyesight is going, I see a lot of "opinion > magic transformation into > fact" happening on this thread.

 

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GodEater said:

of all the things you ramble on about this is my absolute favorite: "With an enlightened, unsmug smile gracing my face, I walked out of the cinema and began explaining the movie to him. Somehow, I'd explained the whole of Revolutions and how it fit in with the preceding three films in under three minutes, inadvertantly amassing the rest of the audience around me by the time we reached the parking lot listening in to me breaking it down to my brother. Small, self-directed epiphanic smiles and sounds rumbled through the small crowd and we all went our separate ways, truly having never been more satisfied at any final installment."

GE
<font color="green">M2: Everything is true.
GP: Even false things?
M2: Even false things are true.
GP: How can that be?
M2: I don't know man, I didn't do it.
</font>

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If that was a genuine comment, then thanks.

If you were taking the piss, then...well...oh, why bother...? /versus/images/graemlins/indifferent.gif

 

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KS_Vanessa said:

i think the matrix sequels are perfect examples of a film being totally blown out of proportion.

the only reason all these 'philosophical theorys in the matrix' actually come about is because of the many plot holes and just that the script writers tended to use too much subtext, or basically trying to let the audience know something without actually telling it to them.

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Curious. None of what I wrote was a 'philosophical theory'.

The whole point of what I did was to disprove that the sequels are based all in the subtext - that the basic plot is completely possible to follow without being philosophically informed.

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so instead of ripping the movies apart like people do with the star wars films (an easy target,) fans invent new ideas to fit the plot holes together, trying to convince themselves that the producers meant this and meant that, but didnt want to display such and such detail in the movie so the hardcore fans could work it out.

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I never actually became a Matrix fan until Reloaded.

See, The Matrix was a cool bit of fun. Nothing new for me - I'd seen its elements in all its various forms prior to the movie itself - but it was an entertaining mish-mash of an altogether cliché film.

Reloaded did something I didn't expect it to do - it managed to get past the superficiality of the first film and actually delved deeper into the proverbial rabbit hole than I had expected. The scene in the Architect's chamber became one of the greatest and most impressive movie climaxes of my film-going career.

Having been turned into a Matrix fan after Reloaded, I anticipated Revolutions like I'd never anticipated a film before. As careful as I tried to be not to let my expectations get too far ahead of me, I couldn't help it - I was gagging for Revolutions as I stumbled into the cinema on the opening day. And like I said, it was the greatest climax to any movie trilogy I'd ever seen. But then, this was hardly any movie trilogy.

I think what you non-fans need to do is to stop trying to explain the Matrix fans' raison d'être as being one of trying to "convince themselves" that the trilogy is good and accept that said fans are intelligent human beings like yourself and actually enjoyed the film for reasons as valid as those as yours for hating them.

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I loved the first matrix movie. This was the one film that raised the bar. The last scene with neo and agent smith before his death was ballistic.

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It was rather fun, wasn't it?

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but with the terrible sequels and spinoffs (animatrix was terrible, the only good episode was the history of the rise of the robots,) theres only so much a man can take.

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You didn't like The Animatrix? One of a few, then. Most people I know who couldn't handle the sequels at least had a significant liking for the animated shorts.

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The point im making is that i really hate it when someone tries to make a movie something more than what it really is, like trying to disguise the nausiating movies revolutions and reloaded into philiosophical meanings, when people are just trying to cover up what a bomobsite the movie was.

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And the point I am trying to make is that there are people who actually enjoyed it and that the story of the films is not hidden under philosophy - the 'psuedo-philosophy' excuse is one that seems to be made by those who didn't understand the basic plot points even when they're speled out to you. The actual philosophical references are just that - they're footnotes, side-thoughts. Whle there are certain structures that drive the story, the story itself is not beyond understanding through non-philosophical means, as I had hoped my synopsis would have shown.

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but hey, if you enjoyed the films, good for you. I enjoy the ol terrible ninja flick every now and then, but i dont think ill ever make a study on how the master of the ninja conquered the shaolin school and how it relates to the modern world politics and the mao revolution anytime soon....

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Goody.

 

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KS_Vanessa said:

touche lm, touche

still, i do think that there are a few things blown out of proportion. just because there the names of characters and places seem to be from texts long ago dont really amount to much. All it really says is that the matrix people couldnt come up with some original ideas.

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Actually, the story itself is entirely passable on a surface level. But these parallels and references from so many different religions, myths, legends, etc help to enhance the meaning and depth of the trilogy to an extent that is rarely seen in cinema.

It may not mean much to you, and hey, that's your perogative. But for those who are curious and fascinated by the message that the Wachowskis are trying to convey here (and have a little bit of patience) can get so much out of the trilogy, it's near incomprehensible.

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With all your stuff in the previous post, it just seems to me that the matrix sequels are trying to be everything and ends up amounting to nothing.

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Hardly. LM's just talking about teh references that enrich the trilogy's subtext, and it does not in any way detract from the questions the basic premise itself poses about issues such as what it means to be 'alive' and the nature of freedom.

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lets put it in these words. Basically, its about one mans fight against his enemy, the machines.

How biblical can you get about that?

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That's the kind of one-dimensionality that hinders ones' appreciation of the film.

If you think it's just about being "biblical", then you're already lagging behind a couple of paces.

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lets say i make a film. Its about ninjas who fight in space. hence the title, ninjas from space. Throughout the film, i put alot of 'easter eggs' as one would call it. every now and then i throw in a reference from some text made 200-500 years ago and somehow loosly tie it into my film. Suddenly, my film, bad as it is, isnt just a film no more, way, by god it is its own revelation!

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Again, it's not references made just from "some text". You lack the appreciation of just how many ancient texts overlap at certain points in the movies...and even then the story itself is not beyond comprehension to the less literary.

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thats what really pisses me off. people make too much stuff out of nothing.

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Why does it piss you off? It's not like it's gonna effect your life...is it? /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

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i guess what really pisses me is that the matrix films are entertainment movies. theyre not films that are supposed to break new boundries in terms of social reference, such as 1984 (i love this film to bits). 1984, even though it was a film, was not made for entertainment reasons. why its probably the most depressing film ever. but the social and religious themes run throughout tha film like a juggernaut.

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And The Matrix Trilogy is not endeared by that same quality? I can assure you that that's a gross misconception on your part.

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whereas matrix was a film made for pure entertainment. we have the stunts that make the adrenaline pumping through out our bodies, we have the uber special FX that makes us awe at the clear visuals the film has, we have the final farewells scenes that make us glad that even though trinity died, she got to say goodbye to neo, we have every bit of unrealism that a blockbuster film could get to actually happen in the film. and people love it, because it entertains them and makes them forget about the problems they have for about two hours. sort of like a cheap drug.

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Oh...my... /versus/images/graemlins/lol.gif

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Now if people left it at that. id be okay. however, people take an film, purely for entertainment and profit purposes and try to conjure these elaborate theorys on life and other subjects i would consider to be filed in the 'serious' desk.

hang on, its only supposed to be a entertainment film!!


aw well, im actually glad lm that you posted something substantual at least. thank god i didnt get a 'STFU' esque reply. Theres been way too many of these replies on VFDC lately.

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Yeah, I hate rude people /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

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Painty_J said:

oh boy this is just what i wanted nerds spoling on about nerd shit

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Oh boy, if it bothers you that much, why'd you even click on the thread? /versus/images/graemlins/deadpan.gif

 

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SgtRamrod said:I doesn't matter how many geeky, multi-cultural references those Wachowski Dorks stick in there, the movies do not succeed in the most important sense- as movies!

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Yes, because there's obviously only one way to make a movie...

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The second two movies are so bloated with pretension, self importance, and poor taste that they make me embarrassed for the never-got-laid-before-they-made-The-Matrix directors and their legions of computer-nerd fans.

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Did you just take a stab at me? I think that warrants me to tell you to "shut the fuck up". Now we're even.

Oh, and if you want pretention and self-importance, look the oher way towards Kill Bill. Yeah, that's "dick up the director's ass" for ya.

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I think that the moment that most encapsulates the lameness of The Matrix was from an interview with Keanu Reeves. He was asked how he prepared for his role in the Matrix sequels. His response was something like this:

"I totally read a lot of books, you know, by Foucault and like, a lot of, uh, French Post-Structuralism and stuff."

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That's the way the dude talks. He prepared for the role by nderstanding about all those different things because - as a God-like messiah figure - he has to radiate a sense of calm, confident 'enlightenment' in his relatively monotonous role.

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Maybe the worst thing about those sequels was that they actually made me feel bad about liking the first movie. I think that the ambiguity of the first movie stands in stark contrast to the drawn-out, boring new-agey wankery of the sequels. Not to mention that the first one is actually an entertaining action movie.

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But that's just it - the first movie was so damn non-committed to any real story line that the premise and its set-pieces alone were enough to build enough cool factor to form a fan audience. The point is that the first Matrix, in conjunction with its successors is much more than just "an...action movie".

The point I'm trying to make is that just because you and others may not be able to appreciate that, it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.

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Sorry if I seem to be taking a cyber-dump on anyone's nerd parade.

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It's just the labelling of intelligent human beings under derogatory, one-dimensional and outright obselete terms reserved for shitty teen-coms like Saved By The Bell that gets to me a tad. But, to be honest, that only detracts from your own reputability.

Take the easy road. Be nice.

 

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KTallguy said:

It's fine to be a Nerd.

What I didn't like about Revolutions, is that it suddenly decided to humanize the enemy. In the first two movies, The enemy was painted as an emotionless, AI script. A computer. The machines weren't made out to have any kind of human qualities really. They didn't really have emotions, all the emotions they had were explained as programming.

Then, all of a sudden, you have the little girl in the third movie with her parents, afraid of getting deleted.

They didn't naturally lead us into this at all. There was no humanization of the machines in the first movie whatsoever. And the ending was not satisfying. You have to give the audience a reason why Neo shouldn't destroy all of the machines, and that reason has to make sense. Otherwise the movie isn't enjoyable.

I don't think the Matrix series is terrible... it's certainly better than the new Star Wars movies (the third wasn't that bad, but it doesn't make up for the other two). But I can't imagine uttering Matrix and Blade Runner in the same sentance. Blade Runner is an amazing, genius film.

The thing really, that I'm looking forward to most that has to do with the Matrix, is the new Matrix game. Now, I know the first one was kind of bad... but it had really good ideas and all it needed was some polish and a little more time. Because of Hollywood's marketing... they pushed it out the door too soon. The new one doesn't have such a crushing deadline, and I am hoping that Shiny does it right this time.

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Actually, the 'humanisation' of the machines (I used inverted commas because there are essays of text that have been written on the debateability of the meaning of this term) is something that was introduced in Reloaded - starting with the Oracle and Seraph and leading to the Merovingian.

Revolutions simply capped it off by displaying the evolution of machines into beings who can be 'purposeless' existing only out of a now-simulacrum-dogged concept that is 'love' (hence, "it is a word - what matters is the connection the word implies" - the very essence of Baudrillard's concepts about the decay of truth behind the image of its shadow...ironically, this is something that the first Matrix movie fell victim to on mass reception /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif). It is this evolution of machine consciousness to a 'higher' or 'human' plane that allows the Neo-integrated version (Matrix 7.0) to exist in a relative state of bliss as we see at the climax of Revolutions with the machines bearing green lights (or 'eyes') as opposed to the red ones - an indiciation of their affiliation with humankind à la Matriculated.

 

LiquidMax, postcount+++++++++

seriously. dont rush yourself, take your time, if you need 300 more posts go right ahead

 

<font color="purple">Painty_J</font> <font color="red">heat index change</font> -2

<font color="gray">comments: PJ's recent posts, predominantly pith angled one liners, grow tired here. With so much arable land provided by Max's most fertile Mind, he chooses to spill the ol' "postcount" seed where anything from the simple "STFU please Mr. Maximillian, Sir" to the rather more ornate "The other night I was getting head and right when it was about to happen I grabbed the girl's ears and screamed 'liquitMAX!' & she damn near drowned. You should try it...but not here...too much liquidMaxwell, Sir" may have bourne the desired fruit more quickly. I gotta work on my metaphor. </font>

<font color="purple">Painty_J</font> <font color="red">heat index level</font> 6.5 (10)

 

Since there is so much discussion going on here, IMO the reason why people in the US did not like the matrix sequels is because as you said were very much informative in a kryptic way. The sequels were made IMO for people who had and open mind and one that could interprit the storyline through the actions of the characters; whereas the first matrix was simple and right to the point. Plus if you look at the mainstream today, people only care about the action and the flashyness of movies, they really don't care about the plot that much so long as it is pointed out to them. In the first matrix it was simple why and what they were fighting for. However, in the second and third one people sort of needed a sign telling them what was going on (this reminds me of the movie Spaceballs where in one scene the characters break out of character and actually tells the audience what the plot is lol).

IMO all three matrix movies were good even though the sequels required a more in-depth view of the plot. And to see the response of so many people saying that the matrix sequels really blow because of their own mental capacity to interprit them is really sad /versus/images/graemlins/tear.gif. It is like calling a classic masterpiece like To Kill a Mocking Bird dumb because there was no killing of mocking birds (one of my classmates actually said that out loud in the class after we were reviewing the ending of the book, and he didn't say that in a joking manner either). If you didn't understand the sequels go rent the movies and watch them over again and you will see that the movies are quite deep and intellectual. But the sad fact is that people only wanted more action and special effects out of the sequels and really didn't bother to look into the depth of it.

 

Yeah well aparently some of the old timers here are as sensitive as little girls so i had to tone the heat down before 'the man' started coming down on me.

 

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Painty_J said:

LiquidMax, postcount+++++++++

seriously. dont rush yourself, take your time, if you need 300 more posts go right ahead

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Thanks.

 

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sanjuro said:

<font color="purple">Painty_J</font> <font color="red">heat index change</font> -2

<font color="gray">comments: PJ's recent posts, predominantly pith angled one liners, grow tired here. With so much arable land provided by Max's most fertile Mind, he chooses to spill the ol' "postcount" seed where anything from the simple "STFU please Mr. Maximillian, Sir" to the rather more ornate "The other night I was getting head and right when it was about to happen I grabbed the girl's ears and screamed 'liquitMAX!' & she damn near drowned. You should try it...but not here...too much liquidMaxwell, Sir" may have bourne the desired fruit more quickly. I gotta work on my metaphor. </font>

<font color="purple">Painty_J</font> <font color="red">heat index level</font> 6.5 (10)

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That sounded like an exhibition of resentment against Painty_J's somewhat objectional comments...a sentiment with which I happen to agree. So ta /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

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Akira_PH said:

Since there is so much discussion going on here, IMO the reason why people in the US did not like the matrix sequels is because as you said were very much informative in a kryptic way. The sequels were made IMO for people who had and open mind and one that could interprit the storyline through the actions of the characters; whereas the first matrix was simple and right to the point. Plus if you look at the mainstream today, people only care about the action and the flashyness of movies, they really don't care about the plot that much so long as it is pointed out to them. In the first matrix it was simple why and what they were fighting for. However, in the second and third one people sort of needed a sign telling them what was going on (this reminds me of the movie Spaceballs where in one scene the characters break out of character and actually tells the audience what the plot is lol).

IMO all three matrix movies were good even though the sequels required a more in-depth view of the plot. And to see the response of so many people saying that the matrix sequels really blow because of their own mental capacity to interprit them is really sad /versus/images/graemlins/tear.gif. It is like calling a classic masterpiece like To Kill a Mocking Bird dumb because there was no killing of mocking birds (one of my classmates actually said that out loud in the class after we were reviewing the ending of the book, and he didn't say that in a joking manner either). If you didn't understand the sequels go rent the movies and watch them over again and you will see that the movies are quite deep and intellectual. But the sad fact is that people only wanted more action and special effects out of the sequels and really didn't bother to look into the depth of it.

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I don't mind that people resent the sequels due to their intellectual standing. That's okay with me - everyone to their own and everything... But it gets me that it's a reflection on how intellectualism is viewed today. Lablled as 'geeks' and 'nerds', those who are more intrigued by the musings of Descartes than the blowing up of vehicles (although I like both, which may be why I loved the trilogy so much /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif) are looked down upon as straw-clutching imbeceles who obviously don't know what makes "a good movie" (as if there were only one type).

I've always said that The Matrix Trilogy (particularly the sequels) were independent, alternative cinema made on a big-budget Hollywood level. It's my contention that the mass-appeal of the comparatively shallow first movie paved the way for two films that truly managed to use a huge budget to beautifully artistic effect. In a funny kinda way, the sequels turned The Matrix into a cult phenomena...perhaps that's the way it should be, with the fans getting big-budget treatments of some awesome concepts /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

All you have to do is edit your post to add more information to them. You dont have to post 5 times in a row Liquid Max . Its annoying as hell.

 

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Akira_PH said:


And to see the response of so many people saying that the matrix sequels really blow because of their own mental capacity to interprit them is really sad /versus/images/graemlins/tear.gif.

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akiraph, its not that i dont understand it, heck the films were kinda easy to follow for me, its just that i found the movies to be really boring. Thus resulting with me just not liking the entire series.

i can see why people do like it, but i just hate it when people go on about it like its the best thing since sliced bread.

dont be quick to label people mentally retarded if they dont like the same things you do

 

this sounds like

oh hey a shiny

 

This is a job for Mr. Bungle.

 

KS: I understand, but the sad truth is that most people are like that in the US. And I know that sounds like a generalization, it's true. I am not saying all are like that, but most people aren't as intelectaully open-minded as some.

Max: Yeah, I too dislike it when people tend to think that you are a nerd if you are intelectual over things. It does get annying at times but you get used to it and if you want you can show off a bit. But hey, I am intelectual and I also work out and stay in shape to look good. And if being intelectual makes me a nerd even though I do things that people would consider "normal", then fine, I am a nerd.

Sanjuro: Speaking of Terminator, what a coincidence, they just aired it on the local TV yesterday. Man I still love the part where Arnold shoves his fist into the punk-rockers gut and just lifts him in the air (reminds me of one of Bryan Fury's moves from T5).