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Most unique characters mechanically????

Discussion in 'General' started by GustavoHeisenberg, Jan 8, 2020.

  1. GustavoHeisenberg

    GustavoHeisenberg Well-Known Member

    In the game which are the most unique characters mechanically according to you in VF5FS? Please list them along with explanations.

    To me as a noob;

    1.Akira Yuki
    -He lacks strings, he arguably relies on mini launchers, stringing hard hitting moves

    2.Jean Kujo
    -charging moves to force a nitaku, nevertheless I feel like there are lots of areas for improving his purpose

    3. Shun Di
    -more drinks = more moves = more damage.
    Enough said, I don't know why Tekken & Street Fighter haven't copied his archetype.

    4. Wolf Hawkefield
    -meant to be the archetypical thrower, though hearing that Taka is the best thrower is disconcerting.

    5. Aoi Umenokoji
    -Queen of reversals and parries

    6. Vanessa Lewis
    -two fighters in one archetype

    7. Eileen
    -the dance fighter, the capo of virtua fighter

    8. Lau Chan
    - seems like the king of strings,

    I don't think the other characters are mechanically distinctive as they seem to combine aspects these 8 characters accentuate
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2020
  2. beanboy

    beanboy Well-Known Member

    Dude! True. I have been wondering that same thing for years.

    That whole drink more = more moves/damage, would fit Chin Gentsai from King Of Fighters really well. Despite being a cartoony character, he is like the closest thing to Shun Di, in terms of looks, age, personality and appearance too.
    GustavoHeisenberg likes this.
  3. Mister

    Mister Well-Known Member Content Manager Wolf Bronze Supporter

    I think we can add Lei-Fei to this list, because he's a character that relies a lot to stance transitions.
  4. GustavoHeisenberg

    GustavoHeisenberg Well-Known Member

    I was wondering why I forgot him when reading your comment, then again remembered that his stances confuse me being/feeling somewhat of a ever present gate keeper to a lot of cool moves. As I thought about it too, I realised that both him and Kage are very much alike being stance heavy (Lei Fri a bit more than Kage).

    Out of interest what are stances meant to do besides feeling like gate keeper to moves or gimmicks being telegraphed a mile away.
  5. Mister

    Mister Well-Known Member Content Manager Wolf Bronze Supporter

    I personally think that stances are there to force specific scenarios in which you have limited but very good options. Also thanks to stances you can reuse some inputs from a normal move list and so you can expand the skills of certain characters. In Lei-Fei's case i think stances are there to deal with specific problems: for exampe dokuritsu shiki (8p+k+g) automatically parries any punch high mid or low and plus you get moves to deal with ducking opponents, you can roll to get closer.

    I'm curious to see if any other player in here have something to add about stances and what are they for.
    LionRafaleVoiceActor likes this.
  6. VFnumbers

    VFnumbers Well-Known Member Content Manager Lei

    From the Leifei Wiki

    • Stances(top)
      Hai stance [2][P][+][K][+][G]
      A offensive type stance that has many powerful attacks used in combos, and to pressure offense.

      Doku stance [8][P][+][K][+][G]
      A balance type of stance that auto parries p and elbow attacks, useful in combos, and pressure offense.

      Zenten roll from Doku [6][P][+][K][+][G]
      Offensive type of stance that forces opponent to guess between a catch throw or combo starter. Useful against opponents that tech roll or to close distance.

      Koko Stance from normal stance [6][K]
      A defensive stance that utilizes 2 of leifei's mid and low sabakis

      Kyo stance from normal stance [6][P],[3][P],[6][P][+][K][P]
      Another offense type stance introduced in VF5FS. Useful in side turn situations and combos.

      Suirakan Stance From Nehan[2][2]
      Offense type stance that can be used in various situations

      Nehan Stance[1][P][+][K][+][G]
      Another Defensive stance useful to distance leifei, sabaki attacks.

      Bokutai [2] from hai stance
      A balanced stance when used can avoid mid attacks and counter to continue offense.
  7. MarlyJay

    MarlyJay Moderator - 9K'ing for justice. Staff Member Gold Supporter

    In my opinion they're all very unique. Every character seems to have a distinctive thing about them. The most unique character though for me is without a doubt Taka, as the game is different for him. Completely different combos need to be used against him, some strings natural combo that against him, and when the majority of the cast try to throw him they struggle with a different animation.

    For the other characters if i had to pick the main things that stand out for them.

    Akira - Guard break king
    Aoi - Can reverse every striking move.
    Brad - Ducking, Swaying and slipping
    Eileen - Cancel and interrupt moves
    El Blaze - Rocket discharge run and jumping off wall
    Goh - Can reverse throws. Subaki in easy
    Jacky - Yeaaaah!!
    Jean - His charge moves
    Jeffrey - Splash Mountain. Take half your health with one hit throw
    Kage - 8P+K
    Lei - huge variety of stances he can transition one to another
    Lion - low attacks
    Pai - Bokutai stance and speed
    Sarah - Those kicks
    Shun - drinks management to add moves, add damage and make some moves stronger
    Vanessa - two distinct characters in one
    Wolf - throws. Largest variety in the game. Has both the fastest throw and the most damaging throw.
    legumelad and Sonic The Fighters like this.
  8. SlowCast

    SlowCast Member

    Kage's should be his 46 K+G K !K that allows him to scrape opponent off the floor then slam him into the wall
    legumelad likes this.
  9. In my opinion, stances are implemented in order to give characters more options and risk-reward opportunities. With exceptions, most stances in this game bolster or alter your offense while weakening your defense since you cannot block and have to rely on whatever the stance gives you, if anything.

    For example, Sarah gets access to a low hit-throw and a mid hit-throw while in Flamingo stance. If she could do both of those from neutral, in addition to all the other things she can do from neutral, she would be far more dangerous of a character, so the developers chose to lock the hit-throws behind Flamingo. Now if players want Sarah's hit-throws, they must think about how they're going to get into Flamingo and whether Flamingo would be a good option.

    Since people already mentioned Lei Fei I'll leave it there.
    legumelad likes this.
  10. Sebo

    Sebo Well-Known Member Content Manager Taka Content Manager Jeffry

    I guess this kinda counts as a long form version of this, but for a more truncated version (but with a little more substantial info attached):

    Akira, Close Range Beast, generally very safe (and heavy), best elbow, safest 16 frame CH launcher, system breaking guard break, lacks variety and range (mostly) and requires good input skills for max-damage combos and proper hitchecking, played by assholes who got too many beatings when they were children but probably deserved it, also in need of updates to the wiki and combo sections

    Aoi, Psychological tool master and glass cannon, cancels, sudome, delayed strings, Tenchi, sabaki, excellent attacks that crush your attacks, generally safe on block (mostly just -13), and least important and useful reversals, gets combo'd to hell after a single mistake, played by weebs who cry themselves to sleep clinging onto cum stained body pillows, also in need of updates to the wiki and combo sections

    Brad, Punishment, stupid damage on most characters during combos/RH, strong stance options, eats predictable mid-rising attacks and mid-knee/kick pokes like a fucking monster, damn near impossible to hit check some tools that go into stance requiring good reads, played by abusive spouses and conservatives, also in need of updates to the wiki and combo sections

    Eileen, "Endless" mixups, can vary how to end strings, good crushing skills, [9][K], damage is generally low, best character to come up with new max-damage combos on, played by people who you do not want within 100 meters of a child otherwise shoot on site, also in need of updates to the wiki and combo sections

    El Blaze, Glass Cannon, high risk decent to great reward, solid set of tools in almost every category, hitbox shenanigans, stubby range of important attacks, gets combo'd hard (super unique combos work just on him), played by Rocket Discharge spammers online, generally jerks (exception being the fine gentleman 001, miss ya dude)

    Goh, Scarier than Aoi in psychological warfare and can Reverse throws (super important if you can consistently do it), Tsukami negates the 33/33/33 throw escape system in his favor, CH [6][K] is dumb and leads to the easiest half-life combo, good throws, good standing/whiff punishment, gets subaki in easy, great hitboxes on many attacks, slowish launchers, players are the same as Akira players but wear eye-liner and wear shit you'd get in a Hot Topic, can use some updates to the wiki and combo sections

    Jacky, Damage to safety ratio is fucked, Damage, CH [2_][3][P], Damage, good punishment, Damage, great variety in most ranges, lots of good circulars, you need to practice [6_][K], hot take: [7][K][+][G] is actually good once in a while to keep the opponent honest and the threat of it and/or the prospect of blocking it will make the opponent more likely to get thrown, decent throws that really suck when escaped, lots of great strings but can be [2][P]ed a lot, too many users all are stupid pricks who you should never lend money to

    Jean, *[6][6][P]*, solid tools, cancels and charges, good damage, really good sabaki, lacks variety, meh throws, also in need of updates to the wiki and combo sections, Jean players smell like poop

    Jeffry, Fundamentals and Walls, [2][K] is a game changer, heavy, good throws and not too shabby if escaped, damage and combos are great, excellent variety in approach, everything becomes better with a wall, without a wall many things are mediocre or just good, trouble dealing with pokes, meh/situational lows, also in need of updates to the wiki and combo sections (get back to work dude), arguably the coolest people play him (adamYuki, Chibitaro, etc.) remember ancient Chinese proverb: "Akira is best character, Jeffry is the best character"

    Kage, Boring or Balls-to-the-Wall (or [6][P] vs [8][P][+][K]), is bipolar in being either super speedy, safe, but low damage output, throw game can be scary, or do something stupid or slow or super unsafe for a little more pay-off (sometimes), stupid character design, stupid attack animations, some of the worst punishment in the game, only weirdos see anything worthwhile and is the #1 pick of the worst players who don't know what a frame is, being a secretive ninja his wiki section is a super secret and will never be updated, NAMU.

    Lau, Boring, great anti-high whiff punisher... boring, so boring, the Content Manager fell into a coma trying to write up the wiki. Boring character, should be removed if VF gets an update. Fuck La... zZzZzZ

    Lei-Fei, Stances and Sabaki, requires very good reads, fun as fuck to play as, evade > knee destroys a lot of his key attacks, attracts cool people, needs more wiki attention

    Lion, Lows, HCF[P], [8][K], great combos until the opponent gets fat, boring, stupid, and annoying, attracts people with all three of those traits, wiki needs attention

    Pai, Pokes and CHs, the goal is to frustrate the opponent with pokes ( [P], [6][4][P], [6][P] [one of the better elbows], [9][K], [1][K], [3][K], etc) to then set up CHs and beat sabaki with [3][3][P][+][K]/[3][P][+][K], or getting in good throws, also Bokutai crushes most attacks in the game further frustrating the opponent, [2_][4][P]'s hitbox, combo damage is okay, gets combo'd a lot if punished, annoying players, wiki needs an update (great vids on the reversals though)

    Sarah, Offense (but lacking in substantial reward with big risk), Flamingo is the glass cannon of stances, good approach but poor defensive techniques, played by pervs, also in need of updates to the wiki and combo sections

    Shun, Drinks and "what hitbox?" drinks are his super meter that give him stupid good moves and boosts the properties of everything else, where as against all other characters you can force a guess between a qucik mid or throw: Shun says fuck you and goes under your mid, can be played at any range, weak with fewer drinks, needs updates to the combo section

    Taka, [4][P][+][K][P]/Throws, Unique Trade off: negates a lot of damaging combos but some do extra on him, weak to strings but doesn't get knocked down as much, fuzzy at -5, limited variety in attacks but they lead to good damage, lots of anti-sabaki tools, boring like the people who main him

    Vanessa, Two Characters, Offensive stance is all you need with good damage and a really good catch throw but is boring, Defenisve stance has psychological tools (sabaki, ws[P], [3][P]) good throws, decent stance, WELL, good pokes, weak combos. Stop kidding yourself, she was fun to play, played now by thirsty dudes with poor internet connections and worse reasoning/reading skills

    Wolf, Throws and Catch throws, [6][6][P][+][K] is objectively the coolest attack in the game, good and easy wall combos, mid circulars, shit lows, slow launchers (or needs CH), Wolf players are cool but not as cool as Lei-Fei or Jeffry players unless they use a lot of [6][6][P][+][K], the more [6][6][P][+][K] you use the cooler you are, maybe some more wiki updates (more [6][6][P][+][K] )

    Dural, isn't real, deep state hoax.
    legumelad and VFnumbers like this.
  11. Libertine

    Libertine Well-Known Member Content Manager Brad Silver Supporter Content Coordinator

    As I am a conservative, this could explain why he's my main... and also for why he's not used often around here...

    This was a pretty good description of him, but I'd also add that he's very good with spacing. I don't think that your hit checking description is accurate outside of the side turned situation, where going into a stance is high risk/high reward for him.

    I wouldn't mind some suggestions to what you'd like updated in his Wiki section in a PM.
  12. erdraug

    erdraug Well-Known Member Content Mgr Vanessa

    At the risk of being pedantic, I posit that Vanessa, from a mechanical point of view, while unique amongst the VF cast, is not that unique of a character in the grand scheme of fighting games:

    Conceptually, yes, the idea of one character having a completely different moveset at the press of a button is indeed novel. But, from a mechanical point of view, pressing [P][+][K][+][G] to access another moveset is identical to tagging out to a different character (think KOF or Tekken Tag, albeit sharing a lifebar). You learn the two characters' movesets, you learn when they "tag-in" during combos for extra damage... and that's pretty much it. It doesn't force you to learn how to do 360° input motions (wolf's unique bit) charge your attacks or any of the other unique mechanics mentioned above.

    VF5 vanilla had more style-switching moves but those were taken away (deservedly so IMHO, as they were infringing upon Lei Fei's unique mechanic of manual stance transitions).

    So, from a mechanical point of view, in VF terms the only unique mechanics VF5FS Vanessa has are (i) a stance ("style") that does not revert back when hit (ii) a unique FUFT techroll option (iii) DS [5] hand-hold. An argument could be made that her OS [9][P] "superman punch", being a safe special-high that kills both lows and backdashes is unique enough to make number (iv).

    Her DS sabakis are certainly not mechanically unique (see Goh, Aoi, Pai, Akira), neither is her OS intruder step (eg. Lau or El Blaze also have special forward dashes). Her other notable moves are not that unique mechanically, they just have slightly better properties than those of other characters: eg. DS [6][6][K]'s frames make it safer than other circulars on block, DS [3][P] and WS [P] are slightly faster than most comparable moves, OS [6][6][P][+][G] catch-throw has better range than most, OS [6][6][K][+][G] has better range and pushback than most side-crumpling attacks etc. nothing drastically different from a mechanical point of view.

    If I may indulge in a bit of reminiscing: IMHO in previous versions her two styles used to be more mechanically distinct, mainly due to DS particularities: DS Vanessa used to have reversals - including the tech-crouching [4][3][P][+][K] low-punch parry (thanks for stealing that Goh :mad:) - repositioning options from [5] hand-hold, a 270° input required for her DS most-damaging throw, [1][P] used to work on sweeps as well, [3][K] and [6][6][K] had more pushback - and who can forget that VF5 vanilla backwalk speed ;) Previous versions of OS felt bare compared to all of that quirkiness but at least it had a tech-crouching OS DM P+K catch-throw and, you know, damage. Whereas now in VF5FS the two styles are more similar mechanically: both have decently damaging throws; DS has sabakis, OS has.. intruder step cancels? Takedown? Dunno, feels weird to cite OS [9][P] as a "unique feature". Anyway, the rest of the DS moveset is safer but less damaging whereas the rest of the OS moveset is more damaging but less safe. The difference is measured mostly in frames and points of damage, not move attributes and, well, mechanics :(
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2020
  13. Sebo

    Sebo Well-Known Member Content Manager Taka Content Manager Jeffry

    Checks out.

    Aside from the tools that allowed for stance shifts mid-combo or during pokes, [G][3]_[9][P] (while situational) was cool as fuck.

    Being able to block the opening of a predictable string and releasing guard to [5] inashi them was cool as fuck.

    Having the most damaging, but escapable during two points of the animation, punch reversals was cool as fuck.

    That [4_], while a bad crutch (and not unique to Vanessa), was cool as fuck.

    And in both stances, having a ws attack for both [P] and [K].

    Or if we go back further: 14 frame [P] which really incentivized using [3][P] or [2_][5][P] or no [2][P]/throw game in Muay Thai Style.

    Old Vanessas, while jankey as fuck, were fun to play.

    I'd argue the same for Evolution/FT Goh as well.

    But the "problem" (for us weirdos) is how the system has become more homogenized (which is great for new players) with each title.
    legumelad likes this.
  14. FlawedFists

    FlawedFists Active Member

    I definitely agree with you Erdraug, Vanessa's stance transition's also reminds me of Gen's crane and praying mantis stances from the sf series and may Lees hero stance from the kof series. I do miss vanessa's reversals They were fun as heck to pull off.
    legumelad likes this.
  15. Ali

    Ali Well-Known Member

    I think all the characters are unique ( Pai and Lau play similar superficially but deep down they are distinct). Fun factor varies but can very depend on your opponent.

    Breaking guard with Akira is always fun, mind games with Leo and Shun are never boring. Making your opponent mad with Aoi's reversal is never old.

    Now Jean is all flash bit little substance. I don't like him much
    legumelad and beanboy like this.
  16. GustavoHeisenberg

    GustavoHeisenberg Well-Known Member

    It seems like my post has been "lost in translation", at this point it's my fault, I must concede.

    When I meant most "MECHANICALLY UNIQUE" I meant which characters mainly best exploit one single aspect of the game. Like Akira has his "mini-launches" given his lack of strings... etc. I'm realizing that his guard break is an impressive mechanic but most of his arsenal is not based around variations of guard break moves. Akira only has 2 guard break moves 6 P+K+G & 3P+K+G 43P+K 214P 46P+K
  17. kungfusmurf

    kungfusmurf Well-Known Member

    AK, has 3 Guard Breaks and does have strings. & if you think a move in VF is weak it's because you don't know how to use it properly.

    Mechanically Unique = Taka. The entire FS system is build around him not AK as some suggest.
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2020
    GustavoHeisenberg likes this.
  18. GustavoHeisenberg

    GustavoHeisenberg Well-Known Member

    You are right @kungfusmurf He does have 3 guard breaks, and I guess "strings" but they remain the weaker part of his arsenal
  19. Jason Elbow

    Jason Elbow Well-Known Member

    Its ok now...
    Jason ELBOW AKT
    This just mean Brad fucks you up the most. Lol I swear, whats up with people hating characters in VF? With you its Brad, with Cuck Money its Lion, with Std Tm its El Blaze, with Godoku its the entire roster. What ever happened to adaptation? Lol
  20. Jason Elbow

    Jason Elbow Well-Known Member

    Its ok now...
    Jason ELBOW AKT
    You must have had Godoku in mind when you made this. Lol

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