naomi2 and VFX

Well i read a lot about naomi 2(SH4, 2x powerVR2,transformation and lightning co-processor,30 mbyte VRAM,60 mbyte other ram...backward-compatible) and i also downloaded movies (virtua striker 3, and other 2 games)......well the quality of the movies wasn't so good to judge the hardware-preformance..............
i know that graphics aren't the most important thing for games(I prefered VF1jap saturn version over toshinden on psx......and now i'm playing zelda on game boy and shining force3 part 2 on saturn).....................still i'm not sure if sega did the right thing developing this old new hardware.........do you think that the new enhancments do justify the investment of a lot of money.........IS NAOMI 2 a WORTHY HARDWARE FOR THE NEW VF-Game(certanly if sega did keep up the normal pace we would be ~ with Model 4,Model 5 tecnology............

P.S Bad hardware in the arcades.......all started with lazy namco who did prefer to produce their games on PS-Hardware(system 11) even if they had systen22(model 2-similar)....how can someone produce a game like TTT in times of naomi,model2+3,......oh good those that game look ugly.........thank you namco for such graphics almost 6 years after model 2 so i realize how important progress is for you and i will pay 2 francs with pleasure for such &%/& graphics......

brumm,brumm,brumm,....... Nakamura (Namco president)if jacky gets you he will kick your ass so hard that you kiss the moon............

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by nascarbryant on 10/28/00 01:25 PM.</FONT></P>

 

Are the drugs you use expensive?

<font color=white> Llanfair the prized <font color=green>cabbage</font color=green></font color=white>

 

Yeaah very very expensive..........
seriously man!!!!!!!!
If you look at all these minor(?!) dreamcast enhancements like Hikaru(does somebody now whats the big difference in confront to naomi 1(ram))......., naomi 2, you should really ask if maybe they shouldn't make the game on naomi 1......(someone remember the 32X in confront to saturn!!)
.........that would make me really mad and would be ridicoulus ,if a Xbox /gamecube comming out half year after naomi 2 and would be stronger(the components sound really more up to date then those of naomi 2;quantity v.s quality).........well i don't think the guys in the hardwaredevelopment department are stupid........but in the past there were mistakes that shouldn't repeat themselfs
still interesting enough is....if naomi2 is more of a compromise......everybody knows that mister Yu Suzuki likes strong hardware.......but Segas top men(irimajiri) were interested to have a hardware that would allow fast home ports....

P.S well when i go to arcades(which are expensive here in switzerland)...i want to see the future.....sega maybe was the only manufacturer that showed us how games would look in 4 years at home.................maybe mister you would like to see VFX on Model 1...............

brumm,brumm,brumm..........

 

naomi2

re: being worried that naomi 2 wont be powerfull (enough.)
well from what ive read it is powerfull.
if namco uses some ps2 arcade variation, naomi will probably be better.
and all naomi has to worry about for now is an arcade ps2 variation.
(vfx's main competition will be tekken4 or whatever the next one will be called)

sega has had 4 quarters of straight loss. maybe they are designing the naomi2 to be cheap (naomi1 was very cheap.)
i dont think sega is in a position to go totally nuts with the great hardware as they used to be
which is sad because they were really big innovators with model1 and model2 and model3 (great hardware.)

sega seems to be a company which is interested in making really really beautiful, great games and that is its downfall.
as opposed to just being more focused on making money
-jtx

 

I personally don't think there's any real danger in Naomi 2 being underpowered. Sega doesn't have a reputation for inflating specs and I don't see how it would be different here. If you think about it, very few--if any--games go over the 2-3 million pps with effects mark. I have no doubt that a AM2 coded VFX at 10 million pps with 8 light sources would kick visual ass without problems at all.

ice-9

 

The return of the prodigal son....very nice to hear from you Ice-9, plus did tou take your tag from that Kurt Vonnegut novel Cat's Cradle

Under the surface of the most jaded cynic lies a dissappointed idealist- George Carlin

 

Re: naomi2

yeaahh...you are probably right................I think naomi 2 will be under all this circumstances a great hardware........what makes me sad is that the times of superpowerful hardware in the arcades is probably over.....
but let's rejoice after all this years we will soon get a new VF.....and if we think how inovativ the sequels off V.F games were....than we can expect some surprises..yuhhuii..


brumm,brumm,brumm,.....

 

Great to hear something from the founder off this great forum.........
Your right.......sega was always very fair with their tecnical data anouncments..if they say 10 million it doesn't mean 500000..........Very interesting are the numbers that namcoprogammer announced for their tekken game on PS2.......10000 for each caracter and 5000 for the background(sounds incredible here).....well that means 1,5 mio per second(sony said with all effects on 20-60 Mio,thanks namcoprogammers for this true numbers...)

brumm,brumm,brumm,....jacky is going to kick the asses at sony so hard that they kiss the moons.....allright!!

 

Re:VFX compete with tekken4

I don't think that VFX can compete with tekken 4 outside of japan, because tekken it's more popular here, no way that VFX can change that..............I strongly belive in marketing and as for that...........sony's 60 million userbase and tekken still selling as strong(platinum), and biing pushed (ads,) wont diminuish it's popularity...............i also agree that VF is to complex for massmarket(light buttonsmashers to heavy buttonsmashers)...........i don't think that many arcades will buy the naomi 2 game (because of the amount of ram it will certainly be more expensive then PS2 tekken4................well that means that i have to go to london ...if i want to play the game and i willll....)

P.S thank you gamefan and others for the realistic reviews for TTT.....finally someone who doesn't say how incredible , how supirior ,how perfect,how innovatif this game is.......your right there wasn't much inovation in that game.......so they have stolen the tag feature from capcom and tekken3 has stolen the switchstance feature from streetfighteralpha2........look at VF series the changements from one chapter to another were quite huge...........let's hope that the dreamcast userbase will make this new VF more popular(soul calibur,dead or alive2.......*%&ç...common!!.....)

brumm,brumm,brumm,.......jacky says it's time to learn what a real fighting game looks like!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Re:VFX compete with tekken4

Not to bring up another Tekken Vs. VF thread (we have better uses of our time imo), but I personally don't think Tekken is a ripoff of VF in any way. Not only that, but I think Tekken has its fair share of "innovations" or at least new ideas in 3d fighter gameplay.

Overall, I still prefer the VF series, and just about always has. But I also appreciate and enjoy the Tekken series for what it is. To me, it's just a very very different from VF altogether. Soul Calibur is more comparable to VF than Tekken imo. SC pretty much borrows a lot from Tekken as well as the precursor (imo) to Soul Edge, Weaponlord which is an old 2d game on the SNES and Genesis, also by Namco (loved that game, but definitely designed to be played at home).

VF brought tons of innovations to gameplay, but that doesn't really mean that Tekken didn't either. I have an email conversation, I think it was between Ice-9 and Joji (not sure, Ice-9 for sure though) from long ago on the same topic (perhaps it is here in the astro section?)... An example straight out of that article was that Tekken had throw animations quite a while before VF series did (in fact, I believe they've been in there since the original Tekken whereas VF didn't implement them until VF3, the automatic option select of throw escape and Punch in VF2 was pretty neat though/images/icons/tongue.gif).

On a sidenote, just realized you were mostly talking about TTT. I'll admit I was sick of Tekken 3 by the time TTT was out (I loved Tekken 3) and so I didn't really appreciate TTT at all. But in its defense, TTT wasn't as innovative, but it wasn't really a sequel either. It was the VF3tb of the Tekken world for all I care. Just so happens that Tag Team became the rage around the time. Tweaks done to each character. The big additions were the inclusion of some Tekken 2 characters that were not in 3 and that certainly appealed to me when I started playing TTT (though that wasn't for long, because I was tired of T3 by then). Can't really expect major innovation in a version update such as TTT. Unfortunately, I think if VF3 was more popular, and the US reviewers were more familiar with VF3tb, they probably would have said something similar as what people say about TTT on the PS2. However, they probably wouldn't be so harsh because VF3ob wasn't released on a previous system. Anyways...

No use beating an old topic to death.

 

Re:VFX compete with tekken4

Yeah, your right it would be to cheap to talk the whole time about such a thing..........but you have to understand that here everyone who plays a fighting game plays tekken(a few soul calibur+dead or alive) when i met with friends they where always playing tekken(the most people weren't very well ,exept one......imagine i didn't play a lot tekken but it was enough to recognize which characters were strong and which moves.....so i often won easaly against all of them........I still play TTT in the arcades because there is nothing else........and knowing not much it's still enough to win against almost everybody, exept against some 'experts'.....but i'm not motivated to go deeper in that game.........sort of learning all moves all tricks and studiing frames......(are there any).....i also have Tekken 3 at home).........as you said it wouldn't be wise to talk like 3 year old children (maybe i'm doing that,now) ...............but still i have to say that i've followed both games from the begining and i saw a lot of things that were taken from VF(and i also mean basic things like..turn back against the opponents,laying down,even moving the head towards the oponent.,..I dont want to start mentioning all the things,believe me they were many but not vice versa)...... 3D fighters could have easly followed the streetfighter-paradigma)......still i am convinced if you would take everthing out from tekken that was taken from VF there wouldn't be much left(basic-structure,..)
and there are a lot of weaknesses like the equality between the characters...some are much stronger then others,or there are many moves that are used from different characters(that makes me laugh when someone says ssssssssoooooo many fighters,......also the animation....some moves consist of 2 or 3 different animations.....no wonder people think it's a fast game.........and guys like eddy instantly become weak if you know all his moves, he might have some more animations...beautiful to watch but that makes him also very weak against good people.........certainly(T3) and people like Lei(gameplay),Xiayou(gameplay),Howrang(animation),Eddy(animation) are a step in the right direction..

P.S that what makes me mad that always VF gets the dirt on it's face and there seams a popular-belief that Tekken is the first 3D fightinggame and if it's not it is certanly THE innovator in the industry and V.F doesn't get the respect it diserves for all it has brought to 3d fighters......it's a shame
Namco and copyiing a big story in the arcades(VF-tekken,sega rally-dirt dash,virtua cop-time crisis,.....,recentlly..eighteen wheller-truck-concerto)common mister pacman there were times were namco defined the word innovation...........but not today

brumm,brumm,brumm,.......sniff i think i have to start crying..