New character selection....strength/weakness of sarah?

Hey all I'm brand new to the virtua fighter world, and in general to 3d fighters having cut my teeth in the 2d world as a tournament player in various games. That said I have narrowed my character choice down to Sarah and Pai leaning toward Sarah, but don't see much on here about her. Theres a great post really describing Goh and I'd like to see some similar thoughts on Sarah for the new player. I typically favor an aggresive game style rather than a defensive or turtling style, although I don't know how effective those are in VF. If I'm looking to be on the offensive more than the alternative is sarah a viable choice, or should I play pai? From all that I'm reading this game is not like many other fighters in that learning a character is much more involved so I'd rather not have to switch mid-flow. Any information you guys can give me is much appreciated.

 

Alright, I do play Sarah, but not super extensively.

Key Moves:





+
+
+

(And of course all her throws, except
+, I mean, why is this in the game?)

From Flamingo




270+
~ +

Pretty much, these are her most useful moves which I will attempt to explain after answering a few of your direct questions.

1: Any character is a viable character. But, in my opinion, I'd probably say that sarah probably is *the* pressure character of VF, simply because of her flamingo stance. Really, in VF there is no "turtle" style.

2: Now, you say you don't like switching up mid-flow, but that's one trademarks of VF - hitchecking. Which surely if you've done the training you've become mildly familiar with.

Alright, I'll start explaining her key moves.

- Really, for pretty much every character (maybe save lei), the jab is probably the most important move. Quick execution, and advantage on block - what more could you ask for in a move?

- The best move in the game, hands down. Fast execution, interrupts most high attacks (save special highs, which you don't need to know about ) Use and abuse with caution.

- Now, this can either be followed up with a or a . When you do this move, you should pause, if it's a guard or normal hit, follow up with , if it's a stagger or counter hit, follow up with . (Now, you really can't go wrong with following up with every time, but we're trying to maximize reward without the risk!)

- Sarah's quickest way to get into flamingo stance, Personally, I love this move. The itself is 12 frames, so that's about as fast as pretty much everyone's jab (save aoi and sarah), but by following up with the you get +4 advatange on block. Now that's sexy.

- Sarah's main combo starter. A pretty reliable followup that works on most characters in both foot positions is .

(For the first move there, you're holding the directional pad forward before you hit kick, this will cause your kick to advance you forward as you are completing the move. In general, it's not combat effective, but it's essential to learn for MANY floaters in the game - for every character. Oh, and it also works for standing punches too)

+ - Simple, quick combo starter that hits mid. Hitchecking is important here, so don't go for the 2nd kick if they block the first one (the hit stun is incredibly long).

+ - You know, I really don't use this move too much. But hey, it's full circular, and it's only -3 on block. AND it puts you in flamingo! (If they block, it's probably best to follow up with from flamingo)

+ - Half circular (could be wrong), destroys low punches, and combos on counter hit. Great move! (And only -4 on block)

From Flamingo:

- Well, it and Vanessa's from OS are the fastest executing strikes in the game. The difference is, this move is pretty much always effective.

- Arguably the most abusive move in the game. Special high, advantage on block, combos on counter hit. (Which when you land a counter hit you can also set up a bit of a guessing game which might allow you to go for her gatling beat throw)

- Guaranteed after counter-hit. Great range, advantage on block, keeps up the pressure, keeps you in flamingo.

- Eventually, your opponents will become wary of the from flamingo, so instead - just use this mid attack instead. Causes a stagger, which means a guessing game (and potentially big damage!)

270+ - Why, well, it's just better than her neutral throw... and it can't be escaped... so there's really no reason to not do it when you want to throw.

+ - I really like using this move after counter hit ~ . Besides - it's flashy too.

+ - Full circular for those who are smart enough to evade to sarah's front side. (Her is half circular, and can only be evaded to the front).

Alright, there's my sarah tutorial, didn't really include any floaters, but you can find those in the game tutorial )

 

Welcome to the board. I think this is a cool place.

For Sarah information, I say start here. There are two links at the bottom of the page for Sarah threads. They aren't that new, but the information in there will be useful for most if not all versions of VF4.

Also, you can search for Sarah. If that link works, then cool. If not, I did a search for Sarah - in title only - in character and technique - and in Final Tuned sections - for the last two years.

I can't tell you much on how to choose between the two characters. I think if you're leaning toward Sarah, then go for it. From talking to people that use her, I don't think you'll be disappointed or frustrated. To me, she looks fun and flashy.

I don't hear the term turtling used much in VF. I don't think playing styles are quite so prevalent in VF as they are in Tekken. I've seen people get labeled here and there, but it isn't wide spread. I played a Tekken convert once who accused me of turtling quite vocally and I thought it was weird cause I'd never heard the term before.

Anyway, thanks for a very professional and thought-out first post. /versus/images/graemlins/cool.gif


Have fun with Sarah and VF.

 

Vanity by mid-flow I meant a switch from one character as a main to another, sorry for the vagueness. Basically didn't want to find out that Sarah didn't lend herself to a gameplay style that suites me. After getting the game today (10 bucks for this?? insane) I'm quite happy her. I did the search and found all the FT info but I wasn't sure how much translated back to Evo. (which I'm assuming is tourney format?) so I kinda disregarded it. Much like GGXX and GGXX#R the tweaks seem minor so instead of learning things I would have to relearn I just ignored the FT info.

Oh as I understand it there has been no mention of an FT home release, what is the ETA on VF5, or will it ever arrive (wherefor art thou MVC3????)? One of the huge differences I've noted after 3-4 hours in quest mode and training is that frame advantage is so key. Well that and you can't jump kick /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif. Very foreign to those of us who used to play SF, as well as the huge movelists. What I mean is not that frames aren't important in SF just that its nowhere near so techinical you just know what is safe and what isn't, and that doesn't translate so well yet. Also the guard button is a bit odd, I frequently find myself holding down back on reaction and gettting annoyed when I get hit low. The other kinda new portion of the game is the whole rising sequences, very interesting. On the plus side the training and quest modes are unreal, these are the gold standard IMO. Overall I'm really enjoying the game and thanks for all the advice.

 

when i first transitioned from the 2Ds, i picked Kage, simply because he had a DP /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif oh, and a spiral arrow. /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

i think that in vf, you need to know a lot about your opposing chars as well... true in any fighting game, but i think more so in vf... so if you do happen to mid-switch, it's not really much of a loss /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

Yes, agios is correct.

See, isotope, not only are you going to have to learn sarah, but you WILL eventually have to learn pretty much every other character's movelist.

Now, the thing is, it really is impossible to be "taught" this. It pretty much comes entirely through experience. You will need to learn what every character is capable of, and the stats of pretty much every move! (Although some are pretty intuitive).

 

On Pai vs Sarah, Sarah is more about fast, dangerous offense and quick guessing games. Pai is more of a poking/mixup/annoyance character.

A quick tip: In Evo, Sarah's most basic guessing game is +/, throw. She can force this mixup even if the is blocked. Usually good players will fuzzy/duck a throw after a blocked P, and be able to block a fast mid as well. Sarah's + will stagger them if they try to fuzzy after the , giving you another chance to mixup.

If FT ever comes here, this won't be as effective, since the + doesn't stagger anymore.

Anyway, good luck with VF, and have fun.

 

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when i first transitioned from the 2Ds, i picked Kage, simply because he had a DP /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif oh, and a spiral arrow. /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif



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I was just like that when I first started. I abused the shit out of Kage's +. Then later on in the game when I reached different arcades I got my ass whooped and THEN I found out about frames and shit.

Oh, I got a question. After doing k,k,k from flamingo is a + and a + guaranteed? I've found that after I usually do that I keep on connecting those throws. Is this a coincidence?

 

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After doing k,k,k from flamingo is a + and a + guaranteed? I've found that after I usually do that I keep on connecting those throws. Is this a coincidence?

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What's ++? Anywho, nothing is guaranteed for Sarah if FL hits, and nothing is guaranteed for the opponents if it's blocked.

 

You know that throw from flamingo. When I am against a comp in quest mode I found that every time the Sarah comp did k,k,k or kk,k she somehow keeps on landing either a + or k+ from flamingo. Also she keeps pissing me off with that + throw from flamingo. What is the best way to dodge or counter that move because it's so annoying.

 

The info you need is here:

http://virtuafighter.com/commands/index.php?chara=sarah&ver=evob

You can dodge the last part of for one thing. On hit it's +5 and on block it's -7 so like Dandy says, nothing is guaranteed.

When in FL, possible defensive ideas are a low reversal, sabaki (especially if you're playing as Akira!) low punch back (maybe not best option) or sometimes simply a crouching guard.

 

I used to play Street Fighter as well, although I absolutely loathed the MvC series. Capcom has become the slapstick parody of fighting games these days, aiming for a trademark "zany-ness" in their games now. Unfortunately, Capcom's particular brand of zany doesn't appeal to me. At all.

That said, welcome to VFDC. I've just started coming around here myself. I've dabbled in VF over the years, but it wasn't until the development of the aforementioned Capcom situation that I really started getting seriously into VF. Sarah's always been my main character even though I do fool around with some others when I'm bored.

Sarah has a lot more floater moves, and potential floater moves, than Pai has. With Sarah you're always looking for an opportunity to get a nice little combo going. With Pai, it's more about poking and prodding and dancing around, getting misc hits in here and there. She does have some neat float combos though, but not as extensive a list as Sarah.

Personally, this is why I prefer Sarah over Pai. Out of Pai's three launchers (, , and ), the first two only hit high and the third one only floats on counter hit. In any case, aside from canned chain combos or the , she doesn't have much of a variety of float combos. There is one really cool 7-hitter in the training mode, but even under ideal circumstances its entire connection doesn't seem to me to be consistent.

Sarah, on the other hand, can float with which hits mid, on counter hit, +, Flamingo +, +, + on counter hit, and possibly one or two more that are not on the top of my head atm.

Try going into training mode and practicing with the first series, the one that tells you to do , then get a counter hit against Brad's low with a Flamingo , and to follow that with another . Instead of doing the Flamingo , do the low Sabaki (Flamingo +), which will knock him on his ass and give you enough time to follow up with the Flamingo +, +, . Now THAT'S stylish!

 

Yup, I forgot one. + on counter hit sets up a float combo as well.

Moves like + (counter hit), +, and Flamingo + are all instafloor moves that your opponent cannot roll out of. After any of these moves, Sarah's standard float combo is +, +. The first hit will scoop them up off the ground, and the next two hits will juggle.

Moves like , (counter hit), and + (counter hit) set up arial juggles. Standard combo after any of these is , , although there are situations where more powerful combos are possible, such as , , or , , among others.

 

I of course respect your opinion on the MVC series but MVC2 is the most popular tourney fighter for the last 5 years and it is anything but a parody of a fighter. Deep and extremely difficult at tourney level. Its not traditional fighting (poking and whatnot) but it is not a button masher by any stretch of the imagination.

Anyway I am going to watch teh webcast of the japanese tourney, to bad theres nary a Sarah to be seen. Bleh. Around the third arcade last nite I started having some difficulty as the computer actually blocked punch xxx whatever combos and crouched a bit. Loads of fun in the quest mode, nice curve as the computer gets smarter as you go. What is generally the best move to use on crouching opponents? I have been going with because it crouch staggers and puts me in flamingo, and its relatively fast. Any better options?

 

is a nice mid kick, which is faster than , and floats on counter hit.

Damn, there's another one!

 

After the + counter hit, it depends on foot position. In closed stance, follow it with the , combo. In open stance that won't work, so try , +.

For Sarah and Jacky, using + is the same move as , but using the button in the command makes the attack come out a bit faster.

The one thing about Sarah is that she doesn't seem to have much of a mid/low mixup game. Watch out for crouching opponents and don't forget to do the Flamingo + shinshake when you think they'll try to interrupt you with a low .

Argueably, that move counts as a float setup too.

 

Against crouching opponents use , if it staggers - follow up with a , if they block, follow with a

 

I don't play sarah so I can't give you any moves to use, but in the past I have often lost to sarah and I think I have a fairly good idea of why.... Anyway, the key to a good sarah (in a very general sense) is to get a small advantage (4 frames or so), go into flamingo, stay close and then keep following up with moves that maintain the small advantage. Pretty soon the opposition will either turtle up (never a good idea) or they will try to throw out a move and get hit. I think this is the kind of play you said you enjoyed. I find the 3 keys for me against sarah (so watch out for them) are

1. Keeping my distance and picking her off with long range moves like wolf's shoulder ram. Remember you can't block in flamingo.

2. If I do get stuck in Sarah's flamingo patterns, I try to recognise when certain moves are coming and use sabakis and reversals etc rather than blocking.

3. If possible I try to stay on the offensive because sarah does not have the best defensive moves. I try not to let her get close up in flamingo...

 

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Also she keeps pissing me off with that + throw from flamingo.

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Akira_PH: Do you mean Sarah's Flamingo +, + Hit Throw?

If you give Sarah enough time to perform that move, you are doomed. It does not matter if you are standing or crouching, guarding or not. If Sarah's foot touches you, you will be kissing her other one. The hit throw is executable regardless of your state.

The only hope for you is to fail to interrupt her Flamingo + with an extremely slow attack of your own, which will cause Sarah's kick to connect as a counter hit, floating you up into the air (omg another one) and rendering the hit throw invalid.

Or you could just dodge. Flamingo + is kind of a slow kick. /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

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she somehow keeps on landing either a + or k+ from flamingo.

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Do you mean Sarah's Flamingo , + Hit Throw?

This one isn't as versatile as its bigger brother. While it can still throw you regardless of whether you are standing or crouching, so long as you successfully guard against the Flamingo , the hit throw becomes inexecutable. The advantage to Sarah in using the Flamingo hit throw, though, is that Flamingo comes out much faster than the Flamingo +.

Hit Throws are essentially combos. As long as you've got the timing down, if the first hit connects the rest is guaranteed. They are non-escapeable. They remind me of King of Fighters, where certain characters who had Command Throws (ala Ralph, Clark, Blue Mary, Shermie, Goro, etc) could combo into those throws. Not every character could do it, but the ones who could were feared for it.

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I of course respect your opinion on the MVC series but MVC2 is the most popular tourney fighter for the last 5 years and it is anything but a parody of a fighter.

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isotope: I don't dispute that MvC2 is a competitive game. All I am saying is that the STYLE of the game is what turns me off to it. I'm not epileptic, but seeing that game makes me WANT to have seisures. /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

SFA2 4-evrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

 

My Sarah is O.K, but I want to make my Sarah better. I'll been praticing on escaping throws, I been spaming launchers, any advice on how to make a good mix ups.