Next Gen consoles. What console looks promising?

So how comes you claimed one was better than the other? Aren't you contradicting yourself then?

Call me old, but I seriously don't think I know what the difference is. Is the difference like the performance between an IDE HDD and a SSD?

So you don't think people should be rewarded for their efforts?

 

I'm going to bolt if both consoles have unacceptable policies - but my worry is online play over anti-used game.

I'll miss VF6, but I do have plenty of nice PC games, and FG's are growing more and more frustrating every year anyways.

 

I'm talking about service, not console. Read my post again.

The reason you haven't notice the difference is because GDDR5 is mainly use for GPU's, not on board memory, due to the price. The architecture of unified pool is way advance in this consoles compared to a PC. So SONY going with GDDR5 for a unified memory pool is nuts, and smart.

Not if my consumer rights are about to be violated. The industry needs to learn how to manage their budgets and stop chasing the "Michael Bay"chimera of rated "B" narrative pacing with no replay value what's so ever that their product becomes a desolation in my shelf. They need to go back to the basics and put game-play first. Not making another weapon fetish orgy that this industry is keen about.

 

I don't see where your consumer rights are being violated... (are we still talking about DRM issue?) they wont have a budget if nobody buys new games. Its not like they're super rich, the £40-50 you pay goes to the store, not companies like Square Enix. They're selling games to stores for less than that!! Plus factor in that the company doesn't get paid until 12-18 months down the line whilst still spending money to market it. That's a lot of salary and services to be paid before the game reaches the store shelf! After that, the company gets paid. I work in advertising, I've seen clients budget 35-40K for a simple event. That's just one event. Imagine the money the companies have to spend when going to stuff like Tokyo Game Show. Must cost at least 200k.

 

Yes, I'm talking about DRM. Everything else is irrelevant to the discussion. No need to repeat myself on "managing" budgets. Something this industry is terrible at, and its no secret. And it seems you haven't been paying attention to the buyouts this companies been doing this past year, yes, even SEGA bought a few studios an IP's. So saying this companies are not "Super Rich" is rather insanely laughable mate. Again, Google is your friend. And when you do see their forecast, you'll most likely say "But some are losing money, you see" And I'll point you right back to exhibit A....And your Retail to publisher percentage is off as well.

 

I didn't say anything about retail to publisher percentage... that's just how much we pay for games in retail stores over here - http://www.game.co.uk. The price stores pay for the games are obviously lower than us buying from a store - if you're a business, why would you buy something at £40 then try to sell it at £40? Would you do that (as a business)?

Right so I did as suggested, looked at SEGA's company reports from SEGA's very own website - http://www.segasammy.co.jp/english/pr/corp/. That's the best way to get correct info on a company instead of google'ing for IGN articles.

In summary, sales ARE DOWN. Pachinko unit sales are down too, but the sales of these are what's keeping the damage at a minimal to the company as a whole. BUT. We are talking about consumer stuff like home console software. So the sales in this sector is grim...

source: http://www.segasammy.co.jp/english/ir/ar2012/pdf/operations_e.pdf

Because of lack of sales, jobs have gone (the single highest cost of a company - salary) to reduce costs and development of some titles have also been halted. Their strategy is to only develop titles that have sold well in the past - more Shogun and Aliens games? Which means we'll not be seeing some games released over here now. I'm not saying that borrowing games is the sole reason for this - no. But it does contribute to this. The real number is unknown as we can't tell who borrowed a game from a friend and who rented a game from say LoveFilm. Do you see why companies care about getting what they deserve?

Your consumer rights aren't violated in any way. You have bought the right to play the game, so you can play it all day long if you like. Nothing is stopping you. But your friend hasn't, so he doesn't really have the right to borrow it off you (strictly speaking).

Oh by the way, this thread isn't only about DRM, it's about the new consoles coming out. So any feature of them should be discussed openly.

 

The right of resale is a right, unless we give it up.

If companies don't want resold software, don't make us want to resell it.

Sales are down largely due to DLC effectively raising the cost of games, and the raised game prices are largely due to overbloated, inefficient budgets.

 

That ""must be connected to the internet" shit of the new xbox fucks it up... But who knows.

 

So what's the alternative, pay £50 - £60 for the digital version (why these are more expensive than the r.r.p, i'll never know) and let all that profit go to Sony and MS instead?

Hell, if the Xbox One DRM goes ahead like has been suggested then we'll be paying up to £60 just to load up a friends copy when we could have just got the game new from amazon for £25 ....

Sure, MS should be rewarded for ripping off their customers and profiting from every single game published on the Xbox One, even ones they had no involvement in.

/me smokes a rainbow

 

Wouldnt like to have to buy any game for the price they look for on games on demand, I hope they sort out this games issue in one way or another very soon.

 

This is madness. By your logic I only buy the right for me to watch my blu-rays but my friends haven't paid. So technically they shouldn't really be watching the movie with me. What about music? Should I listen to music with my friends since they have not paid for it and I have? It's a physical item regardless of what is on it and as such we have certain rights as consumers to use it as we please which includes lending or resale. It is ours. Yes, we don't own the intellectual property on the disc but we do own the disc for fair use just like with blu-rays and CDs.

 

Did the invent of libraries make people stop writing books? People have been trading and loaning games since Commodore 64.

Like I said above, the single best way for them to stop used games sales, game trading and rentals altogether is to eliminate the discs. If there's no disc drive and no physical medium to resell or lend out, then that whole business is dead immediately. Xbox One and PS4 could cut the retailers out of the loop completely with one decision I've heard they almost made.

I can only assume they didn't do it because either:

A) People aren't ready to go 100% digital yet.
B) They didn't want to destroy the retail store's business because they still need them to sell you the console itself.

Not sure. Regardless, getting rid of all trading and resale is as easy as eliminate the discs and selling all titles On-demand. There'd be no more need to pre-order, no worrying about them running out of copies, the game companies don't have to press discs and make packaging, etc. The only reason I can see that the execs at MS and Sony wouldn't do it is because they're not ready to put Gamestop out of business yet.

 

The real reason is the internet in the US isn't ready to DL 20GB games in under 12 hours most places.

 

I don't have much of a problem with how certain compaines handle used games now. I understand the fee on used gamers for online play. But by punishing used gamers (most of whom couldn't afford to buy it new) with new game like fees isn't the answer Piracy and proper budgeting should be the focus of these companies, not trying to gauge every dollar, pound and euro from the people who actually pay

 

I'm not being funny, but if you can't afford something then don't buy it? I'd like a Ferrari, Rolex watch and eat Kobe beef every day but all of those are luxuries. People who can't afford to buy games when they are expensive can wait till the price comes down - I bought VF5 for like £5 brand new. Wasn't a used copy nor was there a sale. The game came out for so long that the store just put it at a low price. Besides, if you can't afford games, then your priorities probably isn't gaming. If you have to verify your game before playing, hopefully that will help stamp out piracy - but I seem to remember a disc swap technique for the psone where people were still able to play pirate games by putting a legit game in first.

What you mean at the time when a lot of people couldn't read? I'm not saying it's a new thing. Just that those actions contribute to the loss of sales. Which is different from saying it's the sole reason why publishers aren't doing so well. Why do some of you seem to have a hard time distinguishing between the two?

If you think swearing and acting like a teenage boy "lays it out perfectly" then I don't think you're really listening to him or you're not being honest. If you think about the nature of any business, it's to be top of whatever industry they are in. Does this mean you won't be buying anything from any stores then? That video was just his opinion... He said "people" he spoke to told him x, y and z. Well, unless I see concrete evidence I'm not going to just take his word for it.

So just buy the game as new? You realise that the point of doing it is to make you buy the game new right?

That's a different media? I don't know what the agreement is for Dvds and music but I guess it's pretty much the same. I think I made a mistake though, I think DRM is between the gamertag or console instead of person. But yeah, your friend technically shouldn't be playing your games. Like how your friend shouldn't borrow your drivers licence...

It's funny because that's what they are trying to prevent you from doing yet here you are still crying about it.

To stop drivers driving into central London, something called a congestion charge was introduced some years ago. It's basically a zone within London that if you drive a vehicle into, you will be liable to pay a fee. Yes, just for entering the zone. If you don't pay on time, you will then be liable to pay a fine. On top of this, drivers already pay a lot for their cars - insurance, MOT, fuel, etc... so why should they pay extra just for entering a part of the city?! Everyone hated it. But to be honest, besides another way of making money, the government said it wanted to reduce the traffic in London also. Well, it's not a popular option, but it has prevented a lot of people from driving to work. I know colleagues who used to drive but now have opted to cycle, walk or use public transport. I'm one of those who would've drove to work if it wasn't for the congestion charge (I hate the congestion charge but can see that it's stopped people from driving during busy times). Some people didn't care about the fee or some had to pay it (people who lived in it or businesses had discounts).

Sound familiar? One way to stop something from being done is physically making it impossible - but that in itself is literally unattainable. So you use something that will reduce the number of times it happens - money. Everyone cares about their own pockets so charging you for something is going to deter a lot of people from doing it - just like the congestion charge.

Something about that video I didn't like - he portrayed companies as fat cats and us consumers as the innocent ones but in my view - we are fat cats ourselves too. How many of us have done charity work 100% of our time (I mean never found a paid job before and devoted themselves to charity work)? Most of us work to earn money so we can buy stuff for ourselves and loved ones. If you get a job offer for doing the same job but get a lot more money, you'd accept it. Companies consists of people exactly like you and me. They also have things they want to buy. So why should they be treated differently to you? Only difference is you're paying them money you earned. Which none of us like doing.

Funny how if in the first place it wasn't possible to swap games none of this would be of discussion. But because we're so used to it, everyone sees it as their right to do so.

 

Im gonna suggest that everyone reading this NOT BUY a nextgen console during the first year and put that cash towards a gaming pc. With the amount of quality games getting pc ports its the smarter thing to do, even fighting games are getting pc releases (Kof and MK)

But when the systems start maturing ill probably go with Sony since they have always done me right

 

Take my situation for instance. I play games often as an outlet for my frustration and my main source of amusement. While I play games all the time I don't have to much money for them. I may have 200 max a year to spend on games. Spending that on 2 new games with their season passes of DLC will cost me 180. If Instead I get one new game with pass and 3 used games at about 30 each I get a lot more bang for my buck with the same 20 dolars left for online passes if I choose to buy them. And while I admit gaming is a luxury, let's be real, its way more like buying a book than a Ferrari, its something that you can go without but is great to have.

And when you buy games at major discounts like that your severly minimizing your contribution to the people who made it. That's not exactly helping them out. At least paying their set online pass fee gets money in the publishers hands to support more developer games (hopefully).

And exposure alone will leave any system viable to pirates. And while they are all ways lurking I doubt these guys would even buy these things even if they could. I would suggest just finding them out and bricking their consoles. You steal from them, they steal from you.

 

If Sony could set up the whole used games infrastructure, they would. And they probably will, too. I don't think that publishers are going to accept this kind of thing on one platform but not the other.

 

First of all, games go out of print quick if they're not popular. So most options is buying it used. Can I find a brand new copy of Super Metroid for the Super NES, no. I could get it on other platforms, but is not the same due to the soundchip on the SNES, so I rather play it there. And also I have to pay a lot for that on Ebay, and guess who getting the money, not Nintendo, the seller. Because Nintendo got the money MANY moons ago, and the seller could do whatever the fuck he wants with it. Imagine if your logic applies to music. That would be a shitty thing. I wasn't born in the 50's but I like surf rock. And most of those records never got printed to A-Track, cassette or CD. So guess what my options are...Thrift shops and record shows. And your logic about Rolex and expensive cars are flaw. Both of those "Luxury's" can be bought used. And, no one here is stupid to want something they cannot afford. They buy whats in range. So they wouldn't get into a hobby they couldn't afford. So used, Price drops, Thrift Shops, Ebay, Amazon....etc are the avenues that consumers have. So is disingenuous bring such comparisons up.

Bullshit. Is budgeting. Look at that failure of FFXIII as an example. Was it piracy that hurt that game? Fucking no. It sold solid on the PS3. And piracy at the time for the PS3 was like fort knox. But the game bomb for being horrible and mis-management. Those idiots sponsor the whole NBA All-Star game, fools. Now that company is feeling it for doing dumb shit like that. Look at the money they spent on the Tomb Raider Reboot. Game sold copies, but they just recently announced they broke even. Same with Hitman and Sleeping Dogs. The PC market is striving. Look at Steam, GMG, GOG and Amazon. A Platform so easy to pirate, but yet, people still buy games on that platform. People buy and support good products.

Mention this an abundance of times. Games go out of print, and rarely get a reprint, unlike the music industry, print and films. So your only option is buying used.

Jesus dude, your analogies are freaking appalling, is flawed beyond belief. Because this is the way its setup now *Going by your flawed example* Lends me disc(Key), put it on my system*Or his to be more exact*(car) and play on my profile(My License) And no, there is no such thing like that for music or films. Because those industries mature. They understand not punishing their consumers. Unless you're Disney....