Pai Q&A thread

Discussion in 'Pai' started by Combolammas, Sep 6, 2014.

  1. Combolammas

    Combolammas Sheep Content Manager Goh

    I got a bunch of random questions and I noticed Pai forum does not have a general question & answer thread. Now it does.

    1. After 33P+G, dash BT K vs Taka is there really nothing better than 9KK after? 6K+G seems to miss on him and I feel like I should be able to hit him with something else here.

    2. What does hakkeshou sabaki? I think it's HP, HE, MP, EL, but I haven't actually tested. Is that it?

    3. What's recommended after Pai's reversals if the opponent ends up next to a wall? I'm just going with 9KK W! 466P+K.
    Also some of them are +15, some are +16 and one is +13 ST. Do these differences allow you any extra option ever (like next to wall or vs Taka or something)?

    4. Is there any reason to ever use 3P+G instead of 33P+G? The only thing I figured was that vs Taka you can connect 3KPP on him afterwards. This can cause a wallstagger but it's easy to escape. Is there anything going on with this move?

    5. What's the frames of Pai 3P,K~2 on block, hit and CH?

    I guess that's it for now.
  2. Sozos

    Sozos Pai Sucksan Content Manager Pai

    1. I havent test [3][3][P][+][G] >dash BT[K] against Taka for a long long time but i remember the time when i was testing it [9][K][K] seems the best as ender. So i dont think you can do better combo but, against taka after [3][3][P][+][G] >BT[K] I use moves that can give me nice meaty oki game,specific to taka . Some examples here:
    1) [3][3][P][+][G]> BT[K] > [3][3][P][+][K]>meaty [3][K] on side +12 guaranteed [P][K] or [P][P][4][P]
    2) [3][3][P][+][G]> BT[K] > [4][K]Bokutai,Bokutai[P] as meaty
    3) [3][3][P][+][G]> BT[K] > [2][P][+][K][K] >BT[7][K] as meaty.
    Im sure you can find even more.

    2. Hakkeshou sabaki HP,MP,HE and Elbow.. Like you said

    After Pai's reversals [9][K][K] is the most common move and next to wall i usually do [9][K][K] W! WS[K]. Against elbows and knees you get +15 or +16 so you can do [K] launcher,sometimes the [K] can't connect depending of char's hitboxes,but im sure against almost all elbows and knees in closed stance you get it. Also that one with +13 iirc when u reversal mid right kick if the opponent doesnt hold [2_] you can do [4][4][K][K] > Backthrow[P][+][G] > [6][6][K][P] >[P][P][4][P][K]. Is guaranteed when opponent doesnt hold[2_].

    About [3][P][+][G], i dont use it that much but it would be good only for switching side to put your opponent near to the wall or for ringout opportunity. [3][P][+][G] > [9][K][K]. And yeah, like you said [3][K][P][P] against Taka is guaranteed afterwards. i cant think something better about this move.

    [3][P][K] charge[2] on block is -3 , on NH -2 and on CH +9.
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2014
  3. Sozos

    Sozos Pai Sucksan Content Manager Pai

    Nice thread you made Combolammas. We should have created this long ago.
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2014
  4. EvenPit

    EvenPit Well-Known Member Content Manager Eileen

    A quick question about one of Pai's moves, sorry I don't know the input but it's her shoulder move. It crumples on side turn even on normal hit. My question is, up to what frame advantage is this possible for her to get the NH side crumple? I ask this because dojo does not tell you info on advantage/disadvantage if you sidestep a move u just like, gotta know from, practice. Like for example I KNOW It's not possible after evading faster moves like [P], [6][P], etc. but
  5. Combolammas

    Combolammas Sheep Content Manager Goh


    Look at the total frames of a move you wish to evade and reduce 41 (23f evade + 17f 466P+K + 1 because of dash input in the move) and the amount of disadvantage you are in when starting evade. For example you can use it to punish Goh 6K (48 total) when evading from -7 or less.
    EvenPit and Kruza like this.
  6. shadowmaster

    shadowmaster Well-Known Member

    I have another question regarding 466P+K it is something I had on my mind for some time.
    Do this in dojo set the dummy to P after a block and get your P blocked and follow it up with 466 P+K. It will beat the P clean every time if you do it right. P should beat it even at -2 but it doesn't. If I put myself at a slight disadvantage it loses to standing P but it seems to me like the beginning of the start up of the move low profiles under highs slightly. It isn't like 46P+K that naturally goes under all obvious highs. It seems to me that it only works when Pai has plus frames or is neutral. This is something I knew of for a very long time but never bothered to look into seriously since you don't want to be throwing out 466P+K unless you are close to the wall or in a side turn hit situation.

    What do you think about this if you saw this happen before yourself in dojo.
    beanboy, Kruza and EvenPit like this.
  7. KrsJin

    KrsJin Well-Known Member

    In watching some Pai footage recently, I don't really see Hakkeshou get used much. Any idea on why? Is it too linear? Tough to setup/utilize? The P and P+G options out of it seem pretty nice to me. Or just canceling out of it and going for something else.
  8. beanboy

    beanboy Well-Known Member

    Found this awhile ago. Interesting.
    I'm getting ideas all of a sudden.:holla:
    Tricky likes this.
  9. SlowCast

    SlowCast Member

    Hakkeshou has a delay before Pai can do followups. Against players with good reaction they can interrupt with 2p or even worse, launch her. Her sabaki off Hakkeshou is probably quick enough to reverse launchers but not 2p nor kick/knee launchers so against certain characters doing this RAW might get her killed

    And the return on P and P+G may not be that high to worth the risk
    Myke likes this.
  10. KrsJin

    KrsJin Well-Known Member

    Thanks SlowCast, that was kind of my concern trying her more and looking at frame data. I've tried to use it on oki but that too seems risky.

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