Punishing Low Moves - Lion

Discussion in 'Junky's Jungle' started by LittleWild, Jan 17, 2002.

  1. LittleWild

    LittleWild Well-Known Member

    For characters with Lt, this is not so much of a problem. However, I am talking about characters without Lt. To be specific, Lion.

    Are there any good moves that you can use to punish your opponent after you blocked their low sweep/kicks or their low raising attacks? Elbow doesn't work because of D, f+P.

    Thanks.
     
  2. ice-9

    ice-9 Well-Known Member

    You can do elbow still. Usually the recommended method is to buffer a forward dash to bring Lion standing, but b,b, f(G), and b(G) seem to work for me. So from crouch -> f,f(G) -> f+P. Done very quickly, and the elbow will execute like normal and you shouldn't see the dash.

    P.S. This method was already outlined in my Lion Dojo. /versus/images/icons/wink.gif /versus/images/icons/smile.gif /versus/images/icons/wink.gif
     
  3. Yupa

    Yupa Well-Known Member

    Yep, a forward dash forces your character to stand just like a crouch dash forces your character to crouch. If you want the standing elbow after blocking a sweep, just enter in f,f,f+P as if you were doing Akira's super dashing elbow. You'll get the attack you want.

    Lion players: (I know so little about the mantis geek...)
    Can you use one of the attacks that gives you a kazure down on normal hit in this situation? Or do these attacks knock down if you use them to minor counter?

    (I'm too lazy right now to look up example attacks or chk out the Lion dojo to see if it's mentioned there... /versus/images/icons/tongue.gif)
     
  4. alantan

    alantan Well-Known Member

    I could never seem to do that to punish low moves. maybe it is my fingers. anyway that is the problem for Lion. How about a knee? Lion looks like having initiative on minor counter so not too bad. better than d_f+p.
     
  5. ken

    ken Well-Known Member

    Yeah what is wrong with doing Lion's knee (f+k),

    I haven't paid much attention to countering the low punch.

    How much faster is the elbow vs the knee, after blocking low punch?

    f, f(g),f+p vs f+k


    In terms of speed, range, followup, iniative, stagger properties aren't both moves similar?

    Anyone want to comment?
     
  6. LittleWild

    LittleWild Well-Known Member

    For one thing, a knee will be much easier to do than a f f (g) f+p.

    Wonders if anyone obeserved how chibita punish low moves.
     
  7. ken

    ken Well-Known Member

    Chibita generally always does the elbow from buffer dash cancel.

    f, f (g), f+p

    I can't tap fff as fast as I used after 4 years of Quake. Thats why I gave up my Akira :(
     
  8. nycat

    nycat Well-Known Member

    Are there any good moves that you can use to punish your opponent after you blocked their low sweep/kicks or their low raising attacks?
    VF4 Lion FAQ <.> Tips, Intelligence, Tactics and Strats(TITS) against Low Attacks
    What to do as counter to blocked d+K+G (2k+g)?
    <font color=yellow>uk-guy</font color=yellow>, reporting on his observations at <font color=blue>Kani-Spo</font color=blue> in Japan:
    ÂÂgf+K is used when Lion blocks stuff like ÂÂgcircular sweepsÂÂh, i.e. (d+K+G)ÂÂh
    LionÂÂfs Knee f+K=6k

    6k ->33 -> 63214p+g ->66 ->9k
    6k ->46p+k -> ?
    <font color=black>The Mantis Geek</font color=black> that posted this on 3rd of October
    suggested a back crouch dash after failed 6k. See Jacky Crouch Dash
    (CD) post by nyCREW found here at <font color=blue>VFDC</font color=blue> through <font color=orange>Search</font color=orange> feature on icon bar.

    6k ->33 -> see <font color=white>ice-9ÂÂfs LionÂÂfs Dojo</font color=white> for flowchart and explanation

    What to do as answer to Low Punch (2p=d+P)

    Bullet Kick is two word answer.
    Below are a few select options from <font color=black>The BrotherhoodÂÂfs </font color=black>
    Mantis Flowchart (MF)


    ÂÂgBulletÂÂh Kick Options 3K=df+K=d/f+K=3k

    3k->6p+k->66kk->2k->3p

    3k->4p+k->66kk
    Opponent will often do Throw Escape (TE)
    of one sort or another and ÂÂgwhiffÂÂh after bullet knee.
    3k->3pp->3p
    Shoot, Stab and Slab
    Trains your opponent to block high and mid attacks.
    Then you may increase % of throws that will stick.
    3k->43p->66kk
    mixes levels
    3k->332_6p+g->46k+g2p->8p
    3k->61p+g->!->3pp->3pp Stabs and slabs from side!
    3k->2_6p( if blocked ÂÂgungrabÂÂh(TE)->66kk
    3k->332_6p+g
    3k->[ if opponent escapes/dodges/teleports away(?)]
    46p+k,p->p+k+g->46p+k,p,p
    Blur of fists delivers stun. Add Finish.
    Blocked or whiffed low attack is often followed by quick move
    to standing position by opponent. If oppoent is in habit of doing this...
    Catch and Release Stab and Slab 'em is potent.
    61p+g -> 3pp -> 3p
    Directional indications used above
    789=<.>up/back<.>up<.>up/forward
    456
    123
     
  9. MrWhite

    MrWhite Well-Known Member

    Lion's warp

    Nycat you could probably explain to me the deal with this : When Lion goes for straight u+P knockdown and goes for a ground swipe (d/f+P), when opp. QRs they get warped to a standing position (?!?!) not to mention the ground swipe misses... I've seen it before but only really noticed it yesterday when Satan Shark was playing Lion against me ( Akira | Wolf | Kage ) and it pretty much applied to all chars. and all other machines...
     
  10. CreeD

    CreeD Well-Known Member

    Re: Lion's warp

    Here's another thing I'm too lazy to find the answer too, it's not nearly as weird.
    What is it we see in the recent chibita movies that looks like some sort of high punch inashi/sabaki/something? Look in daioh_1-19noji5.wmv - lion sort of raises both hands up, brings them down, and akira is suddenly stumbling while lion's close to his side. Lion then throws. It's similar in animation to aoi's new d/b+P I think.
     
  11. feixaq

    feixaq Well-Known Member

    Re: Lion's warp

    That's his catch throw -- f, db+P+G. Sometimes he chains it with the standard throw followup, sometimes he just does the catch throw dodge and does a different attack instead.
     
  12. ghostdog

    ghostdog Well-Known Member

    Re: Lion's warp

    CreeD, if I'm not mistaken, that's Lion's catch throw (f, db+P+G). It functions a lot like Akira's Fake Grasping Mind throw.
     

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