Putting together a basic VF guide.

Hey folks.

With VF5 now being a confirmed tournament title at Hypespotting 2012 I figured I would try and throw together a guide for people wanting to learn the basics of the game before March.

Aside from the things on the game system I'm writing up Marly and I have started piecing together a general outline of each characters, listing their pros and cons in a simple way that would hopefully help folk choose a character.

The only problem is I'm having a very real problem thinking of disadvantages a character has.

I done some disadvantages for Wolf fairly easily, general things but when it came to Jacky and Akira I honestly can't think of much that's simple enough to mention.

I mean for Jacky, a lot of his strings end high. That's a weakness but only if you're mashing strings and beatknuckle.

Is there really anything else?

It's easy to list the strengths a character has bt when it comes to weaknesses I draw a blank. Fair enough if you're lightweight you'll be taking more damage but aside from that what else?


Should I do away with pros and cons and just have a list of notable things about each character?

Here is an example of what we have so far:

_____________________________________________________

Eileen (Monkey Kung FU):

Strengths:

+Fast and evasive
+Good damage from combos
+Great wake up game
+Very safe[/size]

Weaknesses:
-Poor range
-Low single hit damage
-Very linear
-Poor throw game
-Takes big damage from combos
-Easy to ring out[/size]

Summary:
You might like this character if - You enjoy being in your opponents face/applying pressure all the time, you like attacking from disadvantaged situations, you don't mind your character being a little girl.

Command List
Combos


_____________________________________________________

Wolf Hawkfield (Pro Wrestling):

Strengths:

+Incredible throw game
+Takes low damage from juggles
+High combo damage
+Great Ringout potential
[/size]

Weaknesses:
-Slow Combo starters
-Poor punishment outside of throws
-Very few strings
-Is left at a large disadvantage when blocked[/size]

Summary:
You might like this character if - You like throwing your opponent about like a ragdoll and using slower but more powerful moves to pick your moments and cause very high damage.

Command List
Combos


Also, I hope it's okay to link the VFDC things for each character as well.

Marly wrote Eileen's and I wrote Wolf's.

If any of you have some time and want to get involved I'd really appreciate some feedback on this. If you can help list what you would consider the strengths and weaknesses of the cast.

 

I'm looking forward to reading this, I think these kinds of things are great. I don't really know what level of players you're aiming at, but if it's for beginners I think it's great advice to mention lots of Jacky's strings ending high like you said. May seem obvious to you, but not necessarily for someone new to the game (I would know).

As for Akira, one of the main things I think about when facing him is he doesn't have any full circular rising kicks, giving me an edge in rising situations since Sarah can use + to beat all his rising kicks. I guess this is more of a weakness against her in particular, but anyone can still evade them though. (Maybe it's too specific/advanced to mention.) The fact that he's not exactly the easiest character to use effectively may not be a weakness per se, but still good to know as beginner. And like Wolf, he doesn't have that many strings right?

 

As this is aiming to people who´ve never really played VF before (I guess?), I think this not a bad idea. But the VF4 guide Akai posted is imo a bit more detailed. Why don´t you use this as a Template for a new, updated one?

If I remember correctly, the VF5 Braidyguide had a good summarize of each characterspecific Pros and Cons, but I honestly don´t know where mine could be...
However, as it goes for Akira I can help in a bit:
"Strengths":
-Great weak up game
-Good combo Damage
-Tactically easy to play
-Several reversals
-great pressure
-Good mid-attacks

"Weaknesses":
-Very linear
-Bad throw game
-Difficult Inputs
-pretty much no low attacks

The quotationmarks are because some stuff can hardy be considered be as a weakness(Difficult Inputs) or Strength (Tactically easy). All I can think of right now.

 

I like lists so i'd rather see this type of initiative structured like akai's link. Preferably ranking characters instead of just saying yes/no (and counting the number of ticks at the end). However IMHO some of the criteria chosen are unclear and/or subjective:

* Continuous offense: hard to quantify; also every character is played like that on xbox live
* Technical control: hard to quantify; somewhat redundant since it should be the opposite of "easy to play"
* Easy to play: do we mean easy inputs for key moves or easy inputs for staple combos? both? something else? It's hard to quantify anyway
* Upside depth: this depends on the completely subjective variable of "player skill" so it's impossibel to quantify
* Combo strength: OK
* R.O. strength: OK; hard to quantify though because some characters don't have a RO potential to their back so using a formula like "(forward RO potential rank + backwards RO potential rank)/2" is not applicable
* Big damage potential: seems redundant since it could be reduced to the sum of "Combo Strength" and "Throw strength"
* Variety in attacks: OK; quantifiable via the number of attacks for each character on the command list
* Throwing strength: OK; formula could be (max damge from neutral + max damage from throw direction 1 + max damage from throw direction 2 + ... + max damage from throw direction N)/(N+1)
* Overall speed: OK but with criteria please otherwise ranking for middleweights will end up subjective; for example (jab exe speed + fastest mid exe speed + high floater exe speed + mid floater exe speed)/4; or maybe add "mid CH floater exe speed" and divide by 5
* Defensive depth: VFdc members are unable to agree on what constitutes defense
* Ground game depth: OK but with criteria; for example (number of ground throws + number of low throws + number of moves with 5f or more execution frames that do over 20 dmg)/3

If i were to reuse this i'd remove subjective criteria & i would clarify how the rest are calculated. Also, i would add some extra categories:

* Non-throw punishment strength: as already mentioned; criteria should be (9f punisher damage rank + 10f punisher damage rank + 11f punisher damage rank + ... + 17f punisher damage rank)/8;
* Tracking: number of semicircular & circular moves
* Safety: number of moves that are -12f or more on block, character with the least ones ranks higher

Anyway, just a thought. Some of these criteria require information that hasn't been compiled since VF5vanilla was released. Maybe when VF5FS is released

 

Well the goal was to keep things simple in order to aid a new player to choose a character based on face value.

Information overload is a VERY easy way to turn someone off something.

It's all well and good for us who h ave been playing for years now to go "Oh, yeah. He has some strong throws but they're on the same direction and he lacks decent punishment at -14 but at -16 he can take a third of your bar."

New players don't want to hear that.

I'm having a look through this thread

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In Tekken I play Steve Fox, in DOA I play Zack... Naturally I feel like I should use Brad in VF. Is he easy to pick up? Does he bob and weave like the other two boxers I mentioned? I love evasiveness. I was also thinking of using Eileen, simply because of the unique fighting style. What do you think? </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sooo I use Lei-fang in DoA, Asuka in Tekken, so I should use Pai in VF5?</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi I have been going back and forth between trying to pick a character. I want to try and pick one or two characters to master, but I don’t know what to pick that is a good character, but also fits what I want. For one I have been looking at http://virtuafighter.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/168404/fpart/6 to try and pick a character that could hold its own.

I like to play on the more aggressive side and always like throwing in grabs when I can. The characters in SC3 I play is Cervantes 1st and 2nd being Astaroth. I don’t really know what more to say.

Oh and not Kage.

So please what do you think I may like and why?
Thanks
</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm having a difficult character deciding what character to learn/stick with. I started out on Goh, but I feel like I don't know the game well enough to make a Sabaki/Grapple character work. Typically, I like characters with strong wake-up games who really put pressure on a fallen opponent and similarly characters with good corner (2d) and wall (3s) games. Who are some characters that have strong Okizeme game?
</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">im totally new to virtua fighter and a former doa player
i ll qualify for the national team of germany and still have about 3 months of training but first i have to pick the right character.

first of all i need a character which is not that difficult to start with because im not familiar with the vf system which is totally different to the doa system!
but beside that fact this character should be able towin on higher competition!</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I trained with kage and lei fei Pai but I think they're sucky because they're slow and Pai got low damage attacks.

Someone can give me advise to choose a character that's fast and got a got good punches?</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Can you make a sort of tokusatsu costume with El Blaze? If so, Ima play him. If not I might play with Vanessa. I enjoy rushdown/grappling chars overall.
</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi everyone!

I'm new to Virtua Fighter and I have no idea who I shall begin to practise with. I usually pick the Karate characters (Ryu in Street Fighter Ein in DOA), so I think I'm looking for something that resembles that style.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey guys, I'm new here and to Virtua Fighter and I was reading a lot about the different characters but I'm having a difficult time selecting one. Is there any character that has good reversals, or is such a strategy not really valid in VF5? I'd like to be able to read what my opponent is going to do and try to counter it.

Thanks for any info!</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">okay so I have a hard time sticking with a character in his game U play Xiaoyu in tekken and Eliot in doa can some can some one please recommend a charcter for me</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi guys, I'm new to VF and need some assistance on which character to play with. At the moment, I am quite liking Brad and Jacky but I only want to use one of them and dunno which one. I play Tekken quite regularly and am quite good at it, I play with Hwoarang, Law and Lee in that but I dont know if I should let that affect my decision here.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Can somebody explain lau, im interested in learning him but dont know if his playstyle suites me.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok and can somone explain lei fei to me.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Somewhat new to the game. Been using brad for about a day, and I like what he has to offer on offense. With that being said, I wouldn't mind using someone who allows me to fight defensively.

Any suggestions?</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Kinda have the same problem too. Still trying to find a character that fits me. For example, I usually liked to lockdown opponents in the corner and/or go for ring-outs very often if the game had the option to do so. I was also good at dodging things so I was sorta hard to hit.

I been screwing around with Eileen, you think she would be right for me or someone else based on what I wrote? I like fast characters they're usually my first choice. Of course I can control even the slowest character if they have what I'm looking for.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">First off, sorry about making a topic like this. I realize there's probably been a million of these kinds of threads before, but I would still appreciate a bit of help.

I'm looking for a character that dictates the tempo of a match. The kind that uses a wide variety of spacing and poking tools to manipulate their opponent into making a mistake.

I really, really, would appreciate a bit of guidance on this matter. Thank you to anyone who replies.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok so I know I'm not the best at VF but I wanted to ask you guys a serious thing I have considered. I've always been a Jacky player and love playing as him however I've noticed that maybe I should change to a new character.

I was thinking a character that has lots of different options from different situations, maybe a character that hits light but hits often?

Could any of you guys suggest such a character?</div></div>



Some selected quotes from that thread.

To me it seems that the things people want most from a character other than the aesthetic is as follows:

A character who embodies a particular play style.
A character who fights similarly to another character from another game.
A character who is easy to use.
A character who is viable at high level play

I think we can all be in agreement that most of the above is pretty null and void in the grand scheme of things. Any character can fit any play style. The similarities between characters across different titles largely ends at aesthetics and "fighting style" when it comes to 3D fighters. As much as some folk will try to disagree, every character in VF is viable.

Now, I won't say "We should lie to new players". Far from it. What I want to do is present the characters in such a way that these questions don't come up as often. In a way which enables someone to go:

"Oh, Wolf is a big lumbering guy with massive throws. I play Zangief in Street Fighter. I guess Wolf is the man for me!"

We all know that isn't the case really but it gives people a jumping off point and it lets them feel more comfortable with the perceived playstyle of their choice and helps give the player a kick in the right direction.

Sooner or later they will begin to realise that their character should not be taken at such face value. Sure, to a new player Wolf is going to feel like he's fighting in a marsh. Is Wolf slow?

Yeah.

Does he have to be played slow?

Fuck no.

Have you SEEN Flash's Wolf? Aptly named.

I can understand that it would be nice for more battle hardened players to have an outline of each character, their specific punishment options and so on as it allows us to transition over to new characters based on our own playstyles.

Here is my experience with characters:

I got the demo, tried Akira. NOWAY.
Chose Blaze instead.

Got the game. Played with Blaze for a little bit, switched to Wolf because he had a Stone Cold Stunner. Yup.

Learned Jacky because I was constantly getting slapped by Jorjo's parlour trick offense.

Doubled back on Akira as I thought he would help me sharpen my execution in general (it did), also I believe EVERY VF player plays a little bit of Akira ('cause it's Akira).

Fell in love with playing like a flamboyant prick with Jacky.

Picked Blaze back up because he embodies this.

I didn't know what I wanted to begin with. I just bumped about until I found what felt right and to tell the truth most people will likely go through a similar process. Hell, you reading this right now probably have some crazy reason for playing who you play now and why you have switched about in the past.

Anyway, before I digress any further.

The point (once again) was to put things in face value so people wouldn't feel too intimidated by the cast, be able to find their own starting point on their VF journey and get in the mix.

By slinging too much at a new VF player they'll likely walk.

Hell, even one of these would help immensely:



(Sorry it's about Bleach, I just googled "stat chart"

 

That's great, Akai.

We should definitely stick something like that in just to help folk get a hold of a character!

 

I can't translate that but it looks like an expanded version of the game manual.

I don't have any image manipulation software (actually using my girlfriend's mum's laptop) but if anyone here has the time nd inclination would it be possible to chop out those cool little images and stick some text at the bottom. It's kinda obvious which each picture is trying to show.

The last page is lost on me though D:

 

Is it okay with everyone if I just post up what we have here? If you have any change suggestions or additional info then you can just post up and I can change it.

 

Just as a critique. I don't really think eileen should have a great wakeup game as a pro. She doesn't really have many options for beating out rising attacks like some other characters do. It could be just my style of using her, but I would say her wake-up game is mediocre at best.

 

I just think her not having an easy rising crush move is what makes her oki game not as strong as someone like Jacky. Or having an easy punish for Tech rollers liek Jacky's 46K+G. 214P+K, P is easy to see coming from a mile away and will not really work in higher level play more than once or twice in a bunch of sets.

Top level players still get hit by rising attacks, so you have to deal with them no matter what, they're a tool to keep people honest. I just think Eileen's oki is nowhere near being good enough to list it as a strength. Maybe i low level player because noobs don't know to look for 214P+K.

I think this is why others have mentioned that using the pros and cons list for this guide may not be the best way to go about things. Most characters can do most things, it's just a matter of how well you think a character does said thing that makes it a con /pro.

 

Okay, how about this for a new layout?

I done away with pros and cons and instead just stuck a bit more info on the character, highlighting some stuff about them but without any major claims.

Keeping the "You may like this character" part lighthearted and fun.

Also decided to include some "Key moves" although these are not neccasarily the character's "best" moves they usually be the most common ones at the levels. Included an attack which bounces as well. In regards to launchers I wanted to use something which doesn't require a CH and is a noticeable launch instead of a crumple or slam/flop.

Also included is their Bio from the VF4 section here on VFDC. As it's from VF4 I don't have the bios for Blaze and Eileen. If anyone could help me with this I'd appreciate it!


Wolf Hawkfield (Pro Wrestling):

Country: Canada
Birthday: 1966.02.08
Sex: Male
Blood Type: O
Hobby: Karaoke
Stature: 181 cm
B/W/H: 123/93/98
Weight: 101 kg
Occupation: Woodman
Fighting Style: Pro Wrestling


Wolf Hawkfield is a strong character and what he lacks in speed he more than makes up for with his high damage. With an arsenal littered with powerful throws and attacks which cause knockdowns Wolf is able to keep his opponents peeling themselves from the ground. You might like this character if - You like throwing your opponent about like a ragdoll and using slower but more powerful moves to pick your moments and cause very high damage.

KEY MOVES:
Mid:
Low:
Circular:
Launch:
Bounce:
Throw:

Command List
Combos

-------------------------------------





Any changes? Too much info?

Once a format is decided upon it will be easy to churn these out for each character.

 

I like the format, just some things i noticed:

Are we sure wolf is only 181cm? I remember Jacky is 180 too. But there's no surprise if Sega made some change between games about that. Actually Wolf and Jeffry are really tall compared to the rest of the cast.

And i think we should focus on the new moveset, since vf5 won't be played when fs comes out. Since the grizly is removed, maybe it shouldn't be listed in the Key Moves.

 

This was more for people wanting to pick up the game here in the UK seeing as there is a tournament coming up in March. I suppose it wouldn't hurt for anyone looking to play some VF before FS comes.

When FS does/is about to drop we could add Jean, Taka and update the move lists.

 

I just notice that Wolf is a 45 years old Canadian

 

Yeah. I never thought. Aoi will be like a 50 year old high school student.

 

Apart from the information on each character's fighting style, which could get incorporated into the main text, all the other bio data seems superfluous for what you want to achieve with this in-a-nutshell kind-of guide.