Room 101: George W. Bush, "because he says so"

George W. Bush: Because he says so

created by the daily show. a nice, succinct look at the way the war evolved from the war on terror to regime change and geographical control. Interesting thing that they don't bring up but is implied is the startling way that memory works. In the politcal climate most people seem to remember only what was on today's front page of the Newspaper.

whatever is presented as new and valid-- even if it wholly contradicts the old and valid--is taken at face value and accepted. The inherent flaws in presentation and truth are shaken off. George Orwell described this in his book, 1984 with the phrase doublethink.

It is in the administrations best interest that you remain cowed and believing with your leash in your mouth.

GE
<font color="green"> Who controls the past controls the future; who controls the present controls the past </font>

 

Caught the clip yesterday on TV, actually. /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif Very funny. Thanks for link - I was hoping to see it again.

<font color="yellow">.cheers.</font>

 

Thats a fun look at the presidency

 

Bush versus facts: This is the biggest weakness of the Bush Administration. The facts are stubborn and impervious to spin. Sadly, the public is not immune to spin. After 9/11, the Administration began telling officials to look for links between 9/11 and Iraq despite the fact that nothing suggested that there were any. This makes it seem like the Administration may have been looking for any pretext to invade Iraq Gosh, could it be?) There are also reports of Cheney and others working to extract certain kinds of intelligence from the intelligence agencies. No matter what the Spin Masters say, the administration wanted badly to invade Iraq and settled on WMD as a justification thanks to the fear created by 9/11.

But, oh, those persistent facts.

No WMD Iraq.

No Iraqi links to al Queda.

No competent plan for reconstruction.

No bin Laden.

Afghanistan turning to shit.

Afghani Opium profits funding terrorists.

Islamic Jihad now a more decentralized, diffuse, independent conglomeration spanning the world.

Anti-Americanism at an all time high.

The economy flagging.

The air and water more poisonous.

The budget-deficit at an all time high.

Incomes for the rich rising.

Incomes for most people falling (or disappearing).

The number of people living in poverty rising.

Manufacturing jobs leaving.

McDonald's and Wal-Mart hiring.

Everybody else firing.

Number of Americans with medical insurance decreasing.

Pharmaceutical corporations' stocks rising.

Cost of medicine increasing...

Fuck I could go on here., but you get the point (OK, Pope doesn't, but there is no hope for him). Do see now why the Bush Campaign is running the dirtiest in history? What else are they going to do, point to all of their great accomplishments?

Given all these facts, how does Bush even have the balls to run for reelection? How can he be ahead in the polls? This is the ultimate victory of spin! There is no journalism now. The networks and cable news organizations do not inform us. They are corporate mouthpieces without the fortitude or inclination to present an accurate picture of reality to the American public. How did it come to this?

The Daily Show is the best source of news on tv. Isn't this absurd? The fake news is more on point than the real news.

Take the Swift Vet nonsense. Here, from the Daily Show:

"CORDDRY: I'm a reporter, Jon, and my job is to spend half the time repeating what one side says, and half the time repeating the other. Little thing called "objectivity"--might wanna look it up someday.

STEWART: Doesn't objectivity mean objectively weighing the evidence and calling out what's credible and what isn't?

CORDDRY: Whoa-ho! Well, well, well--sounds like someone wants the media to act as a filter! [high-pitched, effeminate] "Ooh, this allegation is spurious! Upon investigation this claim lacks any basis in reality! Mmm, mmm, mmm." Listen buddy: not my job to stand between the people talking to me and the people listening to me.

[...]

STEWART: So, basically, you're saying that this back-and-forth is never going to end.

CORDDRY: No, Jon--in fact a new group has emerged, this one composed of former Bush colleagues, challenging the President's activities during the Vietnam era. That group: Drunken Stateside Sons of Privilege for Plausible Deniability..."

This is a satirical way of saying a few things about the media and the "controversy." The media had been manipulated by the GOP. They are completely cowed. The goal of journalism is to get at the truth, and the truth about Kerry's military record is not ambiguous. The Swift Vets are obviously deranged Vietnam vets who still haven't forgiven Kerry for speaking out against the war in Vietnam. Their accusations are completely unsubstantiated.

So what does the press do? They stay in the middle, refusing to take a side. On a subject about which there was no doubt, the GOP has successfully created scandal and an example of character assassination. The average Joe Dumbass is left thinking "Gee, where there is smoke there must be fire." Score one for Liars.

Imagine this: A group called Goat Herders for Truth receives funding and legal services from people connected to the Kerry campaign. They run tv ads accusing George W. Bush of being a serial goat fondler. The ads feature tearful accounts of Texan goat herders recounting the horror left in the wake of our goat fondling commander in chief. At the end of the commercial, video rolls showing a freshly sodomized goat in an emergency room. A voice-over says: "George W. Bush: unfit for command and the last person you'd want to leave your goat with." Finally the goat with the sore ass looks plaintively into the camera and says: "Bleeeaat!"

Now imagine that the media treats these ads with complete neutrality. They run stories saying that there is no proof of any of the allegations, but stop short of calling the ads dishonest. They give air time and interviews to the Goat Herders for Truth, allowing them to bring their message to an even wider audience. Bush tumbles in the polls...

 

ZELL ON EARTH.

That might be the way you do things in Jew York, or Jew Jersey, or Jew Mexico... or Jewfoundland, but that's not how we do things in America!

 

Your a very angry person. You must get it from that lunatic Micheal Moore you love so much

George Bush is the Greatest! Vote W'04

 

And of course John Kerry is going to make everything perfect again, right? Yea, whatever.

Truth be told I'd actually prefer Kerry to Bush at this moment in time, mianly due to Bush's ignorant deisre to ban clone research world-wide, and his backward views on social and gay rights. Kerry's policies seem more socially progressive. However, until the American people actually begin to care about the rest of the world all your presidents will continue to stink.

At the end of the day the American people must learn to make sacrifices, like fuel duty rises that stop 200 million people driving huge convertibles and Cadillac's on fuel prices a fraction of what we pay in Europe. We pay nearly $2 per gallon for fuel in UK and mainly drive small economic cars, while the average American drives a car far bigger than his needs and runs it at only $1.45 per gallon, polluting the environment in his wake.

Unfortunately any American presidential contender who made a policy of moderate fuel duty rises would be reduced to irrelevance by the selfish American electorate.

America can't go on living this dream that they can consume what they want and live how they want, at the expense of the wider world.

Fat American tourists come to Scotland and compalin about the sizes of food portions served in restaurants over here, because they're used to wasting so much back home, with the averge meal being enough to feed an army of overweight elephants. It's a disgrace...the food waste that American produces could probably feed the whole of Africa. Everything must be bigger, better, bolder....this is the spirit that drove your poeple when they first settled a few hundred years ago, but this vision is hidiously incompatible in the modern world.

Your policy on Israel must also change. Amongst the public outrage over the military action taken in Iraq, there's a a seething mass of SILENCE over America's continued support of Israel and its illigal occupation of Palistinian land. Not even your precious J Kerry has the guts to make a dramatic change in Israel policy because he knows full well he'd be blown away at the elections if he so much as suggested it.

 

[ QUOTE ]
MAXIMUM said:

And of course John Kerry is going to make everything perfect again, right? Yea, whatever.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, that's what's disturbing about Kerry: He hasn't really taken a strong stance on the 'important' issues yet. The best thing he's got going for him is that he's not Bush.

I agree with you on pretty much everything you said about Americans not giving a flippin shit about the rest of the world. True, I drive a large car, but fortunately that sucker gets better mileage than most other cars on our roads (excluding hybrids) at an avg 25 MPG across the car's lifespan. I wish I could do something about our view on what the world 'owes us', but unfortunately, the only americans I've talked to who think that we should play a lot nicer are the ones who werent even born here. Every other fucking american who was born in this country thinks we have the right to do and take whatever we want, with whatever means we feel like.

Disturbing that the only people who understand this are the ones who had to work to become part of this mess.

Actually, it makes sense.

 

WHAT WOULD JESUS DRIVE?

Single,

white,

male,

carpenter,

A BIG SUV!

 

Being the stereo-typical arrogant American Jack-ass on this forum, I thought I would voice my opionion on the aformentioned vices that we Americans have as a society.

I agree with you that John Kerry won't make everything fine and dandy(obviously). Sen. Flip-Flop will have people only voting against Bush, not for him. Nobody is really extatic about John Kerry, they just dispise George W.

Actually George Bush doesn't want to ban stem-cell research, he has just limited funding to it. A goverment can't go about funding research when large portions of the population are opposed to the goverment using their tax dollars to do so.

You may consider his values "backwards" but I think the president would say he was defending the institution of marriage from the redefinement of it by court judges. In the US over 75% of the pop. in most states oppose gay marriage. What you call "backwards" is what I would call conservative.

Americans aren't a bad people. Americans just consume what is placed in front of them. Americans like big cars, bet you would too if the streets in jolly old england weren't so god damn narrow. As long as large amounts of gasoline, used to fuel our automobiles, is avalible and economical Americans will continue to purchase and drive massive gas gusling monsters. Most people aren't really concerned that much with the enviorement unless they can see it visibly deteriorating. Sure we would all like to have nicer air quality but we also like our Ford Behemoths, and we need them to drop the kids off at soccer games and get the groceries.

I think the reason Americans are unconcerned with the impact of our overindulgences is because there is an ocean between the US and the rest of the world. We don't ever see the impact of our consumption. the only countries contiguous to the US mainland are Canada and Mexico. Canada is like a 51st state and the US practically owns Mexico so those countries don't count.

We are fat aren't we. The reasons for this is the result of competetive-ness between the various restaraunt chains. Restaraunts make their meal big and greasier at cheaper prices in an attempt to luer unsuspecting customers. It's amazing how big food portions can get in the states. We have a tendancy to want to super-size everything. It's a disgusting habit.

We have many vices in our society that foreigners seem to be fond of pointing out, but we also have many more endearing attributes. Don't just look at the bad side of our culture an I think you'll find many great things about our country.

 

[ QUOTE ]
IamthePope said:
We have many vices in our society that foreigners seem to be fond of pointing out, but we also have many more endearing attributes. Don't just look at the bad side of our culture an I think you'll find many great things about our country.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just what are our endearing attributes?

Maximum, do you know what he's talking about?

 

oooh, we're not so bad once you get to know us. Seriously, that should be selfevident.

 

W's America

Maximum, you are largely on point here. I am just going to point out a few things that I take issue with.

1. Kerry won't fix everything, sure enough, But every difference between Kerry and Bush is a positive on the side of Kerry. On every issue, Kerry is better than Bush: Iraq, the environment, taxes, the economy, education, etc.

The flip-flopper charge (which I know you didn't make) is so flimsy as to be laughable (If the GOP hadn't spent about $100 million on ads drilling the idea into the heads of the American public). Bills in the Senate are as thick as a city's phone book. No matter how any legislator votes, they will at times contradict other votes. Kerry does not "flip-flop" more than other legislators. The GOP just has nothing else to cling to, so this is the way they choose to sling their mud.

2. Taxes on gas are not likely to increase anytime soon for economice reasons. But this does not mean nothing could be done. The fuel economy in the U.S. could have been improved if the gov't required car makers to increase fuel economy. They didn't because the auto-makers didn't want to and the oil companies (like all companies) want to sell as much of their product as is possible. This is yet another reason why we do not need oil men in the White House. The oil lobby has billions of dollars at its disposal to use to manipulate our political system. Environmentalists have far less. Guess who gets the upper hand?

3. American support for Israel is largely a function of Israeli lobbyists and interference with the media. Israel is the ultimate sacred cow in American politics. Not because of the votes of Jewish people and fanatical Christians, but because of the influence of Pro-Israeli lobbyists. The media coverage here is also very much skewed in favor of Israel. From what I understand the media in Israel has more pro-Palestinian voices than the American media. For example, after 9/11, the talk was all, "They hate our freedoms," when it would have been more truthful to point out that the radical Islamic World's hatred of the U.S. is due in part to our seemingly unconditional support for Israel. What do we really gain (other than the fanatical hatred of fundamentalist Muslims) by supporting Israel? Oh wait, we need Greater Israel to exist to fulfill Biblical prophesy and bring about the second coming of our lord and savior Jesus Christ! Oops, Pow! Surprise!

 

Re: W's America

Isreal has been trying to defend their country from muslim invaders ever since they were founded by the UN after WW2. Ultimately, no matter how you put it, Isreal is trying to survive surrounded by hostile neigbors. Who wouldn't support Isreal. They're the only democratic country in the Middle East (Turkey doesn't count). The Jews have had a rough time. The Nazis have tried to exterminate them, Crusader Zealots have hunted and killed them, the Romans enslaved them. History has been unkind to the Jews and now after 2000 years they have returned to their homeland only to have to fight for that as well. The Isrealis are not the antagonists in this conflict, they simply want a place to live and a nation to call their own.

 

Israel

While Jews have been among the most persecuted people in world, they have also been among the most prosperous. I believe I read somewhere that the average income for a Jewish adult in America is $50,000 a year. It would be hard to find any ethnic group that lives that well anywhere in the world. Really, the world would might have been better off if instead of creating Israel after WWII, we just allowed for the mass migration of Jewish people to the US.

The palestinians are a reminder that there were people living in what became Israel. The British didn't really have the right to give away the land that they had colonized, but that is a different story. Can you imagine a worse idea than to create a state in the middle of a region populated by members of perhaps the world's most militant religion? I am not trying to disparage Islam here, I am just trying to be a bit concise.

That said, the existence of Israel is now a fact, and not one I think should be reversed, not that anyone probably gives a shit what I think about the matter. It sort of sucks talking about Israel because no one wants to seem anti-semitic. I personally like Jewish people- on the average probably more than I like Christians. But truth be told, I despise the treasonous neoconservatives.

A Non-sequitor here: The majority of the American public approved of the war in Iraq only because the Bush Administration lied repeatedly to them about it. Among all the other countries in the world, only Israel had a public plurality who supported that war.

 

[ QUOTE ]
IamthePope said:

Actually George Bush doesn't want to ban stem-cell research, he has just limited funding to it. A goverment can't go about funding research when large portions of the population are opposed to the goverment using their tax dollars to do so.



You may consider his values "backwards" but I think the president would say he was defending the institution of marriage from the redefinement of it by court judges. In the US over 75% of the pop. in most states oppose gay marriage. What you call "backwards" is what I would call conservative.

Americans aren't a bad people. Americans just consume what is placed in front of them. Americans like big cars, bet you would too if the streets in jolly old england weren't so god damn narrow. As long as large amounts of gasoline, used to fuel our automobiles, is avalible and economical Americans will continue to purchase and drive massive gas gusling monsters. Most people aren't really concerned that much with the enviorement unless they can see it visibly deteriorating. Sure we would all like to have nicer air quality but we also like our Ford Behemoths, and we need them to drop the kids off at soccer games and get the groceries.
.

[/ QUOTE ]

Article on US policy towards stem-cell research:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3609992.stm

Listen, I'm not saying American's are bad people. That would be childish and ignorant...something a Frenchman might say.

American is a great country. It's technology, civil liberties, arts, film, literature and massive investment in space exploration make it hugely respected throught the world.

It's constitution and democratic model is in fact very similar to Scotland's, when we were a fully automomous nation. There's many great connections between my country and America which I'm proud off, and I also happen to think that American's are some of the friendliest people on the planet, on a personal level.

However, it's absolutely fair to say that America has become ignorant and self-centred politically. The world is changing and American must wake up to this in the same way Europe did a long time ago. Advancment and continued prosperity can only come from more inclusive politics. Britain had to give up allot - a whole Empire in fact - when it saw its neighbours changing politically and making economic progress. And now, in a vastly more connected world, the US must relaise the full import of its power and decisions on other countries. If it dosen't it will alienate itself and wither.

Give the world another few decades and watch as growing countries like China and India become economic powerhouses, and start to catch up with the West. (China's economy grows at 8% compared to an average of 3% in the West).

In preperation for this America should be setting examples on green policies and economic responsibilities, otherwise these indistrialising countries are given a green light to pollute and consume as much as America, but on a vastly bigger scale. China and India combined have a population of nearly 2 billion people!!...think about that. Imagine the potential they have to wreck the environment if they wanted to.

As for Israel...you're right. Israel needs to protect itself from militants and extremists. But it must first sacrifice the land it stole from the Palistinians. There is no justification for this occupation....it is simply wrong.

 

Re: Room 101: George W. Bush

I always like reading your posts Maxi. And it may surprise you that I agree with just about everything you said.

I think there is a large portion of society, especialy the religous conservative part, that is afraid that begining cloning research would be like opening pandora's box and that if research is begun on human clones it could lead to all sorts of terrible things. People are terrified at the prospect of doctors using clones like spare parts and experimentation on cloned people. Is it ethical to engineer and then destroy lives in order to save lives? That seems to be the fundemental question that we are dealing with. George Bush is a religous conservative who beleives that all lives are equal, I think thats how he would say it. I don't think I've ever met someone that wanted to clone a human being for scientific research. What is so wrong with a ban on cloning research?

America may seem unilateralist, but Americans don't want to be seen as the international bully. Americans want to play nice with the world. Certainly, the Bush administration first decided that Saddam had to go without consulting other countries, Thats where this all started. In the minds of most Americans, we thought "well, we've had enough of Saddam, and we're are going to get rid of him. Hopefully we can get all of our buddies to help us like we did last time around." the problem with this logic was that we didn't expect there to be a backlash against the US for deciding we wanted Saddam gone I'll by ourselves. So when other countries cried foul at the UN, the US took it as an insult that other countries would dare interfere with our foriegn policy. This led to a division in the NATO alliance. I don't think America has ever tried to be unilateralist, we've always wanted to have friends helping us.

I have a question for you Maxi, what are the reasons people in Europe dislike President Bush so much. I've heard that 87% of the people in europe have an unfavorable opinion of him. Is this due to a anti-Bush media coverage of him? He's a like-able guy after all. He's visited Europe on several occasions and he always acts politely toward the countries he visits and says nice things about them. But every time he goes there people act like he's Hitler come back to haunt him. Even Colin Powell can't go to the closing ceremonies of the Olympics without people calling him a killer and having mass protests. It seems kind of rediculous that people would go out of their way to insult someone like that.

 

Re: Room 101: George W. Bush

[ QUOTE ]
IamthePope said:I don't think I've ever met someone that wanted to clone a human being for scientific research. What is so wrong with a ban on cloning research?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is because you've only ever dealt with people who think with their hearts. You exist in mainstream society, where the pursuit of knowledge is unfathomable to you.

There are people, plenty of people, who would like a chance to explore cloning. Not a majority, in any stretch, but a very skilled, very talented minority. Giving these people the go-ahead to experiment may very well open up new technologies, new cures, new sciences.

But you know what the people doing it would be working for? They'd be doing it because they can, because they are able to push the limits of the known like that.

I personally find the concept of cloning very intriguing. What happens if you do this, do that...it's all kinda exciting. Of course, you will very likely have undesirable outcomes, just like with every branch of science. Unfortunately for biology, it's much too complex and difficult to completely understand to simulate scenarios with any kind of reasonable outcome.

Hard to believe, but there are folks in this country, and in this world, who are not interested in pushing science to come up with the next Computer or Pet Rock. There are people who will do these things, if allowed, simply because they can and understand it. I really think it's a shame to cut these people off before they have a chance to do anything.

 

Re: Room 101: George W. Bush

[ QUOTE ]
IamthePope said:
I have a question for you Maxi, what are the reasons people in Europe dislike President Bush so much. I've heard that 87% of the people in europe have an unfavorable opinion of him. Is this due to a anti-Bush media coverage of him? He's a like-able guy after all. He's visited Europe on several occasions and he always acts politely toward the countries he visits and says nice things about them. But every time he goes there people act like he's Hitler come back to haunt him. Even Colin Powell can't go to the closing ceremonies of the Olympics without people calling him a killer and having mass protests. It seems kind of rediculous that people would go out of their way to insult someone like that.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dunno.....I think allot of it is rooted in political snobbery. Over here a president (Prime Minister) must have a very strong grasp of english, be able to think and speak on his feet, and make political statements with some degree of eloqunce. These certainly are not George Bush's strong points. His policies obviously matter too, but I think these take second place to his outward persona.

People laugh at Bush's very simple style of public speaking, and point out his mistakes and blunders with relish. Personally I think allot of this is snobbery....there's still this belief in Britain that your skill as a public speaker and the way you present yourself is directly related to your intellect and ability to perform well at your job. Frankly, I hate this attitude. It comes from Victorian class dogma, which is still prevelant in the UK and allot of Europe.

In a truly fair world people shouldn't be judged on their accent, the way they speak or whether or not they come from a rural or urban environmant. I think Europe has some way to go before it reaches that point.

 

[ QUOTE ]
IamthePope said:

Americans aren't a bad people. Americans just consume what is placed in front of them. Americans like big cars, bet you would too if the streets in jolly old england weren't so god damn narrow. As long as large amounts of gasoline, used to fuel our automobiles, is avalible and economical Americans will continue to purchase and drive massive gas gusling monsters. Most people aren't really concerned that much with the enviorement unless they can see it visibly deteriorating. Sure we would all like to have nicer air quality but we also like our Ford Behemoths, and we need them to drop the kids off at soccer games and get the groceries.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is a great example for the phrase "just because you can doesn't mean you should." I bet 99% of Excursion owners could do as well with a minivan. Honda Odyssey has the same interior volume as an Excursion and the Honda is more comfortable to ride around in. It's all a percieved status thing. I don't think it's a great idea do to a solo commute to the office in your SUV.

I'm all for the freedom of owning giant vehicles. I don't own one myself. My gas guzzler is a toy that I take out every couple of months for an hour or two.


[ QUOTE ]
IamthePope said:

We are fat aren't we. The reasons for this is the result of competetive-ness between the various restaraunt chains. Restaraunts make their meal big and greasier at cheaper prices in an attempt to luer unsuspecting customers. It's amazing how big food portions can get in the states. We have a tendancy to want to super-size everything. It's a disgusting habit.

[/ QUOTE ]

We are fat because we want to eat too much. No excuses. Some are predisposed to be fatter than others. I hope genetic research discovers the fat gene and how to "turn it off" so their lives will be easier.