Sarah Technology

When FL 6KK Counter Hits I just wanna point out that when doing the combo on El Blaze and Eileen Sarah needs to be in Closed foot stance for the whole combo to hit.

 

Woo, a whole new thread. As recompense from the Sarah is underpowered thread, this is now the Sarah is cheap thread! Let's clear up some misconceptions...

- She's not linear.
She does 50% safe on an evade to her chest up to -4 and 25% on an evade to her back up to -4(~3). You can't even consistently punish either of these moves for any significant damage if you crouch the second hit. She has a low sweep where if they don't tech in closed stance she does 35% damage up to Sarah weight characters and damage in both stances on heavier weights. If they do tech they have to deal with her strong wakeup game. You also have to consider that the followups of 6P, 6K and 3K also track evade cancels. She doesn't even lose if you evade 4K because it has LESS TOTAL FRAMES THAN HER ELBOW. You can still backflip away, crush high/low or force fast attacks by using her 11frame highs. K+G is good for a high circular against opponents who don't evade cancel. 2P is guaranteed on CH and you've also got a followup.

- Her risk / reward is really good
Sarah isn't even risky. She's low risk / medium reward. If you can hitcheck 6P into K, you get potential rewards with basically no risk. Post 6PK mixups are some of the least risky mixups in VF especially coming from an elbow that can be hitchecked. Then just add in the high reward / low risk circulars and 4K and you get the idea.

- Strong Wakeup
Ignoring the situations where you can run obvious setplays in her favor(6PK, FL 6KK, 6P+K,P,K etc.). Any time you land a combo just go into flamingo. If they tech mixup, if not tap G. Block the wakeup kick on reaction and get nitaku. Win no matter what! There are more options here like 9K vs. wakeup kicks etc.

- Strong Sideturned Game
Just do 4K or delayed throw attempt...that's it. 4K on block +7 into 3-choice mixup FL K+G, FL 3K or FL 2K all -4 and below on block. 4K on CH into 3PK combo into the same 3-choice mixup. If they crouch 4K staggers and FL 3K combo is guaranteed. In most sideturned situations if nothing is guaranteed damage wise you are usually +6 - +10. So if 4K gets evaded you are -3 - +1 which also isn't risky.

- She doesn't require more "yomi" than any other characters. Nor are her moves less braindead.
I'm not going to go too far into this one, but it just isn't true. Anytime you get 4K on the screen near your opponent you have a way to win no matter what happens. That's not so specific...

That's it for now!

EDIT: Oh yeah, one more thing from the sideturned mixup. If FL K+G CH's you get 6P4K into the same 3-choice guess again.

 

I also don't think she is a that much of a Yomi character, moves like 8K+G or 4K are good examples of why she is not. If you think she is, try Goh, Akira or Jeff for a few months lol.

 

Sarah can generally score knockdowns really fast compared to the rest of the cast. She's part of the few that have full circular sweeps that knockdown on normal hit. Her options off of any knockdown are super legit.

8k+g NH or Rch knockdown gives nearly the same options as 6pk knockdown, which makes that move really good.

Off of FL K+G side turn CH I opt towards 7K now for nice dmg.

 

Obligatory "lolwut?"

How are a lowcrushing semicircular mid and a move that is mainly used for creating guessing games examples that she does not require reading opponent? She is way more yomi character than Goh and Akira imo. And I have some experience in playing Akira.

 

I don't think lolwut is obligatory at all.

I don't know what a "yomi character" is, but I think what Chibitox was saying was that having moves like one that covers many of the opponent's options safely and another move that gives you a fairly easy, advantageous and safe guessing game on block allow Sarah to not make as hard of guesses by making broader, safer choices.

 

No, since opponent can always screw over Sarah by choosing the right option. During vanilla VF5 people were complaining that Sarah herself needed to guess more what opponent does rather than other way around, which made her an "expert character". Now in FS she got a fullcircular launcher from flamingo (which doesn't really count since it can be ECD:ed like GT pointed out) and suddenly this became a non-issue?

She still has to make just about same amount of guesses, only that the rewards got better. And since she lost the vanilla autopilot FLA K special high, I would even say that she has more guesses to make.

 

Yeah, it's kind of a non issue because of how FL 6KK works. From Sarah weight characters and below the followup is a launcher on CH. If you do the first part it is safe on evade and if they evade the first part and you do the followup they will get CH if they attacked. -13 is also pretty great for a mid full circular launch.

The guesses can get a bit more complex depending on small advantages, but it's still not too difficult. She can still deal with evades by getting FL P evaded and the followups tracking because they used ECD. IF they 2P'd and you used a high it is NH and you can fuzzy. 3P guards her chest and is safe and the rest guard her back. These are also safe and work from the higher disadvantages.

 

Take a +6 situation that is something that happens quite often and is something where you should be putting the opponent in trouble:
If Sarah uses 8K+G she beats:
-low P
-big abare for a combo
-low guard
-evade to her front (if not canceled) for a combo. If opponent cancel their evade she is still safe at -6.


Cases where she is in trouble:
-opponent evades to her front--> depending wether it was an evade cancel or not the advantage will vary from +18 (non canceled evade at the best possible timing ) to a lot less where maybe nothing might be guaranteed.
-opponent uses stand P --> she's in for a fly combo


If she uses 4K in same situation:
Beats:
-low P for a stagger into FL 3K ? or at least FL3PK into mixup.
-Stand P for guaranteed damage plus mixup
-guard, no damage but opponent is still in a mixup situation

Case where she is not really in trouble:
-opponents evades: she's at worst at -6, as GT pointed she has a lot of options like the flip. If opponent did an evade cancel she might still retain advantage. Plus she has FL P at 9 frames that will give her 70 + good oki if you choose to retaliate with something too slow or try to throw her to stop the flip.

And this is the just the begining of nitaku, at +8 4k becomes even better as the opponent really doesn't have much room for retliating.



Take Akira in the same situation, his safest bet is DE (least total frames):
beats:
-low p and stand P for 30 damage and +8
-big abare for 35 and +8

Case where he is not really in trouble:
-guarded, he is fuzzy safe

case where he is in trouble:
-evades in BOTH directions = -8 vs non canceled evades.


He cannot use half circulars before +8 cause they will be interruptable by low P and if he uses SDE and get evaded he is at -11.
If opponent evade cancels he will be safer after evaded DE, but since Akira doesn't have full ciculars people tend to evade--> do something

His choices cover a lot less situations. And if he is not willing to take risks the reward will not give him a combo like Sarah can have with the two moves above.

The situation changes a lot at +8, where Akira really shines but for mid dis to "early nitaku" he needs much more yomi than Sarah imo.
Also Akira's options are all punches, and there are a lot more punches sabakies than kick sabakies in the game, and they often grant good damage. This will force Akira to go to even more bold guesses like shoulder or K+G that are even more unsafe on evade.

 

@BLACKSTAR - I didn't mean to imply that Sarah had advantage in those 4K situations. Just that she is fairly safe and still has evasive options. This situation is not in her favor in terms of efficiency, but she can still escape without taking damage or causing damage.

As for the Sarah Flamingo vs. Evade stuff I'm gonna clarify a bit. These are all anti evasion tools for Sarah in Flamingo:

FL 6K (chain)
FL K (chain)
FL P (chain)
FL 3P (chain)
FL 2KK
FL 4K

These attacks all can deal with evade and are safe. Add in delayed FL 3K, FL 2K and FL 3K+G and Sarah has more than enough tools to deal with evade. Linearity is about more than tracking in FS.

 

Some random Sarah tips with me - http://www.twitch.tv/blackstar_ga/c/3715944

Some of the info isn't 100% accurate, but I'm sure you can figure out where and fix it. This is how I play Sarah after about a week of giving her a serious go!

 

GTsus Duck Tour carrying the white women! I haven't watched yet but I'll write some stuff later.

 

Despite all this, Sarah is ass tier with next to no options... Right @steelbaz ?

 

I am an Aoi player, I don't think FS Sarah is good, no. You should pick her up BG.

 

It's a shame you don't main her anymore. I would have liked to hear your opinion on the vid GT made.

Lastly, despite Sarah not being my type of character, I'll get to her eventually, as I would like to have some experience with all characters to become a stronger player.

I think threads like this are beneficial to anyone's game, even if you don't main Sarah.

 

I'm sure the vid is good, i'm glad GT and others like her. I prefer Aoi and her options, I used Vane more seriously than Sarah before getting serious on learning Aoi. Sarah is ok, But I like low throws, quick double limed attacks, good sabaki's that work from -8 or -9 on down, etc etc..

GT Always has good tech, hooked me up with Kyouji Aoi channel, has great stuff on there ^_^