Sarah's Oki & Meat(ies) - Efficiency Prototype

In an effort to promote the idea of efficiency, I thought I would make a quick catalog of some easy to use things that hopefully can improve everyone's game. I'm not sure what the best method of developing this type of thread is and ideas would be greatly appreciated! I'm using Spoilers to keep it from being a super wall of text and think it makes for a cleaner appearance.

1) (HT: @Lucky_GT)

Spoiler: Setup

Sans Taka, this knockdown gives access to a simple and effective oki situation. I would highly recommend not using any of the other followups other than hit-checked knee, as they are basically worthless against good players (unlearning bad habits sucks) The most efficient follow-ups after the knee knockdown I have found are listed below.

1a) After the knock-down, you can use + to pick up the opponent if they do not tech. I generally prefer to end with FL as it carries good distance and allows for a wide array of setups.

1b) If your opponent does choose to tech, you should immediately go into FL via +x as soon as you recover from the knee (I would recommend using the buffer or just practicing). If done successfully, you can execute 2 of Sarah's 17f FL attacks for a true 50/50 since meaty attacks can't be evaded. To test if a meaty is proper, you can set the CPU to Counter hit and whatever tech roll you wish to check. If the meaty is proper, you won't get the yellow counter hit flash (HT: @Tricky)

1bi) go for FL ~+ for a nice extra damage boost from a low hit
1bii) go for FL into a nice mid-crumple combo. !!!Check your combos as some will not work due to spacing as opposed to a standard FL hit!!!

2) +

Spoiler: Setup

Sarah's full circular low sweep has a meaty that I have generally abused to great extend and it's time to share! One thing to note is that the sweep at max range will not have follow-ups, so make sure to get relatively close to your opponent, which is where you should be anyways!

2a) You can use + to pick up the opponent if they do not tech. I generally prefer to end with FL as it carries good distance and allows for a wide array of setups.

2bi)If your opponent chooses to tech, simply use the input buffer that follows during the recovery of + to do a 1st frame meaty . This is the s*** because if it hits (your opponent doesn't block after side roll tech), you will get a side-turned stagger that leads into a guaranteed FL +. I've checked with stagger recovery set to fastest but would appreciate others checking it as well.

2bii) If your opponent does block after teching, you get ST FL at +9 which is about as a good a place as you can be with Sarah

3) ~+ *For use near walls, ring edge*

Spoiler: Setup

One of Sarah's tougher attacks to pull off does come with a rather nice meaty setup that can be used near walls to great effect. You must get the just frame kick in there as well to guarantee the knockdown.

3a) You can use + to pick up the opponent if they do not tech. I generally prefer to end with FL as it carries good distance and allows for a wide array of setups.

3b) If your opponent does chose to tech, you should immediately go into FL via +x for it allows for the following 50/50 using the following 2 moves

3bi) FL for a low meaty that leads to FL +4 which a great place to be with Sarah
3bii) FL will lead into a mid-kick that push the opponent pretty far back. The critical thing here is that if near a wall, you'll definitely get a stagger that you can then use to apply amazing pressure.

4) + (on NH or mC since CH leads to combo)

Spoiler: Setup

This attack will almost always lead to a normal hit or minor counter which results in a tech-able knock down. Primarily used as a low crush and nice to throw out every know and then against people who spam and DM

4a) If they don't tech, You can do the traditional OTG stuff as listed before.
4b) If they DO tech, the meaty from appears to work (can't test perfectly on my own, but my best attempts and matches showed it working)

5) FL +

Spoiler: Setup

This full circular low of Sarah's may be a bit slow, but is useful for opening up very moral people with solid defense when in FL. It has a knock down on all hits.

4a) If they don't tech, You can do the traditional OTG stuff as listed before.
4b) If they DO tech, you can get a meaty by doing the following:
->
I'm not sure if there is a cancel window or if it is blind luck, but it made execution 100% consistent for me. My guess is that cancel window into comes out to a perfect 26 frames, which is what you need for the meaty (need confirmation). Gives a front stagger this time (not side stagger) so FL + is NOT guaranteed BUT FL is guaranteed to give you FL +5.

On block, you should be at FL +4, which is where you want to be with Sarah!

Would greatly appreciate someone checking this out to confirm.

If you want a simpler meaty, + will also work as a meaty if done at 1st frame via buffer. Main issue is not real advantage on block, but simpler!

What do you guys/gals think? I'll try to post more of them as I discover in the lab, and if anyone has any contentions/additions, please feel free to share! Hopefully after we discover a decent amount, we can pare it down so we have a nice clean efficient thread

As always, this is more of a beta tech demo, so if anything seems wrong, please correct me!

Cheers!

 

I love the use of spoilers to keep it readable. Really good idea. btw what's HT mean?

 

Glad you like it! It means "Hat Tip" as you brought the knowledge to the front (as far as I know) and I wanted to give credit where credit is due!

Cheers!

 

I must hat tip my info to Denkai and Rodney then.

 

I consolidated 6PK knockdown oki into a list. A circle means the tactic will either OTG or meaty. An X means it's punishable by a certain method. A blank spot means it won't work, but is unpunishable.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-...lohmRUHA/w854-h193-no/Sarah+6pk+knockdown.png

I'll probably do this for the rest of her moves, add weight classes, etc. There also was a specific note section in the last column I have yet to fill.

 

I like the Idea @Cozby ! I'll probably expand on the spreadsheet idea since that actually allows you to display more information more easily.

 

I agree man. When I get home I'll put up a Google doc and we all can draw our favorite oki gimmicks on a spreadsheet.

 

Can you set up any meaties from 3KK and FL 6KK in combos? 4K+GG FL setups are always too slow for me.

Against Heavyweights after 6PK, try using 6KP FS 2KKP+G. I think that's a meaty if the opponent uses in place recovery (exact) after the 6KP hits. This is something GT found a long time ago, but I thought that I'd post it here.

 

I'm messing with Sarah lately.I find amazing how many moves you can mix as enders for oki opportunities.

I'm sure you already know these Im gonna write... Anyhow....
Ok now look what I find interesting. Usually after CH ppl go with >FL.. Best commonly combo especially in open arenas,not the best oki though but, in wall arenas close to wall you can end it with other moves instead FL for better oki,meaty game.

First one: CH > > FL, oki/meaty .
FL connects on wall and then you have great oki,meaty with for advantage and pressure game .

Second one : CH > >FL, oki/meaty short dash FL or FL. FL connect to wall.
This one is good too,great mix up FL or FL.

Third one: CH > >FL , oki/meaty short dash FL.
Nice one.safe and hitcheckable for FL.

If they are not tech roll you don't have to worry, are safe.

And here some others not relative to previous.
1. FL >>> dash >, oki/meaty FL. Safe hitcheckable for FL.
2. FL >>> dash >, oki/meaty FL or FL.

* I tested them against Sarah.

 

I quickly tested meaties from . I'll try to type them here from memory.

In Place (Exact)



Side Roll Back/Front (Exact)

or ->

In Place (Delay)

->

The opponent will get hit by both kicks, guaranteeing (Flamingo Stance) .

Side Roll Back/Front (Delay)

->



The staggers from and might guarantee (Flamingo Stance) or maybe even (Flamingo Stance) , but I didn't test this.

 

One of Sarah's greatest strengths is forcing her opponents to guess during their recoveries. At times, she can attack an opponent who doesn't recover and use a meaty with the same move, so Sarah doesn't have to worry too much about guessing. I've tested some combos where this seems to be the case, but remember that the CPU in Dojo Mode is limited in how long it can delay recovery. From my testing, it seems to only delay by 1 frame, whereas it's possible to delay up to 3 frames. Also, some of these combos may require Sarah to lose large amounts of combo damage for setups. Whether or not this is worth it is up to you. The following combos will either hit an opponent who doesn't recover or cause a meaty using every recovery option available in Dojo Mode (sans No Recovery), which are 1) In Place, 2) Side Roll/Back, 3) Side Roll/Front, 4) In Place (Exact), 5) Side Roll/Back, and 6) Side Roll/Front.

The parts following the bracketed arrows ([->]) are those that don't guarantee combo damage, but force setups.

Spoiler: Combos

Aoi

-> -> [->]

Without recovery, it's possible to use additional moves, such as , after . Keep in mind that even this does less damage than Sarah's max damage combo.

Jean/Akira

-> -> (Flamingo Stance) [->] [->]

On Jean, the forward dash is far. On Akira, the forward dash should stop once you reach his feet. Without recovery, this combo will do more damage than Sarah's max damage combo.

Wolf/Jeffry

-> -> (Flamingo Stance) [->] [->]

The forward dash should be short against both characters. This combo will do more damage than Sarah's max damage combo with no recovery.

Counter Hit

Spoiler: Combos

Aoi

Counter Hit -> -> (Flamingo Stance) -> (Flamingo Stance) [->] [->]

I believe the dash last as long as it takes for Aoi to hit the ground. This combo will do more damage than Sarah's max damage combo with no recovery.

Lau/Jean/Jacky/Akira/Jeffry/Wolf...

Counter Hit -> -> (Flamingo Stance) [->] [->]

The timing for the forward dash might be variable. Try using a short dash. This combo will do more damage than Sarah's max damage combo with no recovery.

Continue checking this post for updates.

 

A good meaty I discovered with Sarah is dash up 9K after they tech roll a 44KK knockdown. 9K is normally -13, but it's active for eight frames. If you catch the opponent on the last frame of the 9K, it's only -5. You can set it up if they tech roll 6P+G too, pretty good. Also, I forget the exact knockdown, but I distinctly remember a way to meaty a Flamingo Stance 3K+G on side tech roll. I think the combo is flamingo 3K, 1K+GK, 3PK. This is really strong, obviously, as the opponent loses 35 health guaranteed every time they tech roll this setup

 

Uhm.. Nice find, man. Lol.

 

What? Was that common knowledge or something? Cause I didn't know it...

 

Against Akira and Goh, will work no matter what they do after , at least as far as the CPU settings for recovery are concerned. I'll update my list once I check if it works on other characters. Against Goh, I tested after and it worked under every condition except for No Recovery.

I'm not sure, but I think that is a meaty against all characters after no matter how they recover.