Shun's P+E

Okay guys, I'm still a beginner who is excited about learning all the VF3 moves, even if I am getting a little frustrated at trying to find an accurate move list. This brings me to another question. I am now trying to learn Shun's moves from the Virtua Project move list. I try out all the moves to see what thay look like. I came across two Shun moves that look identical (to me) but have different advantage statistics listed. These are his P+E move and his b+EP move. The advantage stats for the P+E are given as -2, +1, +2, and for b+EP as -1, 0, +5. But as I said, the two moves look the same to me. Are these two moves in fact identical, with the stat differences some sort of mistake? Or is there really some difference between them? How can they be used differently? The main reason I don't trust the differences in the advantage numbers, is because I encountered a similar problemn with two other Shun moves [uf+P+K and uf+P] which was discussed in another thread. It turns out, according to an anonymous responder, that those two moves are the same, even though they are also listed separately with different stats. So I am concerned that is the case with these two moves as well. Remember, before anybody flames me for asking stupid stuff, I am just trying to learn the moves. It's part of what makes VF3 fun for me. I realize there is more to it than just knowing the moves. I realize I need to learn how to use them, and all kinds of strategies.. I understand that I might discover these moves are not useful -- or maybe they are. But first things first. I am just a VF3 baby, and this is how I need to learn. It's like learning the alphabet before learning how to make up words and spell. So please help me once again with a move question. Maybe when VF4 comes out, I'll be good enough to help some other newcomer.

Thank you, Wolstudent

 

If I remember correctly, P+E Shun dodges slightly in or out of the screen and waves a slight backhand at the opponent with his lead fist. In b+E,P, Shun skips straight back and does a small, quick uppercut with his leading fist. The difference between the two, besides the recovery statistics is that the e+P has axis shift (moving in and out of the screen) to it, while the b+E,P doesn't.

Nutlog

 

Does anyone with Shun knowledge know the answer to this question? The moves certainly look the same. It just seems a bit odd that they would be the same, given the button/joystick inputs. A poster in another thread suggested that people should find the answers for themselves, but I don't know how to test for advantage differences, which is the only thing I can currently see that would determine the move difference. Maybe somebody has read an article in a Japanese magazine or at a Japanese site that deals with these moves? Or maybe someone has discovered some difference they'd be willing to share? As a sidenote --- Shun's K and F+K look identical to me, yet they are clearly different moves (they do different damage, for instance). Similarly, Sarah's PPP and PPb+P and PPPu+P look the same to me, differing only in frame rates. So as a reminder --looking identical doesn't make moves identical. Any way, could someone please help Wolfstudent with a better answer than my feeble response, so we can build a better VF community?

Thanks, Imashroom

 

Nutlog: thanks for your response. It went up while I was writing my last post to this thread, so my plea for help wasn't an attempt to ignore you. Again thanks. And by the way, do you have any similar insight into Shun's uf+P and uf+p+k moves? Again, I thank you very much for your helpful response. I just hope we haven't lost Wolfstudent....

Imashroom

 

Now, I don't play Shun but I may be able to provide some insight with the mook in front of me. They are indeed identical moves with different cirmustances (kinda like the near/far thing for Akira's SDE, etc).

As for the exact condition differences - give me a sec to check it out. I'll keep you posted - sorry, but that's the best I can do for now.

Cheers,

<font color=white> Llanfair the prized <font color=green>cabbage</font color=green></font color=white>

 

would anyone notice or care if we did?

 

Anonymous wrote ::would anyone notice or care if we did?:: I just got home from an evening out and I'm noticing and caring. I await Llanfair's input and appreciate his effort.
Imashroom

 

Nutlog: I did some checking on the DC, and I think your memory may be wrong on this one. Shun skips straight back with an uppercut while doing either P+E or b+EP. The axis shift move you are referring to is probably ub+EP.
Hopefully, Llanfair will get back to us soon with his Mook interpretation.
In the meanwhile, any one else have any further info on this?

Imashroom

 

First off, I apologize for any impression I might have left that was negative. I am only trying to learn, and I guess I could have expressed myself less badly. I am sorry. I really appreciate all help from you guys. ice-9 has asked that we newbies try to stick to specific questions. I think my Shun question is specific.
Llanfair, in your message you said: "Now, I don't play Shun but I may be able to provide some insight with the mook in front of me. They are indeed identical moves with different cirmustances (kinda like the near/far thing for Akira's SDE, etc). As for the exact condition differences - give me a sec to check it out. I'll keep you posted - sorry, but that's the best I can do for now.
Cheers,
Llanfair the prized cabbage"
Have you been able to translate from the mook yet?
Sta783: can you provide any help with the translation?
Again, I mean no rudeness. I will try to learn site etiquette.
Wolfstudent

 

Yeah, sorry it's been a bit of time...I still haven't completed the full translation but i can give what I know so far.

Beside this move (b+EP) in the mook there is a kanji character in brackets describing some sort of condition. So far, what I have come up with is "while avoiding" Now, both moves skip Shun back and neither have him dodge so I've been a bit stuck on the interpretation. I'm having a Japanese friend take a look at it for me and she's getting back to me on monday.

I'll let you know more as I get it. In the meantime, anyone else have insight on this? Shota, give the translation a shot.

cheers,

<font color=white> Llanfair the prized <font color=green>cabbage</font color=green></font color=white>

 

Has anyone (especially Llanfair) completed the translation from the Mook yet, concerning the question I asked? Please don't let this thread die from neglect.
Thanks, Wolfstudent

 

Ok, eventhough they looks identical, the difference is that b+EP can be delayed (a little bit), while P+E is a one set move. Same thing with u/b+E,P+K, it can be delayed while b+P+E is one move that can't be delayed. (taken from famitsu dc mook)

Perhaps this is why their stats are different in Gamest tb mook.

 

*smacks head*

I've been casually following this thread, but I couldn't think of the answer off the top of my head. The delay-factor seems so obvious now that Mike has brought it up. Thanks Mike!

ice-9 | Sennin

 

Thanks Mike. Your willingness to respond is the type of spirit of helpfulness we need to continue to see around here. Not everybody here has access to the mooks, so this kind of sharing and assistance is especially needed. Again, thank you very much on behalf of all of us who were bewildered (that includes me) about this little VF3 quirk.
With appreciation, imashroom