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So what are your thoughts on VF5 now?

Discussion in 'General' started by Jide, Jan 8, 2008.

  1. Happy_Friend

    Happy_Friend Well-Known Member

    Hey, if the thread is about one's thoughts on VF5, well, I provided mine. It is fine if you disagree.

    I do fell that perhaps in order to have an expanding roster of characters, AM2 ran out of ways to make them unique so they gave a lot of characters moves with "special" properties that cannot really be dealt with intuitively or conventionally.

    You can either think that it is good that they did this b/c it allows anyone to learn a character and utilize certain moves and techniques that can befuddle people. Or you can think that it is bad, what with the extra character studying it entails and all to get the point where you can have matches in which each player understands basically what his opponent can do and the outcome will be decided by mind games, good guessing, and execution.

    Or you can think that it is sort of a mixed bag - good b/c it gets people to play and have more of a chance than they would have in earlier versions, but bad b/c it prevents those ideal VF matches from occurring as often.

    Maybe VF5 is just the way of the future and I have to deal. If so, oh well. I just don't think I need to be called a scrub for lamenting certain aspects of it.

    And hey EVM, I do not know what you are talking about. Lau is really about the most straight forward character in the game. If you care to argue this point, I have an /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/uf.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif with your name on it. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif
     
  2. DaBadSeed

    DaBadSeed Well-Known Member

    this is wut i like about vf5 also..any one who haz played me no i play my char aoi and pai alot diff from most.. on another hand i do think vf5 iz dumbed down and 4 my money just bring back a revamped vf3 tag.. o yes i want that dodge button back to..oh and how much i miss those wicked stages /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cry.gif
     
  3. ShinobiFist

    ShinobiFist Well-Known Member

    I'm not going to mention the obvious, on how the game plays different online(Sometimes)I'm just glad that this game in particular, is giving me that old-school arcade, hanging out, after school feel. All this game need is a spectating mode, and is a wrap! And plus, I don't think this game is "dumb down" I find it more acceptably for new comers to the series. Damn, that sounds like a good spin right there, LOL!
     
  4. ViperExcess

    ViperExcess Well-Known Member

    Didn't know there was such a mix of opinions and observations on the game as compared to the past.

    Wouldn't the most recent one matter? Or does everyone who replies to this thread have to compare the game to past versions?

    I mean, is it going to get to the point that some people will revert back to 4:Evo? It seems that several communities wouldn't mind reverting to an older game when they feel like it.
     
  5. TheWorstPlayer

    TheWorstPlayer Well-Known Member

    SF players do it all the time, but yknow. VF:EVO isn't online so if those hardcores want to revert go right ahead. I'm staying where I'm at. I'd rather play at home against all types of people on a less than totally ideal connection than not play at all except for maybe once a month or every two weeks at somebodies spot in east jabip.
     
  6. DubC

    DubC Well-Known Member

    Fortunately, it isn't that serious. This is actually something that has happened with every new VF, from 2-3, and especially from 3-4 on this site. Some Japanese prefer VF4:FT, but a LOT of them still very much enjoy and appreciate VF5, and there are still a lot of players.
     
  7. SDS_Overfiend1

    SDS_Overfiend1 Well-Known Member

    OH Yes the Hills man the Hills. The Music was better too and you could'nt spam moves.
     
  8. Happy_Friend

    Happy_Friend Well-Known Member

    The music was soooo much better. Kage's VF5 music is probably the worst in series' history and the most ridiculous for the setting.

    It's like "Where's that awful Techno crap coming from? Is there some wussy raver DJ kid hopped up on cat tranquilizers hiding behind the shrine?"
     
  9. Brisal73

    Brisal73 Well-Known Member

    Wasnt Kage somewhat into disco since VF3? I remember his 2p costume to be a bit discoey
     
  10. Low_Sweep

    Low_Sweep Well-Known Member

    Yeh i know what your talking about here. It seems like every characters strength lies in there abusable moves/set up. I like this because it gives the illusion that your in danger, but your really not. Its really hard to make someone who plays solidly guess. I just poke the majority of my matches. You really can't force someone out of there comfort zone in VF5 if they know what they are doing. You kinda have to wait for them to make a mistake or bait them to make a mistake. If someone doesn't know how to play well you can exploit that in which case the abusable moves become all that much more powerful.

    If i can't break wolf's dm then i hope he/she keeps doing it. Stuff like this forces you to step your game up or get beat everytime. Its not noob friendly. In fact its just the opposite. It rewards solid play and knowledge of the game.
     
  11. KingZeal

    KingZeal Well-Known Member

    No one is discounting the importance of mix-up. However, I think it's more than a little fair to state that some characters in the game have a more devastating mix-up than others...or, at the least, more options for mix-up. Hell, I've heard other people say it all the time: "X_character needs to guess right just once to control a round while Y_character needs to guess right three or four times".

    Also, if you look at my quote, I also stated that it's something that has to be understood to play the game. It may be a peeve of mine to lose to an El Blaze/Jacky/Pai player who just happened to "guess right", but them's the breaks, right?
     
  12. TheWorstPlayer

    TheWorstPlayer Well-Known Member

    I think the worst thing about VF5 is the players; let me explain.

    Unlike any other game I've decided to play VF is full of an
    elitist mindset that is quite dumbfounding. Now to go further
    I'm not talking about the top "name players" in the US at all.
    I'm talking about the schleps that think they are top players.

    Lately I've come across way to many people who dislike how I
    play because I don't follow the rules. Huh? Wait there's rules?
    It happened on a number of occasions now. People will WRITE
    me, "You need to stop attacking on disadvantage." or "You abuse
    X too much" or the best "All you do is go low, mid or throw."
    I'm starting to think people take these "elite strategies" on
    how you are supposed to play and think everyone adheres to them.

    Wake up sunshine they don't! In fact, me personally I'm of the
    mind set that if it works once, twice, three times? Guess what
    I'm going to do? 4, 5, or 6 times more until you stop it. More
    than one person has just STOPPED playing because I don't follow
    their rules. Wait you figured out my trick? Great! I'll switch to
    the next trick. Call me retarded for being on a VF site only to
    look for competition and not memorize black book combos or frame
    advantages.

    I could have swore fighting games were about conditioning almost
    as much as your precious frames. Ever had someone get upset
    because you get hit by moves they "wanted" you to block in order
    to make their lovely setup a reality? WTF is that about.

    I guess if you live and die by frame counting online can be frustrating
    but if you can't handle it never play online ever
    EVER again. You'll be better off for it.

    That being said I do like this game but I've never been one for
    huge juggles. It's almost reminiscent of Tekken. Granted there
    have always been combos/juggles in VF but its designed to have
    more of that in recent versions. Where am I going with this?

    VF people take themselves to seriously and juggles suck. I'd give up Jeffrys Knee
    combos just for a splash mountain that did
    VF1 damage /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

    My opinion in a nutshell /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif
     
  13. KingZeal

    KingZeal Well-Known Member

    In my experience in playing fighting games, I've come up with a very simple rule: FIGHT WHAT'S IN FRONT OF YOU.

    Yes, we've all seen the YouTube videos of the really mesmorizing Top Level players, and we've seen these awesome setups and great tugs-of-war for advantage. Unfortunately, most (all?) of us typing on this site don't have the benefit of calling ourselves one of these elite Kings of VF. And most of the people we compete against online will be the same. Therefore, rather than our idealized matches where our equally-matched opponent engage us in a perfected waltz of strategy and skill, we instead wind up in rather sloppy fights where the best way to win is to abuse Low Punch > Throw all game.

    I think the reason most people get frustrated with this type of fighting (myself included) is because we feel like it doesn't make us any better. Like I said, most of us (again myself included) have it visualized in our heads that we will have our knowledge of the game as well as our execution skill tested by an opponent of equal merit. But, that isn't always the case. As I once read on the Shoryuken.com forums: "You may mock Scrubs if you want, but never underestimate them. If you do not learn how to fight against Scrub Tactics, you will lose against them every time."

    So, to make that even simpler, as I said: Fight what's in front of you.
     
  14. Low_Sweep

    Low_Sweep Well-Known Member

    I don't think ive ever heard that before lol. People will say anything to make themselves feel better about losing.
     
  15. Sorias

    Sorias Well-Known Member

    That's the definition of the scrub mentality. It's actually common to every fighting game, outside of tournaments. Just get used to it, and move on.

    To Happy Friend, I wonder how much of your "style" complaints are unique to this game. That is, in past versions, you always had to adjust how you were playing depending on who you were playing, cause players differ greatly in style. Now, with character choice being a little more important, you have to vary your style based on who you're playing, and which character that person chose to use. That said, the core issue is still that you have to learn how to use different styles situationally if you expect to win.

    I'm not trying to make a judgement, I haven't put a lot of thought into this issue. But, it seems that every VF has increased the length of the movelists, and the number of characters, with the specific goal of creating a greater number of valid playstyles. I think that's really the core issue that you're talking about, and I don't think it's a problem in any way.
     
  16. C1REX

    C1REX Well-Known Member

    In one moment today this game get boring to me.
    It's like guessing game all the time.


    Most of low moves are to fast to block on reaction. Need to gues.
    Most moves are to fast to evade on reaction. Need to gues.
    Throws are impossible to escape on reaction. Need to predict and buffer throw escapes.


    Maybe I just don't feel well today?
     
  17. Sorias

    Sorias Well-Known Member

    That's the whole point... the game is based on prediction, which is a better word to use than guessing.

    You need to analyze your opponent's playstyle, and figure out specifically what they will do next, out of all the possible options they have. Dunno why you'd think it suddenly got boring though... it's what the whole game's about. Even if you didn't think of it in those terms, that's what you've been doing to win in the past.
     
  18. C1REX

    C1REX Well-Known Member

    I don't know. I loved this game yesterday.
    Maybe I love SC1 to much? I like SC1 because almost every throw can be escaped on reaction. Actually I really don't like VF throw escapes.

    In SC1 you can throw escape on reaction. Guard impact on reaction. Block lows on reaction.

    I'm totall noob in this game but can make problems even for the best european and american players. Then be destroyed by a scrub.


    I hope everything will be beautiful again tomorrow.
     
  19. Sorias

    Sorias Well-Known Member

    That style reduces the defensive gameplay to just accurate timing. It's the reason top tournament players always never even use throws in SC. It's also why people generally hated the parry system in SF3 (?). Once defense gets that simple, you can skip actually "playing" the game against your opponent, and just use mastery of a single technique to win.

    None of that stuff is easy in VF, and it's not supposed to be easy... but you certainly can't accuse the game of not having depth, which is generally the reason people like it.
     
  20. DubC

    DubC Well-Known Member

    No, you have just finally realized the drawbacks of LAG and ONLINE play. Watch videos on youtube. People are doing a lot of the things you are talking about on reaction. Part of it is anticipation, part of it is just training your reaction. Unfortunately, since you, and a lot of us newer players are mostly learning/playing online, it is harder to train this reaction since it won't work a lot of the time due to lag. It is a 2-edged sword. You can only get so good from online play... you can only really get the basics. Amazing hit confirmations, quantity of buffered escapes, consistent reactionary fuzzies in all possible situations - those are left for the arcades and offline play.

    I've got a news flash for you. You didn't play SC online. Even though you may be USED to the lag, and think it isn't there, it is. So when you see something and try to low block it or react and escape, a lot of the time, it has already hit you even though the screen tells you otherwise.
     

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