staggers useless?

I just realised I rarely see people combo after one a stagger in youtube and dogalog videos because people struggle out of them and will just block the 66p.

so what's the use really?

 

My assumption would be that at a high level (or someone with enough experience) would be able to stagger out of it quickly.

But you should still have advantage and if they stagger, they still have to respect you.

Shouldn't you be able to dash up and throw/poke without to much fear.? Because aren't we at enough advantage to the point where they can't crouch the throw?

 

On unexperienced players go for juggle starter.
On more expierenced players go for throw/save poke mind game.

IMHO

 

Yeah that's exactly what I do C1REX. You have to figure out real quick if someone is good at getting out of staggers or not because if they're fast and you go for 66P you're F'd but if they are still staggered and you go for a throw you'll miss. I try the throw first and if I find it misses I know they're not good at staggers otherwise go for launcher afterward.

 

oh right yea of course you still have adv. you guys are right

 

It is possible to fuzzy after struggling the stagger. LA Akira and Phoenix Death are the only two players I've played who do it consistently -- when I play them, I know they struggle the stagger (ex: 214K), which isn't all that difficult; however, they're faster than most and can actually duck when I dash > throw or rise quickly enough to block strings, etc.

Granted, most players aren't as good as Gerald or Alex -- still it's something to keep in mind. You can deal with it just like how you'd deal with "real" fuzzy (i.e. delay throw).

I've also found that just because someone can generally struggle out of her staggers, it doesn't mean they always will if you have them rattled. I think it's worth attempting once a round or every other round, especially if your offense is flowing. Also, if you successfully execute varied mix ups after the stagger (throw, sweep, elbow, etc) I've found that the opponent begins thinking about the mix up as soon as the stagger lands and will sometimes not struggle the stagger in time, being preoccupied with the impending mix up.

Summary: Though it can be effectively dealt with by good players, her stagger game is still great and can be a huge source of damage for Eileen.

 

It's impossible to get someone with 66P after a stagger, It's better to use 6PP236KKK if you're going to try and get a combo on them.
However, after staggers I try and mix it up between throw, mids and sweeps instead because I'm used to people staggering out of it all the time.

 

It's not impossible at all to get 66P after the 214K stagger, it's just unlikely when you're facing a good player. I can land it even on these players sometimes, especially with a perfect 66P buffer after the stagger. These aren't scrubs; these are really good players with years of vf under their belt.

I agree with you that you should throw/sweep/etc to keep players honest.

 

I agree. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif Staggers are useful tools, jsut dont expect the followups to anywhere near guaranteed. That doesnt mean you cant try them. Eileens /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif is safe on block after all. And yes, its possible to fuzzy after recovering from the stagger, if you do the stagger recovery well.

 

I'm just saying that if you're going to try and get a stagger combo then I think using 6PP236KKK is better.
Reason being 6P is 14f while 66P is 19f, thus making the later easier to stagger out of.
6PP also has the advantage that if they don't SS the second punch, you'll be able to go into wari, so from my pov using 6P rather than 6PP is the smartest thing to do.

 

I change my previous statement, 6P+KP is superior to 6P since the juggle works more consistently.
However 6P+K is slower than 6P, but still faster than 66P, and can cancel in to wari twice.
So I still concider it a better option than 66P.

 

wari sucks, there's almost no point to use it. Being able to wari shouldn't be part of the consideration.

6P+K has much more dmg potential than 6PP, it's also safer against opponents who struggle well.

6PP should ONLY be used when it's guaranteed (first hit guaranteed), otherwise it's better in most cases to just 6P.

 

6pp also leaves you a -4 I believe while 6p is+\-0

 

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