:: Struggle > Duck (Not Howard)? ::

I'm having a hard time doing this (so that the throw actually gets ducked) but is it the best way in general to deal with a stagger situation? Any tips? What is the ultimate way to do this? Struggle > fuzzy so that you just duck the throw attempt and block the mid (many clips you see however two mids connecting in a row making stagger->stagger). Thoughts on how to deal with stagger situations against you - diffrent depending on the stagger type maybe?

Thx & Merry C & Happy New Year! o(^~^ )o o( ^~^ )o o( ^~^)o

/KiwE

 

A nice topic, Kiwie.


First. it depends the type of stagger. If you get staggered by an elbow, you just need one input(any input, a button press or any direction) to get out of the stagger.

3 things can be done- block(standing or ducking), attack, or evade(EDTEG).

To block, you simply do any one input then choose duck or stay standing. It's more like 50/50 guessing game here.

To attack, as it's a RN, you wanna go for something big and easy to do. What I normally do is low P then go for throw or SDE when it hits(throw preferably cause people kinda freeze up more in this situation) or stuff like SPOD. A good thing about doing low P out of stagger is you just have to mash on LP without thinking of struggling when you get staggered. Your first low P input will be counted as struggling and your second low P will come out in time to beat a throw.

If you play a charater like Lau in Evo, when you get staggered, you can just mash on 3P+K quickly to get out of stagger and attack back. That's why simple command here matters a lot. With Akira, you can do a quick struggle then go for a SPOD if your reflex is good.

About EDTEG, just tap up when you see the red wiggling joystick then input TEs if you want. You have to actually go for the right timing on this one.



On the other hand, when you get staggered by a side kick type of move, it becomes a different story. You need 3 inputs to get out of that stagger so you want to input quickly to struggle out of it.

For this, you might want to get used to doing a circle motion as PS2 training mode teaches you. Once you get used to it, I think it's the best way of struggling.

Just as a side note, mashing on low P still works in a heavy stagger situation, as you will input enough number of LPs to get out of the staggger and attack back before a throw grabs you. Same goes for a move like Lau's 3P+K.

 

Ducking after a stagger is usually not a good idea. It takes 7 frames to duck under a throw, but a mid attack will hit you on the first frame of ducking. So if you struggle successfully and hold 2g, for 7 frames you will lose to both elbow/throw!! So be careful.

 

Thx for the replies. I believe that a quick ducking after a stagger can be a very valid tactic - specially after staggers of the heavystumble type / staggers from a distance where the opponent is forced to dash up to you to threaten with a throw. Kinda depends on what the opponent can / does mixup throwattempts with aswell I guess.

/KiwE

 

Yeah, especially since with a fast struggle, you can be at somewhere around -2, even with a large stagger. If the opponent doesn't do another mid right away, or if they dash up and delay, fuzzy blocking is definitely a valid tactic. The mashing on P method is just a way to combine struggling and RN together.

 

Remember that some characters after staggers are actually forcing a 3-taku situation & your fuzzy can take big damage from their low throw.

Question: If I struggle and want to avoid high throws, one low throw & delayed/slower attacks can I option select an lp/low throw escape with ++? Thanks.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, especially since with a fast struggle, you can be at somewhere around -2, even with a large stagger. If the opponent doesn't do another mid right away, or if they dash up and delay, fuzzy blocking is definitely a valid tactic. The mashing on P method is just a way to combine struggling and RN together.

[/ QUOTE ]

if the opponent choses to lose frames, then their elbow will lose to low P also --- i'd chose RN any day, with wolf, i'd chose to do low P -- screw hook, sometimes when i can see a throw comming, then just hammer out an SS anyway.

on large staggers, it's abit easier to avoid a throw because they can whiff you if they are too early or if you didnt struggle hard enough, but on elbow staggers and SK staggers it's alittle too careful to be fuzzy guarding in such a small time gap.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Question: If I struggle and want to avoid high throws, one low throw & delayed/slower attacks can I option select an lp/low throw escape with ++? Thanks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, if you're not playing Brad /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

/KiwE

 

if you attack out of a stagger, no throws or low throws will succeed... there is no reason to escape if you are attacking unless you are at -8 or more