Taka Tachi'ai data

I've been trying to step up my game with Taka and study how and when to use Tachi'ai stance.

PS : I am french and my english is perhaps not that good so sorry if I make errors. I will try to make the thread as clear as possible but early ver. may not be that good... so be tolerant

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Tachi'ai is one of the best stance in the game.
It can be set up from various moves and has very good options :
- Tachi'ai + is a fast safe mid. Can be stepped. Tachi'ai P+K is the fastest move from stance.
- Tachi'ai is a safe high full circular that can combo afterwards. Can be ducked. It has decent pushback (can be used to setup 44P+K on block for exemple).
- Tachi'ai is a unsafe invisible low that has +4 advantage on NH. Combos on CH. Can be stepped/ducked ... or punished.
- Tachi'ai ++ deals with high guard and allows you to have a free P+K combo.
- Tachi'ai _++ allows for very good step from stance.
- Tachi'ai ++ armors P and elbow moves.



The data may help you to guess when to go into stance and when not to. And what to do from stance.
Legend : Starter (hit or block) Tachi'ai move
I won't give data for everything but the most usefull info in order to use Tachi'ai.


Here's Tachi'ai Data :
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- -4 block +2 hit NH, +5 CH > Taka can Fuzzy (rare for him because he can't fuzzy at -5) !! And semi circular.
(hit) Tachi'ai + > can't be interrupted (*can be interrupted by Vane's )
(hit) Tachi'ai > can be interrupted by i13 moves and less.
(hit) Tachi'ai > can be interrupted by 2P and TC moves, goes under
(hit) Tachi'ai ++ > can be interrupted by i12 moves and less.


- NC (really good if you can hit confirm fast enough), -8 block +3 NH +6 CH
(hit) Tachi'ai + > can't be interrupted.
(hit) Tachi'ai > Can't be interrupted. 2P and TC move go under though.
(hit) Tachi'ai > Can't be interrupted.
(hit) Tachi'ai ++ > Can't be interrupted. 2P and TC moves go under though.

- 4 + : -8 block, +1 NH, +6 CH. (4P) P+K can be stepped but opponent risks 4PP and 4P P+K+G P.
+ (hit) Tachi'ai + > can't be interrupted
+ (block) Tachi'ai + > can be interrupted by i13 moves and less.
+ (hit) Tachi'ai > can't be interrupted. 2P and TC moves go under though.
+ (hit) Tachi'ai > can't be interrupted.
+ (block) Tachi'ai > can be interrupted by __ (need more test) but goes under P though.
+ (hit) Tachi'ai ++ > can't be interrupted. 2P and TC moves go under though.
+ (block) Tachi'ai _++ > evades i13 moves and less.

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- : -4 block (fuzzy possible), -1 NH, +2 CH
(hit) into Tachi'ai : is only usefull when your opponent is used to PP6P.
(hit) into Tachi'ai : useless unless CH confirm. (hit) into backdash is way better.

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- + : i16 move, safe, negative on hit, positive on CH.
+ (hit) Tachi'ai + > can be interrupted by i14 and less. Interesting if the (6P+K)P is CH because most follows up cannot be interrupted then.
+ (hit or block) Tachi'ai > is very interesting in RO situations (when 6P+KPP can RO your opponent) because the last P from 6P+KPP can be stepped.

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- -8 block, -1 NH, launch CH
- : you can use stance afterwards, but 2P goes under, can be sabaki'd, stepped, etc...
(hit) Tachi'ai + > can't be interrupted.
(hit) Tachi'ai > can be interrupted by i12 moves.
(hit) Tachi'ai > Can be interrupted by 2P. Goes under i12 P.
(hit) Tachi'ai ++ > can be interrupted by i12 moves

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- : blockstun +1, combo on hit.
Tachi'ai : usefull ONLY if your opponent doesn't attack after 43P blocked and step or guard.
(block) Tachi'ai + : can be interrupted by i14 moves.

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From this data, we can see that :
- + and are the best stance setup (hit or block).
- is a very good move.
- + with correct training of the opponent can be used to setup stance.
- Tachi'ai could be interesting but you would prefer 100% of the time a CH when using 6K. If you can hit confirm it is interesting.

EDIT : Thanks Yomi.

 

I'd like to add about Tachi'ai 4P+K+G that from my tests, this move does not have any sort of armor at any point unlike what is stated above. Tachi'ai 4P+K+G P also doesn't seem to have armor nor sabaki anything. I also find it odd that Tachi'ai P+K+G is beaten after hit 4P~Tachi'ai where Tachi'ai P+K would win since they're both 16f moves.

Also, 6KP~Tachi'ai P+K is listed twice; first not interruptable, then later as interruptable by 12f moves, i'm assuming you meant Tachi'ai P+K+G.

6KP~Tachi'ai is very good if you can hitconfirm 6K into 6KP on normal hit, not too hard if you're paying attention. Even though it's -1 on normal hit, 6KP~Tachi'ai P+K cannot be interrupted with jabs or 2p.

 

- Yup, that's no mistake. Test it
4P (hit) into Tachi'ai P+K can't be interrupted
4P (hit) into Tachi'ai P+K+G can be interrupted by i12 moves.

- I indeed meant 6KP Tachi'ai P+K+G. Corrected.

- Thanks for noticing 6KP is NC. Nice stuff then.

On side note, I tested answers about evade 33G against Tachi'ai mix up when Tachi'ai P+K cannot be interrupted. It pretty much kill everything you can do :
- It ducks/guards Tach'ai P
- It evades Tachi'ai P+K+G/K/P+G.

BUT.
If you see someone do that you have various solutions :
- you delay into Tachi'ai P+K+G, you will hit them in a side hit situation. Advantage varies between +15/+16/+17 seems character dependant.
- Of course they can evade 33G2 in order to duck Tach'ai P+K+G. But delay Tach'ai P+K will hit them then.
- If you trained an opponent enough for them to do that, you have free throw setup since they're pretty much agreeing to be passive against Taka. So yeah, not going into stance is often rewarding enough against opponents who know the match up.

 

Tachi'ai P+K+G, being high, it will always be interruptable by low P etc, where P+K wouldn't.
The fact that the move itself deals 5Pts of damage will make it always lose if it collides with another move on the same frame. Tachi'ai P+K on the other hand will always win with it's 35 pts of damage, since fast moves elligible for interrupting will always do less damage than that. I guess that's what's happening in this case.

On a side note I tried some of those settings and found 4P(hit) stance P+K to be interruptable with Vanessa's 3P. I think most of the entries on NH into stance P+K will be interrupted as well.

 

Yeah i11 moves will interrupt 4P (hit) into Tach'ai P+K. I don't know about other moves though. I will test

 

Ah yes, I didn't think of the damage, of course it makes sense then that it loses.

 

Chibitox : I can't test it. Because DS Vane always parry 4P :/ How annoying. How did you test it?
What you need to test is 4PP into Tachi'ai P+K because 4PP is NC and gives the best advantage out of 4P setups except CH.

 

Record Taka doing the stuff and then just walk forward with Vane for it to hit, then try 3P.

 

4PP into Tachi'ai P+K is NOT interruptable by 3P.
Since it's only one more frame of advantage than 4P (that gets interrupted) I guess Tachi'ai P+K ans 3P are hitting on the same frame and 3P loses because of damage.

 

Nice ! 4PP Tachi'ai P+K is your main setup of Tachi'ai pressing since 4PP is NC.
4P into Tachi'ai is used mostly with enough conditioning of 4P + P+K/P.
Thank you for notifying me Chibitox. I will complete the thread now.

 

I think 4PP~Tachi'ai is better since it's an NC string and easy to hitconfirm into Tachi'ai plus the options from Tachi after are a bit better than from just 4P, you just lose the rare fuzzy option of blocked 4P, but you gain mentioned hitconfirm and the ability to cheese your opponent with 4PPP (it's stupid, don't do it unless you're sure) If they start to duck, do 4PP+K.