Tekken 4

Oh my God, I have seen and played Tekken 4, and it is a big dissapointment. What is going on with Namco ?
Tekken 3 was their last almost perfect fighting game, besides SC.

 

well I liked it

 

Have you seen the XITY finals yet from Tekken Central? God, with the exception of Yoshimitsu all the others were played in a very boring manner...as if they were all Jackys, heh. So far, high level T4 play doesn't seem all that exciting.

 

Played Tekken 4 for the first time today.

I enjoyed it, but I can't say I was blown away by it or even liked it a lot. It still felt like Tekken, but like a slow Tekken. I ended up spending most of the time playing Steve and enjoying that quite a bit.

I don't think I can judge Tekken because I don't know much about how Tekken is supposed to be played, but from a scrubby standpoint.... It felt like Tekken, but shoved in a direction... "As if by an invisible hand, you are guided to play a certain way" kinda feeling.....

Hopefully, I'll get to see people going at TTT speed, but currently, it's a pretty slow game. I'm wondering if it's the slowest Tekken game by far, but of course we'll eventually see high level play at a good speed. I just felt like I could see a lot of what was coming at me too easily....

Graphically.... I think the graphics are good, but not great. I was thinking of UFC with a touch of DoA2/3 and more animations (than UFC anyways). Pretty much like all Tekken games (except Tekken 1), the graphic is at the standard level and not really above it much if at all. Was Tekken 1 the only game that pushed any sort of mark in the standards of graphics upon release in the series? (Well, Tekken 2 looked like it had nice lighting I guess). Well, if that is indeed the trend of Tekken, being somewhere around standard, that's how I feel Tekken 4 is graphically.

In any case, the gameplay implementations in Tekken 4 seem bold to me, but I didn't feel that the controls were freakish or anything. Felt like Tekken, but the play is just guided somewhere else.

Guess that sums up my thoughts (or confusion) on Tekken 4. Not blown away by it... it was fun for awhile. Gameplay is indeed different while still feeling related to Tekken. TTT looks WAY faster, but it might just be an infancy phase kinda thing. I felt there was an "Invisible Hand" in Tekken 4.

-Chanchai

 

where did you play it, i see you are based in OR..?

 

I played it at Bullwinkle's in Wilsonville. Unfortunately, it was 3 tokens (uggh, don't think I'll spend too much time playing Tekken 4 at 3 tokens).

Lloyd Center Tilt's T4 machine is still broken for who knows what reason... Rear Projection Unit too.

-Chanchai

 

imho Tekken 4 is much slower then TTT, in all aspects of the game,
you now have alot more time to escape throws and less options to chose from( in TTT it was , 1,2 or 1+2, now it's only 2, or 1+2, but some chars do still have 1 escapes)

they have greatly shortend the back dash and taken out the universal back dash ( wave dash backwords) so now it's really hard to get away from strong guessing games (mid low), i mean strong by if you guess wrong then you lose 50% of your life or in some chars case, your whole bar.

poking (flow charts) has now become a very strong part of tekken , some chars such as steve can keep you blocking ( and guessing) for a very long time, this was not a big issue in TTT because a good player could move him self out of range and punish the wiff (miss) or force his own guessing game on to the opp by countering with the right moves, ie a move that goes round certain hits,
but all this has changed for T4, the 1,2 jabs have become really strong and unpunishable , well, not unpunishable, but REALLY hard to beat, to beat them you need to guess that he's going to do the jabs then do your jab beating move before they start to even press the jab button, as you prolly don't know most jab beating moves have bad recovery if they wiff.
so it's a big risk to throw it out unless you know 100% that
they will do the jabs

another thing thing i don't like about T4 is that you can "mash " the multi part throws, thats right, throws that do 80% of your bar can be mashed , just do the starter then start hitting all 4 buttons like a mad man, then hey presto a 6 hit chain throw that cripples your opp, how very nice

oh, and most stuns i.e kazuyas ws+2, now are inescapeable, to you that might not mean much, but to a tekken player it's total bullshit, you see it's not easy to escape a stun like that, you need to hold F (towords the opp) to get out, it takes time and practice to master it, it took me nearly 2 years to get it down, now just as soon as i have another skill to put under my belt it gets taken away from me, it's VERY annoying as you can prolly tell.
there are also wall stuns that are inescapeable, so that means is 35% on the combo then another 25% on the wall hit, then another 15% gaurunteed when your on the ground, which is a total of 75% from ONE inescapable stun

ok, i seem to be ranting now and it's kinda late so i better go to bed, laters all, peace out

ps, sorry about any bad spelling or grammer, i'm to tired to look thru it


i only win from your mistakes, not my skill

 

I played Tekken 4 today. Weird because I went to Tilt thinking that they weren't going to be getting any new games, but half expecting to find out if there was hope that a VF4 machine would be coming soon.

I thought it played a little slower than TTT, because I was able to see a lot more attacks coming than in TTT. For example, I was able to keep up with the movements of both Christie Montiero and Ling Xiayou (sorry if I mispelled the names), and blocked most attacks. Got a lot of MCs too (I used Kazuya). Maybe I have mad yomi skills, but I think that the game just plays a little slower. That and I was playing the CPU.

Graphics were pretty good. A lot better than I had expected, seeing various clips and screenshots. But like Chanchai mentioned, nothing trendsetting. It's amazing, or sad depending on your point of view, that TTT on PS2 has comparable graphics.

Some aspects of T4 are comical, like the environments. I had heard and read that you really don't want your back to a wall. After finally playing, trust me, you really don't want your back to a wall! Juggles have been toned down quite a bit, and back dashing is very hard when the opponent is bearing down on you. In that aspect, a very different game from TTT. The beach scene and the sloping rooftop on the skyscraper (with a helicopter) look like something borrowed from VF, but without the same attention to detail. And it's like Namco made a conscious effort to weaken Kazuya. His electric wind godfist hits high and only juggles on a counter. His gut punch isn't too bad though (I used it over and over again, in combination with the EWGF).

Overall, I liked playing it. I'm almost sure that because it's the new game in town, people are gonna play it, and that's fine because I would like the competition (not that I'm a Tekken master). But I'm still holding out for VF4, be it arcade or PS2.

-<font color=white>Ghost</font color=white><font color=red>DOG</font color=red>

 

Ooh... I just saw and played Tekken 4 in Singapore! Yes, it's here, but VF4 still isn't as far as I know. There are 2 machines at Virtualand Clementi, under the Empress Cinema next to KFC. It's no longer the Wywy Wonderspace.

All I can say about T4 is that I'm quite disappointed with gfx somewhat. It seemed very much to be a buffed up version of T3 - and it sux compared to TTT. Gameplay wise is still rather pleasing... but over here only the default characters are available. And in comparison to VF2 [which was standing next to it] it still seems to be far behind somehow. Maybe it's because VF2 has more vibrant colours and that the T4 display was rather foggy.

<font color=black>Yowai...yowai sugimasu wa!</font color=black>

 

oh, and most stuns i.e kazuyas ws 2, now are inescapeable, to you that might not mean much, but to a tekken player it's total bullshit, you see it's not easy to escape a stun like that, you need to hold F (towords the opp) to get out, it takes time and practice to master it, it took me nearly 2 years to get it down, now just as soon as i have another skill to put under my belt it gets taken away from me, it's VERY annoying as you can prolly tell.

They killed the gut punch already in Tag...just mash the 5 and you'll tag out of the stun. Still a significant advantage if the Kaz player is ready for the incoming tag partner, but nothing like T2. In Tag, it's sorta to the point where Jin and Hei seems so much better than Kaz in almost every way. Heck, I think Devil is stronger than Kaz in Tag.

When I tried T4 out, I did give Kaz a shot. Got killed trying to play him, heh. Had to rely on my good old Paul, his trusty 12 and the ever dependable deathfist/throw guessing game. Yes, I'm a scrub (so far).

 

I agree, Tekken 4 feels very much slower compared to TTT. Most of the people that I know say the samething. Damn shinjin, took just about everything I wanted to bring up... its all good. If I can think of any big gripe I mention them at a later time.

 

hehe, TTT was the first fighting game tha i played to anykind of level that was above scrub( i'm the european champ )

i played alot of TTT over the years,( sometimes 12 hours a day) so i know alot about it and why things work, but on the other hand i've only been playing VF4 (ver.B )for three days, lol, and i had never played TB before, so i'm not really in a good position to talk about VF just yet (but i'm working on it ).

but something i can say after only playing for such a short time is that VF4 is much better then T4 but a long way, when you lose on T4 you feel robbed, but when you lose on VF you feel as if you need to learn more (i've noticed that with all VF players, as so many of them came to TTT after TB died).

one more rant before i go,

T4 is really unbalenced , there are only 4 chars that can compete at a high level,( ling, kaz, jin, steve, but now that Lei is time released that might change) every other char has to really fight for their win, some ppl will say this is the same for TTT , but i'd say that TTT has a few more chars that are really good , out of the total 32 around 14 chars have a good chance of winning (dont make me name them ) which is 4 more then T4 starting line up

well thats it for now, laterz


i only win from your mistakes, not my skill

 

I started to play Tekken since Tekken 3 hit arcade at a level above scrub, but I dont spend much time with either game as much as I used to so many people are alot better than I. I am not really consistant with Tekken, especially T4.

I too think Tekken 4 is very unbalanced. Kazuya is still owning with the electric wind and Steve even though lacking low attacks still has the spacing and movement to give him the upper hand. Ling is much more aggressive than her previous states in my opinion. I dont think Jin is all too powerful, sure does the 1,2,3 is a good string, but many of his other strings that mix attack priorities are getting caught on. My friends are beggining to catch on Jin's strings.... and with the lack of a really useful launcher, its harder to tick damage away. Jin is a fun character to play none the less, but I can't find a way to makehim very affective at this moment.

I think things will change when both Lei and Julia are thrown into a fray. These characters will make the games balance all topsy turvy. Like Shin said, atleast in T3 and TTT there are more characters to get a winning chance.

I still have not played VF4, but I would love to play it. Obviously Tekken 4 is a rushed title... and I have plenty of mixed feelings for the game. I will get over it and play something far better... like VF4 for example.

 

Heh heh heh...it looks like another convert..

At least you're not being closed-minded and avoiding VF altogether.

Join the dark side...convert to VF...you can't resist.../versus/images/icons/smile.gif


-<font color=white>Ghost</font color=white><font color=red>DOG</font color=red>

 

Sounds like they already have converted...

When I first played T4 I thought it totally sucked. Not being a Tekken fan, that's not too suprising, but even so I was expecting MUCH better, I was even expecting it to give VF4 a run for it's money. The graphics seemed so dark and low-res, and the play seemed almost the same (to a Tekken novice) on 3D stages. Having played it a little more now (waiting for VF4 here and for a few days in Japan), I still think it's pretty lacklustre, but not too awful... but that's probably because I don't know about the overly strong 1,2 etc. since I'm just a beginner.

What really suprises me though is that even hardcore tekken fans seem let down. I was half expecting it to be hailed as the second coming now that it had adopted many of VF3's ideas. I could just hear the masses of people proclaiming it the undisputed king, combining TTT's "perfect" gameplay system with 3-D environments... but not so. Sadly, it seems like the mainstream press is still hyping it as of yet (have to sell those magazines).

Here in LA, 2 of the 5 or so hardcore tekken heads I know have said (separately) the same thing:

"Tekken is Dead"

Is this some kind of joke? Can it actually be that the favorite fighting game of the masses outside of Japan has fallen from grace? One of the same guys also said that TTT guys will either play VF4 or stop playing fighting games...

This is certainly an un-expected, yet welcome turn of events.

Welcome aboard guys. I hope you find VF as interesting as Tekken.

Spotlite

 

FUCK TEKKEN

As of right now, this moment in time, I have declared myself free from Tekken. I am tired of playing this mainstream over rated fighting game. God, I am so tired of biased Tekken nerds always thinking Tekken is the most innovative fighter ever... talking about how good they are, but complain like pussies about the 3 button layout VF uses. I tried to defend VF, but these fools are ignorant. So of right now, I wont play Tekken.... thanks for hearing me out... I have more reasons why I don't want to play tekken... but I wanted to keep ot short.

 

Re: FUCK TEKKEN

Do as you like. In this world, you only have to answer to youself.

Adio.

 

Re: FUCK TEKKEN

Well, I've only played it for a few hours, and I'm hardcore.. just as much as Shinjin, but I'm out.
It's not Tekken anymore.

hope they get vf4 here soon...

 

An update on my thoughts of Tekken4.... I actually played it quite a bit today. My school's arcade picked it up and it's 50 cents per play.

It's definitely slower than TTT, but I immediately figured that out when I first played the game anyhow. What I also noticed was that it was too easy to see things coming or escaping throw related aspects. Craig gets you in a pounding position, you can easily see which arm he'll hit you with and if he'll go for the armbar and what not. I thought the throw escape system in Tekken 3 and Tag was pretty lame (personal opinion), but at least the animations were fairly quick (sorta), but now.... as slow as they are, you can sort of see things coming. Not to mention that the guessing game has been reduced. I mean, LEFT throw is just a surprise exchange for all I know and I have not see it used to grab advantage in any way, just setup perhaps a wall attack (which is way too easy to roll out of anyways--someone show me a good use of a wall on a mid float situation--as opposed to the usual high floats). So as far as I know, RP or Both Punches are the main considerations. Mashing out of multi throws did seem easy. I mean, it was easy before and required more reflex than guessing, but did they need to make it any easier? I can at least say it was challenging before! For the most part, I figure I just try to throw someone out of a 1,2 but I'm not playing the hardest of opponents, but if I sense that 1 coming, throw. So far so good.

Despite all this, I'm enjoying the game, but I'll admit it's still a weird system. So many nice high attacks. Some good mid attacks. Only a few good low attacks. I might be wrong, but it seems that quite a few low attacks that are good, even, can be punished horribly.

Maybe the amount of enjoyment I have is playing Steve (mostly) and some Law or Bob (Hwoarang). I've seen Tekken 2 players enjoying Law quite a bit. Tekken 3 and TTT players getting frustrated with Bob, but I have no problem with Bob. And I'm just enjoying the bitchy style of Steve. Watching Ling players, despite what I've heard, she seems pretty bitchy in the game. Though she does low damage, I've seen some crazy sequences with her that go on and on and on and on.... All after a few simple zones or poke-launchers.

Okizeme seems way tied down in this game. minor counter tactics still seem to do very well, though a backdasher can be rushed (but rushes can be swayed or side stepped--sorta, thrown, or just countered). Maybe we're all just playing the game like previous Tekken games, though more aggressive, but still being "I'll wait for you to fuck up" type of bastards. Though I'm enjoying the straight up-front offense in the game as well.

It's much easier to counter sequences and rushes in Tekken 4 so far, but I could be wrong. I guess this is what Tekken players feel is a move towards VF, though I can make no real relation of this game and VF. After awhile, you get a lot of slug and evade fests that lead to quick, but not massive damage. I've seen some crazy damage here and there still, though.

It's weird though.... Tekken 4 has been so narrowed down and maybe it was an attempt to clean up.... Options have been reduced. 1,2 starting combos seem to be quite strong, but can easily be dealt with when abused. The game's overall speed is slower. I do not, so far see the big deal about walls in Tekken 4. In VF4, walls were quite the threat. In Tekken 4, it's one of the few features they really added (instead of took away)--rolling off walls with a simple hit of 1 (1 is the universal mash key when in a bad situation so far in my experience---priority high punch/tech roll/wall roll/SE counter/etc...).

Chicken has been reduced.... zoning seems strong... but at least VF4test seems to have the zoning way stronger.... I like VF4 WAY MORE THAN THIS GAME, but I'll admit I am enjoying this game. Despite it's awkard attempts at trying to cleanup a game that was already doing well for probably what was so unclean about it. Not that I ever prefer Tekken over VF, never was that the case, but Tekken has its audience and VF has its own as well.

However, I think in this age, in terms of the arcade business.... simplicity is being stressed. A lot of fighters are too complex for passer-bys in the arcade as they are. Maybe this was the thought behind Tekken 4? Heck, that damn Beach-Head game was racking the most money in Portland's Tilt arcade than any of the fighters (and just about any other game oddly enough).

-Chanchai

 

Well...in abt 15 mins time....one of the best local TTT players will be coming over to my place to learn abt VF in preparation for VF4...

One thing I found out is the experts seems to recognized how much harder VF actually is..wherelse a scrub will have stingy complaints such as 'boring characters...no ending...bad story...not alot of combos..sluggish controls etc etc etc'.



<font color=red>~~~ 'Flock off feather brain, or u can stick around and find out the hard way!/versus/images/icons/mad.gif~~~'