Tekken 5 First Impressions

Disclaimer: I'm an average Tag player at best (by U.S., not Korean standards), and barely competent in T4.

Tekken 5 debuted in Hong Kong on Saturday and I had a chance to check it out. It costed HKD $5 (while FT is only HKD $2) per play, so I didn't see any versus matches at all. Instead, people just watched and played the CPU if there was an empty seat. There were maybe half-a-dozen people watching at all times.

GRAPHICS

Great, but not fantastic. T5 is definitely less cartoony than T4 and DOA, but not as "gritty" as VF4. Everything looks really clean and high resolution. The backgrounds are no longer as "in your face" as T4 was and is a relatively passive part of the experience.

I wouldn't say the graphics blow the current fighters out of the water, but most people would probably feel DOAU looks better and T5 in turn also better than VF. Personally, I think VF has a very different style than DOA or Tekken.

SOUND

Didn't hear a damn thing.

GAMEPLAY

Based on only a couple of CPU runs, and general observation, I would peg T5 as somewhere inbetween T4 and T3. 1,2s seem to still be a big part of the game. The speed and stuns feel more like T4 than T3, but the flow seems to resemble T3 more. I don't really know how to articulate this better unfortunately!

Sidestepping so far feels like T4. and will give you small dodges which you can cancel with dashing. I don't know if there's a successful/failed dodge system a la VF4, but there were a couple of unblockables (the final boss' in particular) that looks overpowered if you can't sidestep it quickly.

Nobody I saw playing bothered to test the sidestepping system. By the time I remembered to, I was being pummeled by one of the new characters pulling 10-hit strings on me. That's when I decided to stick to VF.

I didn't see anyone using the card system.

OVERALL

VF has nothing to worry about, although the FT machines at Prince Edward (traditionally the main place to play VF) were significantly less crowded than usual. Does the cut from HKD $3 to HKD $2 per play reflect dying interest?

 

I also wanted to chech this game out a little, mainly since I had heard the US version carried the card system.

I found it here in LA, where the spot was charging $1/play...

anyway, if u haven't heard, T5 has a fully functioning card system built in: items, names, $, ranks and everything. The machine I saw was a kind of custom T5 cabinet, which had a slot to sell cards, as well as PS2 contoller ports so you can play with your own stick/pad if you want (one guy at the arcade had his Namco stick in effect). I think someone also mentioned it having PS2 memory card slots. Oh, and the stock sticks were very nice Japanese square base units that we love, and the buttons were low-profile ones, layed out on the slight angle we're used to from our japanese sticks.

Editing name/character/shopping all happens from character select, I haven't seen someone do it yet, so I'm not sure if the other person has to wait & do nothing while you do that... I dunno. The arcade was selling cards for $7, which is too much, but that's a lame arcade anyway.

Just on these things alone, I think Namco deserves BIG kudos for making this happen, and Sega should hang their head in shame. Or, should US players be ashamed of the fact that they can't wrap their mind around a more complex game than Tekken or SF? Whoever u wanna blame it on, Tekken heads just came UP!

I was thinking about getting into it, then I played a few vs matches and was reminded why I can't stand Tekken: throws are nerfed, HUGE moves are totally un-counterable (I guarded Law's flipkick & tried to counter with Paul's Deathfist, which is like 13 frames or something crazy... guard), so it seems to degrade into only range, timing and priority of attacks, lots of strings and Nitaku based only on guessing between mid and low (people seem to only throw as a kind of "surprise" attack when they sense someone freezing up).

I will say this about the side steps (which almost no one seems to use for anything but fancy stepping where I was playing), since everyone seems to stay right out of range and bob around, trying to figure out when the other guy's gonna come in/attack (like SF without the jumping), I guessed that side-stepping would be good when u thought they were gonna attack. This worked like a charm when the Lee player I was fighting did some huge jumping kick, which I dodged and ended up squarely behind him for a nice back throw, KO ^^. this was met with a "that's BULLSHIT!"

heh, I miss having Ghetto comp! but, I can't stand this game...

Bryan

 

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I was thinking about getting into it, then I played a few vs matches and was reminded why I can't stand Tekken: throws are nerfed, HUGE moves are totally un-counterable (I guarded Law's flipkick & tried to counter with Paul's Deathfist, which is like 13 frames or something crazy... guard), so it seems to degrade into only range, timing and priority of attacks, lots of strings and Nitaku based only on guessing between mid and low (people seem to only throw as a kind of "surprise" attack when they sense someone freezing up).

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I played some T5 this weekend and I agree with this. I've come to the early conclusion that it's basically T3 with a card system.

Namco has clearly made an attempt to put T4 out of people's minds, but I agree that it's still mostly a range-oriented game with too many safe moves. The overall presentation is great. It's similar to VF with pre-fight taunts, the levels, and of course the card system. Nothing really stands out in the game to make me say "this is innovative", but I think the fighting engine is decent.

 

They lowered the one here in lake county to 50 cents a game. So I will play it a little as well as play tekken 3 again. It's pretty fun once for now. But who knows. Maybe I will stop playing it if FT comes out on the consoles.

 

any high level footage would be nice(Korean, Japanese). I don't plan to touch it until the ps2 version is released. But, I don't mind watching some nice play until then.

 

Spotlite- I think I played you... I'd be the Law player with a card, and hori tekken 3 stick.

FYI- Law has a whole load of different flipkicks with different properties, most of them are actually very unsafe.

Anyway... the $7 card thing looks like a feeble attempt to bleed a bit more money out of people at LACC. I got mine directly from the machine (at Westwood arcade), it costs $5.

You get to edit your character at the start of the game, only if you're challenging (or starting a single player game). If you're winning, you're then stuck (in fact you can't remove your card or change character until you lose). You get 30 seconds to edit your character, in which your opponent has to sit and wait. Name entry is completely rubbish and it usually takes people a few attempts to actually get their name in - especially seeing as the default character name isn't cleared and there's no option to do so - you have to overwrite it with spaces. So, you can always tell a first time card user, when they have a name like MIaul Phoenix or something.

The interface for buying items is pretty poor - you can't preview the items, and you also have no way of knowing what you're going to change when you buy something like "color 1" for the first time. On some characters, color 1 might just be the gloves or something - you won't know this until you've blown the money on it (which may have taken you 20 games to earn) - although obviously most of this stuff can be looked up on the net by now. Items aren't that good either - if they were going to knock off VF so blatantly, the least they could do is try to make it as good, or better.

The one cool thing about the character customisation thing, is that an AI "ghost" of your character is uploaded to the machine, and when people play the game in single player, there is a chance that they might get drawn against your ghost - which supposedly mimics your play style (presumably it does your favourite combos, I'd be interested to see if it does any more than that). The cool part is that if your character wins, it makes money for you. The next time you visit that machine, it awards you with all the money your ghost earned in your absence. Although it makes only a very small amount of money for each win - it would have to win over 300 matches to get enough for the cheapest item (colour change).

Oh, one more thing, that does make Tekken 5 the best game EVAR:
Jin has an item called "metrosexual hair".
Beat that, VF.

 

i like my game to be about the fight, not a point about my characters sexuality...............

still, if you wanna play as a confused sexual character, tis your choice..............

 

MG,

yeah, I make no claims about being able to play Tekken at all, but even though I can't counter a guarded kick-flip by Law correctly (as you saw /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif) I think the majority of my observations about the gameplay hold up. I talked about Tekken some the next day with Andy here in LA (who's played quite a bit of it), and he also seemed to agree with most things I noticed (which I've been noticing since Tekken began, mainly that it's pretty much an Attack-only game about 90% of the time; which is too bad, it has some REALLY cool ideas about throws). But, maybe those are the observations of someone who doesn't understand the game.

That's a drag that the interface is clumsy for the customization. The card thing was the only real reason I wanted to play at all /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif.

I think in general I'm always kinda disappointed at how little Tekken changes between each version, Sadly, VF seems to be the exception in this dept when it comes to fighting games (talking at the sequel or new game level, not updates like Evo or 3rd Strike), as Capcom continues to re-hash the same ideas for 15+ years, scared to take a crack at SF4. But, like I said before, I'm probably more bummed that US players eat it up like mad.

Is College Arcade (which is a money-grubbing shithole that no one should ever really go to) where people are playing?

Bryan

 

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Is College Arcade (which is a money-grubbing shithole that no one should ever really go to) where people are playing?

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People were playing there for a while (I think it was the first place in LA to get a machine), now it seems people are deserting it since it's back to $1 a game. The other main hotspot is apparently Camelot Golfland in Anaheim, where it's 50c.

 

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i like my game to be about the fight, not a point about my characters sexuality...............

still, if you wanna play as a confused sexual character, tis your choice..............

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funny, last time i checked you play as vanessa exculsivly!

 

footage people, footage!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

http://www.tekken.net/

Has the newest Korean matches mirrored. You have to sifn up but it's worth it. Over 40 matches, all top players.

 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i like my game to be about the fight, not a point about my characters sexuality...............

still, if you wanna play as a confused sexual character, tis your choice..............

[/ QUOTE ]

funny, last time i checked you play as vanessa exculsivly!

[/ QUOTE ]

haha and youd rather play as a ninja who likes to chuck people in the air and then proced to rape them while they stand motionless in the air, unable to do anything bout it?

kage= serial rapist!!!!!!

 

Hmm where to start. I started playing Tekken since Part 2 tho I remember playing 1. I only got serious when Tag came out but has since calm down due to the fact that T4 was a bit crap. I still play Tag and T4 everynow and then on the PS2 but I play with a Pad. Reason is cos I tend to think I'm still playing VF on the stick and end up left kicking ppl to death thinking it's block. When I'm on the pad I play normally.

Anyway, so the Troc finally got T5 and first impressions was it's much much better than T4 thats for sure. Although the screen is pretty shit and blurry it's still a step up from T4. It was £1 a go and £1 for the card too which has a lil machine next to it to get the card from.

Unfortunatly we get the crappy US sticks which are stiff as hell and the buttons are grooved inwards. I seen the card system work and it's pretty nifty tho we ain't got no PS2 ports which is a real shame. I woulda like to brought my pad along and play thte game, lol.

I played most the new characters for testing trial and they seem to be good. They got potential to be good. The dodging system felt like VF now if u ask me but a bit more free. Does feel like playing T3 again tho. I like the new moves and stances for Jin, tho I don't play as him as my primary. I just stuck to Paul since I seem best with him and I know him from T2.

Raven Seems ok, a lot of careful guessing and right timing will make him dangerous I reckon. Feng is like a nother version of Paul but with weird looking moves. He might be my secondary character.

Stages are very nice I have to admit, I didn't dislike any of the stages. My fave is the ice level only cos I got the giggles from watching those penguins in the background.

As for story line and the bosses, Devil Jin and Jinpachi. C'MON! now we get Jins great Grandfather to beat up?! Haven't this family got enough trouble already?! lol. It's like family affairs now. I was also expecting Asuka to be Unknown from Tag.

From what I was hearing from sitting next to the machine watching ppl play. I was liking the sound tracks too.

Overall I still think VF FT will still top T5 tho I still will buy the console version of it and play for fun rather than competition. The game is still better than SC2, DOA and definalty the MK series tho. VF is still top in my books.

 

Well, I first started playing tekken in 2 as well, although I started playing properly when 3 came out, with I personally always preferred to Tag (even though, admittedley is the high point of the tekken series). Tekken 4 was a huge dissapointment, even though I and the other tekken player's around me tried our damndest to make it good!

I haven't yet unfortunately played the finished tekken 5 yet (I'm ironically going to the Namco station at the Trafford Centre tonight, I'll see if they have it) but have played the test version and it definetley had a tekken 3 vibe about it (which I loved), but since getting into VF it's strange going back to an all out attack based game.

I love the look of Raven (kos of Kage) and Feng (who apparently is the new Paul, who is my favourite Tekken character) but think I might wait for the home version next year, because I'm loving VF too much at the moment. Still at least it's a good game eh! lol.

 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i like my game to be about the fight, not a point about my characters sexuality...............

still, if you wanna play as a confused sexual character, tis your choice..............

[/ QUOTE ]

funny, last time i checked you play as vanessa exculsivly!

[/ QUOTE ]

haha and youd rather play as a ninja who likes to chuck people in the air and then proced to rape them while they stand motionless in the air, unable to do anything bout it?

kage= serial rapist!!!!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

the thing is your a minor, so you could say that as you dont know how to play as kage, but me, seeing as i can play with everyone apart from leifei, i hav an insight into the game that you'll never had. liek you coments on tekken.

about the game (T5) i wanna get in to it, but £1 per credit on a poorly converged rear-projection screen set up is nto gonna do it for me, but iron mike told me its not bad, but the new charicters are crap.

i'll definatly get it on pirate though in feb/march, as no doubt it will be avalable at leat 2weeks b4 its out

shame i can only play tekken with pad though!

 

Tekken 5 is pretty cool if you're a Tekken fan. I admit it's hard to swallow a lot of Tekken's madness if you're used to VF. The main problem with the game to me so far is the damage and that's most likely because our arcade is only best of three. Any clown can do a 45% combo in T5 and games barely been out three weeks! Combine that with Tekken's disproportionate risk reward ratio on certain moves and insideous wake-ups and it can be really frustrating at times. However the main problem that I think will harm the game in the future will be the walls. When more people start doing specific combos that just push you into the wall so then they can get really medival on ass it's gonna be sick.

On the plus side this game will be huge in America arcade wise. Folks have been playing it nonstop where I'm at. Comp galore for a comp whore. And it's really flashy and characters are cooler than ever.

 

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Comp galore for a comp whore. And it's really flashy and characters are cooler than ever.

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There are two big of an association between the two in the U.S. fighting games popularity. IMO, it's their losses but still disappointing.

 

I've been playing T5 pretty heavily lately. For starters, I've really hated T4 and since gave up on the series. Maybe it's the lack new VF for me, or maybe it's simply the amount of competition, but I've really started to get into the game a bit more than I expected. As a VF player, sure, it's hard to adjust to the movelist for a couple of reasons.

1) The amount of moves is staggering, every character has at least 10 or more commonly useful moves, and the majority of them are string that can be delayed or stopped.
2) Side stepping and cancels is really fast in this game, and some of the characters can move at blazing speeds across the ring. On top of that, moves track really well, and chances are your successful sidestep won't mean anything if they are followed by another part of a series of attacks.
3) Tekken 5 is definitely attack oriented, if you try to play it safe, either it will become very boring, or you will get your life chipped away.
4) Throwing is not a threat at all, you can escape it on reaction, and there are only 3 escapes for most characters so you have a 33% guess.
5) This game is largely dependent on the wakeup game, if you can keep your opponent on the ground, you will pretty much win the match. It's easy to do this because you can hit the opponent at all times on the ground if they don't move, and if they are getting up, you can hit them while they are rolling or getting up.
6) Throws are largely the same as an attack, people can side step it, and you can't beat it with an attack. Reverse nitaku is almost non existent.

There are, however, some interesting ideas to throw in the mix to prevent this game from being a percentage game.

Crushing system, moves that are considered crouching always beat high attacks. And jumping attacks always beat crouching attacks.

Beating evades is easy, just use a move that tracks.

Frames are almost useless to learn unless you are trying to figure out which attack will beat which if they are thrown out at the same time. Furthermore, there is not much window for command buffering, so if you are trying to play a frame game but you mis time the input, it doesn't work out. There are so many strings in the game that people use, it's almost useless to worry about frames if you are blocking a series of attack and they stop or delay it.

Reversals are Parries are super strong. A mid reversal will reverse all mids, or other levels too. Don't have to worry about if it's kick or punch, etc. For the most part. If you parry some one's low kick, or attack, you have massive frame advantage. Netting you guaranteed combos.

Even though you have to attack constantly to win, you don't have very much to worry about. If the move pushes the opponent back on block, and this is true pretty much 99% of the time, a simple backdash and holding back will avoid throws and give you enough room to block whatever counter attacks by the opponent.

While some of these things can be used in gameplay, the game still ends up being a game of chance. Guess the right timing and hit level, and you get a half life combo. Sure there are some setups and mid game, but a lack of defensive techniques hurts the guessing game quite a bit. There are almost no risks to most attacks, and you can become a fairly high level player by having a good feel of the moves of your opponent (being able to block the righ hit lvl) and then following a method for range and move selection. (Do this mid range safe move at this range, use this other move to pressure and chip.) I could explain this in a bit more detail, but I don't feel the need to. The point is that it's very easy to become an effective player by learning and being able to do a handful of things. I picked it up and became effective in about 2 days time.

The game overall, even though being rather shallow, is still quite fun. With an elementary guessing game, it can be a fun distraction at least for me, since I don't have to worry about much of the things I regularily have to think about in a VF match. I would recommend this game to alot of people on vfdc since it can help you get a good understanding of basic nitaku situation, and train you reaction and defensive skills. This is how I'm approaching the game, as a tool to train some basic skills for VF. It's just fun for me since there is not a lack of competition with tekken, and many of the well known players in the Tekken series live quite close to me. If it's not too expensive to play this at your local arcade, I would say give it a try especially since all the US cabinets will have the card system. (Same ones as VF but stripped down compare to real VF.net)

 

Reversals are only decent because they catch high/mid automatically but in high level play you only really reverse the middle hits of a string or something a good player won't chicken (a reversal reversal). You will rarely ever reverse a competant Paul player's deathfist because he most likely will chicken it every time. High/mid parry's are better but only a few characters have them. King and Craig have unchickenable reverals so their's are good. The best parry is hands down the low parry. Low parry a low kick and a combo guaranteed. Low punches aren't as vunerable but it's still bad. There really lame part about low parry is that everybody has one and I think that fucks over some characters (Christie) but hey, charge it to the game.