Use for 8/2 P+K

Using 8/2 P+K in battle:

Properties:
1)Performing the back side variant faster by 1 fr(27 vs 28).
2)Unsafe on block(-15)
3)Difficult to react at this low(!) kick.

Using:
1)When i am at large disadvantage up to -11(for ex. after 6K guarded=-9)->Guess game...
...8/2P+K has evade properties(Against linear strikes) , and this is still a strike, not DM(Against throw)->So this is UNIVERSAL option in this situation.

2)Possible 2 variants:
a. If i am at +2 or Higher->Evade opponent's attack(may need small pause, because "evade phase" of 8/2P+K at the beginning of the move); and counterhit Throw.
b. If i am at +1 or Lower(to -11)->Evade opponent's attack(except 11 fr and <), for ex. 2P ; and clash(draw) Throw.


Question: 8/2P+K has 4 different animations(at normal hit) depending on which opponent's leg and in what direction i hit(beat out)-they all have the same length of Recovery(hitstun) after hit or different?

 

2 pk and 8 pk

it looks like that low kick evades?? does it evade linear attacks?? when do u guys use this move, or when is it useful to use?? any setups?

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

It's commonly used after the goh player has executed a combo and guesses that his opponent will techroll.

I think you can also use it after an OM.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

I think, erdraug, you mix up /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif with /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif. The former is a low kick with evasive properties, the latter Goh's infamous anti-tech roll trap.

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is not a widely used move. As this is a low kick its stats on block are terrible (-15), on hit quite good (+3) though. Sure, you have those evasive properties - but the success on that depends on too many uncontrolled variables (custom hit-boxes of moves, etc.). I wouldn't bet too much on its evasiveness.

When it hits and under certain circumstances you can try to link /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif into the hit-throw kick /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif.

IMHO, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is best used as round-finisher - if at all.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

It's still a good-to-know-it's-there kind of move in -7 - -9 situations. Clashes throws and kills most elbows.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

*Looks up command list* Ouch! Serves me right for trying to posting about characters i'm not familiar with /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/blush.gif Leonard is absolutely right 169mackfactor, please disregard.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

Wait u can line 8/2 pk to a hit throw with 8 kg, how do i do that?
And how the hell do u get 2/8 k+g to be an anti tech-roll, i've tried and tried in the dojo but get nothing : (

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

Last things first: /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif connects when the opponent tech-rolls or OMs to either side. An example: hit the opponent with 3K in Dojo mode, let him tech-roll to the foreground, do a forward dash and perform the anti-tech-roll move. Or i.e.: 3K+G (the sweep) knocks down on CH. If the opponent tries to tech-roll, trap him with /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif. If he doesn't continue to combo with e.g. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif, down punch /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif or ground throw /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif.
Also, when you and the opponent are close to a wall, you can automatically hit-throw him with e.g. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif if the wall is to the back side (/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif).

About /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif: As I'm riding on the RRoD wave for over 12 days now, I can't test it any further to give you more detailed info. Citing by muscle memory then. But in general: you can get a weird angle to the opponent with /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif. If that's the case (and you got into a side-turned situation with e.g. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif), then immediately doing /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif will link into the hit-throw.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

very cool. i look forward to trying this : ) Thanks

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

Ops. I meant the 1K+G sweep.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

1K=G, guaranteed on some angles after 1pk??
or 2KG the hit throw, after 1 pk turns opponent into a wierd angle...
the 1Kg is the low kick??

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

Of course, I mean 1K+G here for the sweep, which I mistakenly typed down as 3K+G.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

1pk on hit, wierd angle... then the "HIT throw" kick ( guaranteed only on some situations??? depending on how opponent is angled?) that catches ppl on tech roll,sidestep (DM), or om??

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

De ja vue:
http://virtuafighter.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/204379#Post204379

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

I tried this on VF4Evo yesterday and it worked really well, thanks Leonard.
I couldn't get it to work on VF5 but I'm sure it's doable in certain scenarios.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

I've got both to work.
1. Put opponent in dojo on fastest tech roll/rising etc. Then 1 k+g, and u have to dash forward then 2/8 k+g, depending on what way they roll. I found u do have to dash forward to close the distance though.
2. 2/8 p+k, there are 2 different animations the opponent might "slip" with. If they do the more outrageous one (its a lot rarer, and seem to happen more if ur angled ever-so-slightly to the side) where they kick a foot way out in frot of them then immidiately 2/8 k+g to the opposite direction than u did the first move to. It is cool, but like others said already, not so useful in play.

 

What is Minamobarai(VF) /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif?
-it is a form of De Ashi Barai (in russian judo school, which largely overlaps with sambo) it is also called Lateral podsechka, which plays the role of setup for the follow-up like suffocating or pain moves.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_ASvQxwi7A


So <u>what is the usage of this beautiful movement in the VF:</u>

1)it is the most unique Goh's move, because this is the one of the safest options when you just have Nitaku (you are at -7-11 disavd.)- /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif has evade properties(Against linear strikes) , and this is still a strike, not DM(Against throw)->crash or clash with throws.

As written above, if you are at less diasadv(>-6), then it may be necessary to make a delay, more or less, respectively (but this is very precise and intuitive), so this is not the stable and reliable version.

2)I do not think that it can be used where else because of the specificity of this movement:
-as Round Finishers- not good in poke game (great risk/low reward), and also this is a CLOSE RANGE move.
-as Setup during the match from scratch- not good, because it has not evade properties long enough (only on beginning of execution phase (5-7 frames of 27(28) execution phase) and lasts a very short).

So, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is a very particularized motion. A specific move for a specific situation! This unique movement, which many other characters do not have!


<u>What are the follow-ups after this move:</u>

1)On Guard=-15: ETE(G).

When you perform /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif not directly front of the opponent=>provoke side-turned situation to the opponent(most usefull situation for this move):
2)On NH=(+3+3for Side-turned)=+6: /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif(especially on MC=>side collapse), /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif, and others.

3)On side CH (Blue flash)=(+6+3 for side-turned)=+9 (Nitaku):
(a)/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif - is not guaranted in this situation, it connects ONLY when /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif will be MC(i.e. opponent'll be trying to perform some actions, and not any actions i think, but only striking thought).
{The proof: in dojo mode , CPU=CH, and 2nd /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif does have Blue flash also like 1st /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif, it means that this is not combo, i.e. possible to Low guarding!}. But this can be a very good miks-up: /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif or Low throws.
(b)All actions when having adv.+9: /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif, Half-spin movements, with Throw mixes.


<u>Note:</u>

Question: /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gifhas 4 different animations of opponent(at normal or counter hit) depending on which opponent's leg and in what direction i hit(beat out)-they all have the same length of Recovery(hitstun) after hit or different?
Reply: After testing, I came to the conclusion that there is no difference in frame-properties(advantage) for each of the 4 animations.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

Yes, it looks very nice and beautifull (I've noticed that even in VF4 before the VF5 release)...but unfortunately this does not guarantee. Very sad((
I think AM-2 should increase one's strength, for ex. +8 at MC , for guaranted P-strings/Throws.
http://virtuafighter.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=247449#Post247449

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

Even though I wanted to include it in my previous post(s), I simply forgot to mention that you almost always have to dash in to apply the anti-tech-roll nitaku with /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif//forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/u.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif. Thanks social for mentioning it again.

 

Re: 2 pk and 8 pk

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif i couldn't do it until u told me (in the shoutbox) that i had to dash 1st. So all the credit goes to u. I was simply sharing your knowledge with others.

P.S. BTW ur little TE by character type breakdown was helpful. Yet another way for me to organize my goals vs different opponents.