Vanessa: Which Stance Is Better?

I've been with playing Evo Vanessa for a while now and been wondering what people think her best stance is? I know the CPU in Quest loves her offensive stance (as well as alot of videos I see). I like Defensive stance better as I can do crazy damage on simple things but also because I'm more comfortable with DS. I see potential in OS but don't if it's all around deadly like DS. The craziest thing I've seen in OS is:
MC WS K, ,+,. Of course this did insane damage and it seems to catch you if you struggle too fast. I also love OS's tackle strings that automatically space out low punch counter distances. What's the deal Vanessa experts?

 

It's funny, I asked this same question to the rest of the BR crew while in Pomona. From our discussion, I'd say the OS is cute, but DS has some crazy stuff to mess people up. Vanessa's got that funky ability to mess up your mind, because she can show guard, but MC any throw attempt with that , or she can just stand there and not show guard but grab your hand and have sick damage potential. So, thus, in my opinion, DS is better, although OS is fun to mess around with. Senor Ice Cold, any thoughts?

 

I think both stances have their uses, although the offensive stance has been seriously beefed up from version C... to the point where it's actually useful. I think what really did it was moving her to offensive... I've only been experimenting a tad with Vane (used her almost entirely in defensive mode in version C), and I miss it .. the new defensive doesn't seem to come out as fast or recover as quickly, although I haven't seen frame data, so i could be wrong.

It's nice that there are far more ways to get into mounted position (eg. tackle from EVERYWHERE and the lovely mount-position throw), that can be quite damaging... since there are now actually some guessing-game options involved.

Anyhow, I still prefer defensive stance, but that could be due to conditioning. The new offensive stance seems quite powerful, perhaps because I don't yet know what to expect from it.. I think a better balance exists between the two than there was.

 

I'm not a real expert, but i play a lot with this character.
What I do is use each stance for different characters.

Akira - OS stance because of the long each jab combos (delay, (30 to 35 points) and the P df P for a counter. I like the OS because it seems hard to reverse his moves and I the speed of the OS is nice.

Pai - DS, I like to keep her at bay with the and then get a reversal with the neutral stance. Same thing against Lau (in fact it works better against him because he has alot more punch than elbow moves). I just hang back far enough where their kick will miss you and then let the neutral stance grab his punch or press Back PK.

Wolf - DS. When he does his combo, you can block the first and reverse the second punch with either the neutral stance or . Same with his (except its for the reversal).

Jeffery - either one. the speed of the OS allows you to pick him off and dash back or the DS allows you to reverse him because he has a fair amount of punch moves. I like the OS.

Kage - DS. I don't like to try an match him offense for offense. I use the DS and force him to come at me. You can get alot of mid reversals off him, witch will really help you because he's hard to throw.

Sarah - OS. Shes my hardest character so if anyone has any other advise, please. I use the jab combos to break that flamingo stance and the to keep her away from me. the reach of the jabs help when she does the flamingo stance a little too far away.

Jacky - DS. Some of his kicks have big movements so you can reverse them (mostly with the mid reversal) and his combo become repeative witch make them easy prey to the reversals or throws.

Shun - DS. Like Pai and Lau, I use the to keep him at bay. I also get alot of low throws off him when he misses his sweeps. In addition, his move where he jumps back a little and then charges at you with his fist is easy prey to the reversals.

Lion - Not sure witch stance has a better advantage. Ds is alright because theres like one or two moves that are easy reversal (, , ). However, the OS has speeeeeeed and you can pick him off and get some counter hit combos. I like the DS to be safer.

Aoi - OS. again the speed helps you pick her off and she doesn't have to many reversalable moves. Just becareful, she can reverse like any move that you have. I like to throw her around alot.

Lei - DS. Once you get to know his stlye - he has a lot of mid reversalable moves and a lot of punch moves for the neutral stance, just watch his movements.

Brad - DS beacuse of all the reversal opps you get. He uses alot of punchs and the reversals (neutral stance is better in my opinion) are very helpful since I have a hard time building an offense against him.

Goh - OS. If you use your speed and reach correctly, you'll kill him everytime. Use alot of kicks too because he can grab your punches. ( is nice but enter in a throw escape or two.) I like my distance in any fight so i use the after a knockdown to give him some room.

Vanessa - DS. She has alot of punch moves and repeative combos ( in the DS and in the OS witch are easy to reverse). Just give yourself some distance and do a reversal, counter or wait for the throw opp.

Well, thats my advise. This little guide is really meant for beginers and against computer characters. I mostly used her in 4 and got to thesecond highest rank. In Evo I'm rated as a Hunter with a 87% win ratio.
But if anyone has more info, advise or just plain disagrees; go ahead and respond. Sarah, Lion, and Lei are the hardest for me (in that order) so please repond with more hints.

 

Hey Cloud, nice post--I like playing Vanessa for fun just for the versatility that she gives. Your guide definitely seemed to cater to the CPU though.

One thing I would like to add: I like using DS against Sarah. Any time she goes into Flamingo, do or such that you dodge towards her stomach. It should beat her FL for a nice crumple.

 

I ain`t no expert, but IMO, DS is better cause of reversals and /. Plus, I find it easier to take large chunks of life in DS. OS only got takedown position...

 

Thanks for the info about and the other block moves Ice, i hardly use those move so that might be my solution. I'll go the early arcades and play with them. Yeah, most of what I said is meant for the computer because i never play humans, theres no game in my area. They need some internet play . I would love to take on some of the best out there.

To pkg - I like the DS better myself, however if the OS had the neutral grab with it, I would like the OS a little more. No one else really talks about the neutral stance reversal, I love it. Its one the most original moves they came up with.

 

Hey Ice, thanks again for responding to my question, but I tried using the DS against Sarah and the was only working half time. I did find a system, during one of the kicks in that stance, the punch is successful all the time, but i hate to sit and block until i see it.. I notice in this game the computer blocks those moves a hell of lot more than in old 4 so I really don't using them.
My other problem with the DS against her is that the moves that prevent the Flamingo stance (I mean when Sarah does it just inside her your reach), the DS only has the 2 jab combo. Everything else I tried got me a kick in the face /versus/images/graemlins/shocked.gif. At least with the OS, I use the or be a little risk and the , combos.

 

Hi,
Well with Vanessa being my main character for a while now i would have to say there is no ULTIMATE best stance...it purely depends on which character you are playing against and also the style the actual person you are playing uses. DS stance is really good and the one i`m most at home with, really good for fighting kage and the other fast characters...OS stance is really good for me since it is primarily very awkward to fight against hence its sheer unpredictability makes it a must for any Van player to be familiar with. moves in OS like , are abit tricky to pull of but cool and only fully connect on light characters...Sarah is hard to play against and alot of the time its quite the waiting game against her in flamingo unless you use , or (you know the rest)..i try and make up my own combos as much as possible to stay unpredictable until people analyse them to death in replays and see where to counter or look out for certain animations.......(sigh)

 

You can tear up Flamingo with Vanessa if Sarah gets too predictable with her follow-up. If Sarah tries the you can duck the first kick and retaliate with WS (FC for those you not familar with Tekken lingo) before the last kick comes out. If you're feeling like a pimp you can WS in OS. If she goes for from Flamingo a Gut Punch ( for those not familar with Tekken lingo) should pop her. For Quest Mode high level AIs tricks you can hit Sarah with DS + practically everytime you eat her Flamingo .

 

I guess everyone liking the DS against Sarah, I'll give the combos a couple of chances then. Really haven't thought of that.
Also, I know i wrote that DS was better than OS against the computer Pai, but I was getting my butt beat by the Champion Pai for two rounds. Switched to OS in the 3rd, made a nice comeback but fell short in the 5th. Next fight, I beat her in 4. So think OS is a little better because I wasn't blocking as much as I was in the DS. I also wasn't able to reverse to many moves, I think only 1 or 2. Instead, in the OS, I was back dashing and countering with punches and combos. But some pressure on with too.

 

In defensive stance best move is hold or . Unfortunately it is guaranteed throw place so practise throw escapes. Offensive stance is better. Throws are amazing and attacks can be delayed to confuse your opponent. Combos are powerful. is very good move. If it hits, do it again. Unfortunately this move is also risky so don't use it all the time.
/versus/images/graemlins/grin.gifOffensive is better for sure! Remember that! /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

IMHO, offensive takes her already great damage potential and turns it up a few notches. She's got alot of high-damage strikes in OS that are perfect for turning the tide of a match, if you find yourself losing.

I personally prefer DS for much of the fight, then switching to OS after I've knocked the opponent down so I can tack on some extra damage, then popping back into DS to keep up with my offensive.

It's all about keeping your opponent guessing. Stancechanging with Vane seems to be VERY effective.

 

I'm no expert either, but I prefer DS myself, for the following DS unique moves, in the order listed, with the best moves first (imho).

db+p sabaki
f,f+k
G,d/u+p
throws generally do more damage
auto punch inashi
b,f+k sabaki
reversals

Btw, I could be wrong, but df+p seems the same in DS and OS to me. But yeah, I use that one alot in both stances, too.

WS,P is another damn good move in both stances, imho. Oh and yeah, useful against Sarah.

OS is fun, though. I generally stay in DS, and switch to OS, when I'm ahead. Probably due to my lack of experience in the new OS.

 

i like DS but one thing i like to do is then and then i switch to oc and use + then
+ it seems to work pretty good for me /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[ QUOTE ]
American_Pai said:
If Sarah tries the you can duck the first kick and retaliate with WS (FC for those you not familar with Tekken lingo)

[/ QUOTE ]

WS (while standing) and FC (full crouch) are two completely different motions.
Tekken AND VF uses BOTH motions in their games.
It's not like one game uses WS, while the other uses FC.

"WS" moves are performed as the character is standing up from a crouch. So in Tekken's case, that is like Kazuya's WS+2 (gut punch), WS+1,2 (twin pistons), and in VF4 that is like Lau's ws+K or Vanessa's (DS) ws+P_ws+k.
FC, is when moves are performed during a crouch. Akira's double palm and single palm moves are examples of moves which require FC. Example of FC in Tekken's case would be like Julia/Michelle's Bow&arrow kick (fc,df+4,3) .

WS is NOT the same as FC.

 

[ QUOTE ]
American_Pai said:
If Sarah tries the you can duck the first kick and retaliate with WS (FC for those you not familar with Tekken lingo)

[/ QUOTE ]

Another thing you can do is reverse the second kick.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Brandestoc said:
WS (while standing) and FC (full crouch) are two completely different motions.
Tekken AND VF uses BOTH motions in their games.
It's not like one game uses WS, while the other uses FC.

[/ QUOTE ]

I always thought it meant "From Crouching." My bad or whatever. And yes I know the diffence between WS and FC using your definitions.

 

When I played tekken, FC was the term we used for WS also...'from crouch'.

Either way. Defensive is better.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Painty_J said:
When I played tekken, FC was the term we used for WS also...'from crouch'.

[/ QUOTE ]

WS has always been the TK term for while standing. How can FC mean while standing? Perhaps you're thinking of WR=while rising. FC can only mean from/full crouch.

WS=while standing/when standing
WR=while rising/when rising
FC=from crouch/full crouch