VF4 PS2 Release

Discussion in 'Console' started by Cappo, Jan 21, 2002.

  1. Cappo

    Cappo Well-Known Member

    We are coming closer and closer to the Japanese Release for the Arcade port of VF4. Those pictures over at gamespot look terrible compared to the arcade format of the game. I hope they arent final shots of the game, because im sure the PS2 is capable of more than that, how bout u guys? MGS2 look awesome and so does Devil May Cry, oh and Tekken Tag also looks good, even though i am happy its coming on the PS2 and i will buy it. Just wondering are those the final shots of the game? Or has Yu Suzuki released any new pics i havent seen?
     
  2. Rugal

    Rugal Well-Known Member

    Final shots. Ps2 hardware sux. End of story.
     
  3. Cappo

    Cappo Well-Known Member

    What the hell, i swear the PS2 is better than that, no fishes on that stage with Aquarium? SUCKY
    The leaves on LeiFei's stage look like BS
    Whats going on here??
     
  4. oldtimer

    oldtimer Well-Known Member

    If you haven't, read the post titled "PS2 VF4 80% beta -- hands-on preview"

    You could use the search function or just navigate a few pages down.

    Excellent stuff... I think there was mention about fishes still be around...

    =)
     
  5. marcel

    marcel Well-Known Member

    Oh please, I can't tell u how much I and many others are dissapointed with this #@$^ ! I mean look at some of the games on PS2, look at Grand Turisimo 3, the cars almost look real, Bloody Roar 3 looked better, I even dare venture to say that DOA2 hardcore lookes on the same level. I just hope and pray for an XBox version. Sega-AM2 seem to somehow always .... up home conversions. They make the arcade on their own hardware and when they go to take it home it sucks. Once I get the PS2 version I am still gonna go to the arcade. But... that doesn't excuse the large absense of certain details, the PS2 is better than this. "They added fog for atmospere." B. total S. they are just covering up the fact that some 3D backgrounds have been replaced. None the less, there is still 10 days for sega to TRY to tweak. I doubt that 10 days is enough time for any dramatic change. If it wasn't 4 the fact that Tekken 4 looked sucky next to VF4 than I would say the home version of that is lookin better, but Namco developed it on a PS2 board so it would look identical. Oh well.......... : (
     
  6. Llanfair

    Llanfair Well-Known Member

    /me gets out violin

    Here we go again..wah wah wah wah....just *play* the damn game. If it plays the same, are you really going to care? :p
     
  7. feixaq

    feixaq Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    Some people would rather spend their time complaining about minor graphical discrepancies than working on their VF game. (Probably the same people who really don't have much of a VF game to speak of.)
     
  8. Rugal

    Rugal Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    What you call minor some people call dramatic.
    Do you suggest that people who point out the faults in the conversion are actually unskilled at the game?

    Only through attention to detail and study could you become a decent player at Vf4. With such levels of skill it would be absurd to think that you would't notice the shortfalls in the home conversion.
    And Vf4 is more than gameplay, it's the art, the style, the look and the feel of the game which makes it so good. Many of these factors have been compromised by the look of the PS2 conversion.
     
  9. ken

    ken Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    If you've played a game called Quake. A true 3D game you come to appriciate mechanics rather than aesthetics.

    I have a GeForce 3 and I can play 3D games at extremely high resolutions. But generally I turn off all the extra details and crap as its much more fun win lots in low detail rather than to win less in high detail.

    In this case if the physics and gameplay is identical then that is really the only thing that is important. You want to look good thru actually WINNING rather than worrying about looking good. IF the game is inaccurate or not arcade perfect (gameplay wise) why bother the graphical improvements etc etc

    Again thats my goal to improve my game and be the best VF4 player I can be thru lots of practice and battles.

    Its possible to Win well and to Lose well... either way its all good...my 2 cents!
     
  10. Cappo

    Cappo Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    Ya i see what u mean rugal, i hope the PS2 version really has the hit lights... like the blue red and yellow

    looks nice and also alot of meaning =)
    Keep in mind that ive never played VF4 /versus/images/icons/frown.gif
    seen the TBzone clips ive been playing Fighters MegaMix on Sega Saturn, and believe me it looks like sh^t lol

    but i am practicing my DLC and the G+P+K + B,D/F+P+K, d,f+p or d,b+p

    but it is very hard to do on a Dpad!! It should be much easier on a Joy =)
     
  11. feixaq

    feixaq Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    Do you suggest that people who point out the faults in the conversion are actually unskilled at the game?

    Yes, to an extent -- people who point out the graphical faults in the conversion to the exclusion of thinking/worrying about gameplay elements are typically unskilled. Most US game magazine editors love to point out aliasing issues, fewer polygons, etc. but know very little about the underlying gameplay, for example.

    Only through attention to detail and study could you become a decent player at Vf4. With such levels of skill it would be absurd to think that you would't notice the shortfalls in the home conversion.

    Attention to detail as in, "should I roll to the leading or trailing foot to avoid a ground stomp?" is important. But pray tell, how does attention to detail such as the lack of fishes on Pai's stage have any bearing on player skill??? I've been playing VF4 3-5 times a week since the beta in late July, and for the life of me I still have no idea whether it's a whale or dolphin or shark in the background; and I really don't care. /versus/images/icons/smile.gif

    And Vf4 is more than gameplay, it's the art, the style, the look and the feel of the game which makes it so good. Many of these factors have been compromised by the look of the PS2 conversion.

    How do you know the look has been compromised by the PS2 conversion? Just through 10 or 20 screenshots? I played the 80% beta last weekend, it still looks pretty damned good to me...

    Don't get me wrong. Graphics are important. Hell I moved to VF1 from SF2 because the 3D element was visually impressive, and the VF series has had great graphics all along (particularly in VF4). But I would hazard that people who are more concerned about graphics than gameplay *are* indeed unskilled. (And Ken brings up a good point in that most Quake/UT/Tribes clanners turn down most of the graphics options after the first month or so because they would rather sacrifice graphics in order to maintain high frame rates in a firefight.)
     
  12. Cappo

    Cappo Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    lol Fei, very nice post =)
    i'll basically use the PS2 version of VF4 to practice for Arcade matches, more competition.
    Like right now i dont have Tekken Tag or VF3
    I am practicing Fighters MegaMix, and Tekken 3
    So i wouldnt be dull in VF4 or Tekken 4.
     
  13. ken

    ken Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    On the low detail note..

    I've seen some crazy assed machine of a Quake player hack his models so effectively was shooting at rectangular blocks. Zero textures and graphical features. The human models in no way looked like human models, thats all the detail he needed to shoot insanely accurately. He didn't own a very fast computer so he had to make the most with what he had.

    He won the tourney.

    I'm worrying more about what joystick I'll be using to go with VF4 for PS2.

    The machine and game is the same, the only difference is the person playing it. That is the beauty of Arcade and console games. There is no bitching about what CPU, Video Card, Internet Connection, Ping, Scripts, Cheating, Hacks, Season (in Winter.the cold temperature causes your muscles to tense and a tendency for them the tremble. A fellow clan member brought a heater to keep his mouse-wielding arm warm during the National TF Quake championship.He wanted maximum dexterity which by wearing a heavy jacket would've effectively reduced. We won.) These are physical tangible aspects that we can buy or do.

    The only thing that matters is Knowledge, Experience, Tactics, Form/Health and Temperament. All the money in the world is not going to be able to buy this. But the right equipment, lots of research, practice and dedication most certainly will.

    Though personally I don't like losing so I worry a little bit more on what I'm doing and what the opponent is doing rather than wonder what is under the clouds in the Lei Fei Stage (I realised there are clouds one day when I ringed out myself and was feeling a bit lazy to hit Start button to skip the replay).

    So in the end...Just play!
     
  14. Rugal

    Rugal Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    Yes, to an extent -- people who point out the graphical faults in the conversion to the exclusion of thinking/worrying about gameplay elements are typically unskilled
    The fact that the game is being converted by the very people who created it would suggest that it would retail 100% of the arcade's gameplay.
    Websites are pointing out issues with the game because it actually has them.
    Vf4 is the most impressive display of visuals on any platform. The PS2 version is not. It's not even close.

    Attention to detail as in, "should I roll to the leading or trailing foot to avoid a ground stomp?" is important. But pray tell, how does attention to detail such as the lack of fishes on Pai's stage have any bearing on player skill???
    Who said they did? My point was that I find it absurd that a person can study a game so technically and not even notice a simple background feature like whether or not it's a whale...

    How do you know the look has been compromised by the PS2 conversion? Just through 10 or 20 screenshots? I played the 80% beta last weekend, it still looks pretty damned good to me...
    You admit to having no skills watsoever in regards to determining bacground features, so I won't take your opinion on VF4 PS2's visuals as anything worth noting.
    For the record the game runs at half the resolution of the arcade, has no mip mapping, crap textures, polygon model reduction, far less lighting, no proper reflection mapping, reduced environmental polygonal effects like warping snow, folding sand, cracking tiles and moving leaves, and 2D bitmap backgrounds. And that's simply what I've heard so far...

    But I would hazard that people who are more concerned about graphics than gameplay *are* indeed unskilled
    Who said that they are more concerned? Like I said, it would have to be a monumental stuff up for AM2 to mess up the mechanics of their own game. The only fault of the PS2 version is it's graphics. If anything, the perfect state of the gameplay as a conversion should make the woeful graphics all the more notable.
     
  15. Llanfair

    Llanfair Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    Rugal, Sega has never been able to get the gameplay conversions of any console VF game 100%. They've been close at times, but not good enough for some.

    Who said they did? My point was that I find it absurd that a person can study a game so technically and not even notice a simple background feature like whether or not it's a whale...

    But noticing the whale has no relevance to that individual's study of the game from a playing perspective. I can see how a deep and dedicated study of frame rates would lead to improved mastery of the game, but noticing whether or not Lau's button are made of 10 polygons or 1000 polygons won't make me a better player.

    For the record the game runs at half the resolution of the arcade, has no mip mapping, crap textures, polygon model reduction, far less lighting, no proper reflection mapping, reduced environmental polygonal effects like warping snow, folding sand, cracking tiles and moving leaves, and 2D bitmap backgrounds. And that's simply what I've heard so far...

    That is of course if the game is running at high res in the arcades. Of our 7 or 8 VF4 machines in Toronto, only 1 of them is running at high res. I would gander that over 80% of the machines in NA are running low res. The best gameplay and gathering of dedicated players in Toronto occurs around a versus city machine that is running the lower res. Personally, I prefer the lower res look myself - but that's my preference. I find the jaggedness of the characters in the high res arcade version a little crappy looking. But, its not a big deal and I'll happily play both without question. And btw, the PS2 pics online are at a much higher resolution than what I currently see when I'm out playing the game in the arcade.

    Who said that they are more concerned? Like I said, it would have to be a monumental stuff up for AM2 to mess up the mechanics of their own game. The only fault of the PS2 version is it's graphics. If anything, the perfect state of the gameplay as a conversion should make the woeful graphics all the more notable.

    Oh no, it wouldn't. They could stuff it up good. They have everytime before. The way I see it, I surely hope that AM2 has spent more money and time on ensuring the PS2 conversion *plays* perfect and then worries about the graphical state.

    Lastly, what does complaining about the quality of the pics do anyway? (I'm not jousting at you in particular, btw). That's almost as bad as bitching about moves that characters *should've* had in the game because it suits their form of martial art! Acch...it's shit like this that brings Versus City to being the late Blast City. You end up searching forever to find some decent gaming thread.

    cheers,
     
  16. Ellinas

    Ellinas Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    "You admit to having no skills watsoever in regards to determining bacground features, so I won't take your opinion on VF4 PS2's visuals as anything worth noting."

    It doesn't take special training to figure out if you think something looks good or not. You don't have to pick out background features and details, you just get a sense of it when you look at it. Wouldn't you value Feixaq's opinion more than that of a magazine editor? To them, VF4 PS2 is just 1 game in a big list.

    I would think that Feixaq made the comment about skill because he's annoyed with people already saying that the conversion is ugly despite not having seen it in action.

    No need to be disappointed already guys, people here are freaking out and it hasn't even been released.
     
  17. marcel

    marcel Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    All i was sayin is that sega could do much better, I hope.
     
  18. Rugal

    Rugal Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    But noticing the whale has no relevance to that individual's study of the game from a playing perspective. I can see how a deep and dedicated study of frame rates would lead to improved mastery of the game, but noticing whether or not Lau's button are made of 10 polygons or 1000 polygons won't make me a better player.

    Again, I didn't say noting the detail would make a better player, I said that I find it hard to believe that a person who spends so much time in front of an arcade cabinet doesn't notice the visual splendor that is Vf4.

    That is of course if the game is running at high res in the arcades. Of our 7 or 8 VF4 machines in Toronto, only 1 of them is running at high res. I would gander that over 80% of the machines in NA are running low res.
    No, the run at 640 by 480 sampled down to 640 by 240. The PS2 version is straight 640 by 240. Half the res of the arcade.
    Any "jaggedness" you've noticed on the arcade units is probably due to poor projection TVs or monitors. Seeing Vf4 run on a decent VGA monitor makes you want to shell out the dosh and buy the arcade. It's amazing.
    People also complain because they want an arcade perfect conversion - both visually and gameplay-wise.
    It will be interesting to see if the people who went on about the DC version of VF3 come out of the woodwork when VF4 is released. As it stands, Vf3 is a FAR better conversion than Vf4 PS2.

    the PS2 pics online are at a much higher resolution than what I currently see when I'm out playing the game in the arcade.
    The pics posted consist of 2 separate fields. That is the single frame image consists of 2 different images from the console's framebuffer. This is neccessary as the game is running in low resolution. You're comparison is way off.
     
  19. Jason Cha

    Jason Cha Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    Hey Chris,

    Forgot to mention - the hit lighting _is_ in the 80% version. Our gracious host discovered this after we had left. Unfortunately, he's not familar enough with arcade to compare it.

    As for the rest of those idiots who haven't even seen the ps2 version much less play it, I don't see why you bother responding to them.

    Anyway, tomorrow - we have to go to my sushi place. I went tonight and damn they have this sea bass with miso marinade.. I've had awesome chilean seabass at a number of places, but this was really good. (not the best I've ever had but man it made me happy.)

    -Jason
     
  20. ice-9

    ice-9 Well-Known Member

    Re: /me gets out violin

    Well, I don't know the specifics of all this resolution stuff, but I do know there have been two versions that I have seen: one that has scan lines, and another that did not. Those scan lines gives me a headache, and it's pretty obvious that it has less detail than when there are no scan lines. Akira's face is a perfect example. This leads me to believe that the version with the scan lines is lower rez.

    That said, I have to say that the version without scan lines is NOT as clean some people may think. Some edges are jagged, and some costumes have severe shimmering problems (Aoi's various VF.net outfits in particular). I don't think it's really a monitor issue, but I haven't seen VF4 on those Megalos or anything, just standard Versus and Astro City VF4 cabinets.
     

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