Llanfair, your statement "Come on, it's [PS2] a pretty powerful system - a lot more power than Naomi2 that's for sure." is INCREDIBLY wrong. it really is EXTREMELY wrong, not even slightly, and its insane to even try to discuss it at this point. you apparantly have a SUB-HUMAN level of understanding of ps2 vs n2 you should search around for articles on both, and read interviews of programmers who have used either. particularly ps2. theres a good technical article on arstechnica.com on ps2, ive forgotten where the ones for naomi2 are. there is a lot to it but just to be quick, off the top of my head ps2 has an incredibly low amount of ram 4mb, (and it is also shared framebuffer) and it doesnt even have hardware compression, so you can compress textures. even dc has double. naomi12 has 32 main mem 32mb graphic mem and 32mb just for geometry textures are very important, the textures make it look realistic, adding polys just makes it look rounder edges and theres diminishing returns. naomi2 would kick the ass of ps2 on polys anyway, its about 10 mill sustained. ps2 has probably done/will do when mgs2 and others come out around 3mill in an actual game. n2 also is based on pvr2 so it has defered rendering which is why shenmue can have those amazing scenes with lots of polys. on a ps2 if you have a building, ps2 has to render everything behind the wall. dc/n1/n2 doesnt. so you get the most 'value' out of it. imagine fighting in a real LARGE city or somesuch, n2 wont have to render past the buildings, so the city could be complex and there could be things behind the imediate building. n2 also has 2 cpus, its complicated. ps2 does have 2 vector units but its lame and you should read up on that, dont wanna explain it. noone has made that great use out of it and i dont think tis worth bothering. noone has been able to stream and flush new textures PER FRAME which is what would make ps2 worthwhile. the only reason mgs2 seems good is because they used an optimized palette and practically the whole game is in different shades of gray and black. vfx was orig designed for n2 and can you imagine the massive redesign it must go through. you should be able to peice together that it will be a lot its a big letdown to me that its on ps2 at all. its just a waste of time. id rather it on xbox or gc. not because i hate sony but just because i want it to be good. how many vf games will there ever be? what if suzuki retires? why waste one like this. it will be good, but it can be a lot better just being on another system i agree with everything else though, but i dont know why you and other people are so concerned because you think I and others are concerned. im not losing sleep over it, but i also dont mind saying what i think, even if its going to be bad news. i also dont understand why people take the time out of their lives to post to a board and say 'well... im going to wait and see... whatever happens happense' i dont want to get off on a rant here but THATS WHAT EVERY SENSIBLE PERSON ALREADY DOES, OFCOURSE. you dont deserve an medal for that and i dont see why would care that we know that you do it but some of us get board and feel like thinking about stuff. like having a little fun with our brain try to hypothesize/make predictions, think about what you think will happen. i could barge into any discussion involving the future and say that. WHO CARES THAT YOU WILL WAIT AND SEE. NOOONE I WILL BUY A DEAD BIRD, TELL IT TO WAIT AND SEE FOR THE NEW VF4, GLUE IT TO MY SHOULDER AND WALK AROUND, if you want to have a wait and see IRON MAN COMPETITION.