Virtua Fighter-Video game or Sport?

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Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.


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CIRCLE JERKING is now a sport? Yipppeee! I'm gonna petition the IOC and win me a gold cookie.

 

When I mentioned the "definition" of sport I wasn't refering to its dictionary definition, which is clearly not applicable to this argument or the argument of what constitutes a sport generally

LOL. "accepted meanings of words that defeat my argument are of no interest to me".

GE
<font color="green"> clap clap</font color>

 

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When I mentioned the "definition" of sport I wasn't refering to its dictionary definition, which is clearly not applicable to this argument or the argument of what constitutes a sport generally

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I'm sorry, but why is it not applicable? I think GE put this one nicely.

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Chess will officially be an olympic sport in 2004. Therefore athleticism or physical ability does not constitue a valid and only criteriea for a sport.

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Ok, now we're just making things up. Have a look at the IOC's official webpage. There's no mention of Chess being inducted as an event anywhere. Sorry. That's not going to do anything to help the debate on VF being a sport.

cheers,

 

...I'm replying to myself....yes, yes you could define VF as a sport because it is a Physical activity (as opposed to purely mental or emotional), it is fairish and is competitive.... Personally, though, a computer game suffers a distinct lack of being able to ....cheat....if you can't physically cheat then there's nothing 'sporting' about playing it and so it's not a sport...

 

I don't think using the dictionary definition of sport is useful in this argument because so many activities that are comonly refered to as sport clearly contradict its hard-edged definition. For example: shooting, fishing, golf and motor racing.

I'm trying to reason that VF can be classified as a competative sport in the same way as the above mentioned activities. Arguing as to whether or not it could be classified as an athletic sport (football, running) is pointless, as it most certainly isn't.

 

Well, you see, that's just it, isn't it? The hard-eged definition. Golf is athletic and anyone can look at Tiger to see that Golf finally was taken to a higher level by a dedicated athlete. Motor sports, I'm sorry, are not sports. Fishing is not a sport. I don't even think that shooting is a sport. Now, these are not games either. Their competitive activities but I don't think qualify as sports.

If we wanted to change the definition of a sport in order for us to accomodate VF, that's another story.

Imo, a sport must have an athletic component. The debate becomes very circular and pointless when we start to compare VF to other activities which are borderline sport/games. Race car driving, darts, etc, are debates in their own right. Compare VF to an undisputed sport. Compare it also to an undisputed game. Once you've set appropriate boundaries for the debate, i think the decision is pretty clear.

VF is not soccer. Nor hockey. Nor hurdles. Nor discus. Nor ultimate frisbee. VF is a much closer relative to Super Mario Land than it is to Cricket.

cheers,

 

>> Motor sports, I'm sorry, are not sports.

BLASPHEMER!

haven't you ever heard this: "There are only three true sports - bullfighting, mountain climbing and motor racing. The rest are merely games." - Ernest Hemingway

 

Well besides the words of ernest motor sports do take a good amount of physical endurance. Which would qualify it under the Websters definition you qouted as a sport.

 

lest you be a pedant out to trip people over in a silly word throwing match.

Heh, that is EXACTLY what this is, did you think there was some deeper meaning?

I'm sure the original poster didn't mean it that way, and he was probably just fishing for acknowledgment that VF is really serious and competitive. I don't know.
Anyway, whatever his intention, he asked "does VF qualify as a sport". The implied way to rewrite that is: "does VF fit the definition of a sport". If you'd rather say it means "Does a head to head fighting video game fit the popular, generally-accepted definition of sport, damn what the dictionary says." ... that's fine with me too, the answer is still no.

"clearly the dictionary definition doesn't apply"
....as if the dictionary definition is something to thumb your nose at?
Without an official standard to look at (for example the dictionary, or llan's idea of comparing VF to a universally accepted sport), this thread just becomes a poll -

A: "how many of you grew up with the impression that sport means something competitive and athletic?"
vs.
B. "how many of you have the feeling it means something athletic or competitive, but not necessarily both?"

By the way, I can respect someone with a different definition of the word "sports", but I think you need to work on your definition of "clearly".

I think this is your "veteran-headed" ego kicking-in, making you angry against others who would dare try and classify Virtua Fighter as a sport without your consent or approval (as a hardcore VF player of many many years....blah blah).

Pfft...You're accusing me of taking this disagreement in semantics personally, but you just insulted me twice in one post.

I think you're viewing the world through "vets-vs-newbies" tinted glasses. Get over that. Steam isn't pouring out of my ears because someone feels VF fits an ambiguous definition of sport. I argue semantics because it's a pastime and I'm a firm believer in effective communication. I DON'T do it because I've been playing VF for a long time or think I'm good at it, or because I want to crush newbies or enforce my worldview on the entire board. I'd argue this question cheerfully on a soul calibur board, even though I've never played a single game of SC. And before you can think to accuse me of it: I don't argue just to fall in line with other vets, nor do I automatically take the opposite position of someone new to the board. If you ask someone like mr. bungle, He will tell you I cheerfully argue semantics with longtime established board members as readily as I would with newcomers.

 

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I argue semantics because it's a pastime and I'm a firm believer in effective communication.

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Something we need more of. Especially when communication is limited to text on a message board.

cheers,

 

From a personal perspective, playing Virtua Fighter with others certainly feels more "sporting" than other games in its genre - which is why I think VF deserves special investigation when discussing this issue.

When playing SC or Tekken, most of the competative fun seems to involve luring your opponent into a position where a spectacular move can be executed, ending the bout in a shower of weapon swishing pyrotechnics. The core gameplay is so sluggish that little fun can be dirived from small exchanges of hits and tactical maneuvering.

VF, on the other hand, has always felt more dynamic, responsive and skillful. In VF the satisfaction of a win or loss is partly felt by both players. When KO'd or RO'd your instant reaction is to congratulate your opponent on his skill, because the core mechanic of VF has always felt very fair and solid. In Tekken, more often than not, loosing is a frustrating experience. Responce and feedback is much slower and the desire to blame the game is therefore greater.

 

Hey Maximum? Still visit HG gaming site. Was wondering if ED and company still play VF? What happened to his VF site?

 

....What I meant by "sporting" was not losing gracefully ...but cheating...fouling...bending the rules....lying etc.....you cannot do any of these things in VF or any video game because the computer controls the players, not merely arbitrates... some sports are harder to be sporting about, such as motor racing and golf, but there is at least some degree of the attitude of the players effecting the play outside of the normal constraints of the game...

 

while I would cheerfully rather see this thread die, I thought I'd mention it IS possible to cheat in VF in little ways.
Press shun di's start button so he can't drink after the round.
Use the kage freeze glitch in VF3 or the aoi rapid fire attack bug in VF4A.
Unplug the opponent's controls on the PS2, or secretly rotate his stick a few degrees off-center when he's out of the house
Choose akira (ha! juuust kidding)
Choose dural (?!)
Use a gameshark-enhanced character without his knowledge (i.e. fire up the PS2 while he's out of the room), with something subtle like 10% more damage for player 1 or 10% less for player 2.

It's stupid stuff, and there's really no way to get away with it, but it's in there.

 

Or don't tell them about the guard button... (For tekken players)
Or tell them the guard button works like the "free" button... (for doa players)
/versus/images/icons/laugh.gif

 

What about those pad players, damn them for not using a arcade stick for VF? Man isn't that considered cheating since it's so easy to excute techniques with a pad instead of a arcade stick?

P.S. Wasn't Japan and Korea cheating in the VF4 EVO tournament since the U.S. team wasn't able to use their prefer arcade sticks?

 

Oh man, of all pathetic excuses...

 

...I agree that this thread is stupid, but you don't have to post....really what you are talking about is sabotage before the game....I really meant stuff like having a human referee, who is by definition falable, rather than a perfect (?!....programmed, though....) CPU to arbitrate.....look this is just getting ridiculous now - VF is obviously not a sport, and I really don't think any computer game can be a sport, because it's just not taken seriously enough as one by enough people.....in fact, if we all tried to convince everyone that it was a sport, they'd say we were stupid and class it even less of a sport than it already is....

 

I personally would consider Non-Casual playing of VF and other "Games" to be sports, but arguing my points here would not help. Many of you are already too narrow in your perception of competition that it would be wasted text. Although, I would like to point out as with all sports without specific rules of conduct you can use mental games in VF to gain advantage over an equal or higher caliber player just as you do in Basketball, Football, etc. and so on. These are Trash Talking, Psyche Outs, Trap Techniques, Pretending to be lesser skilled than you are, Quiet Zone, and many more very effective ways to possibly mess with your opponents mind or focus and gain advantage. These same techniques win heavy weight boxing titles, world series trophies, and so on. Many of you guys/gals quit playing VF as a game when you started counting frames, learning combo set-ups, and striving to be the best. The competitive edge made it more than a simple pasttime.

 

Although, I would like to point out as with all sports without specific rules of conduct you can use mental games in VF to gain advantage

Poker players can use many of the same techniques. My problem with people wanting to elevate VF to a sport is that their instances of clarity can be found in pretty much any other activity. Remember that cup stacking thread? How about Glue Eating or Pole balancing. Considering how deep DOA'ers maintain their game is I wonder that they haven't had many of the same ideas.

This argument isn't new in the world, just relatively new for VF. I would suspect that any activity with a memership that is self-organizing, at some point, reflects on said activity and tries to bring it up in stature.

I always question why it can't just be what it is?

GE