vs Eileen

I don't know what the AI is like, but fighting a strong Eileen player can be a headache like no other... Here's some information on fighting Eileen I've translated from the Black Book...

Most characters have only 1/3rd page on information for fighting against them, but there is a whole page dedicated to dealing with Eileen's bullshit.

*****
She can sabaki everything. Her moves have evasive properties. She can punch faster than your character can. She has strings that never end. She has special situations where it is hard to counter attack her. This is the bitch that is Eileen!
*****

First ask yourself, “Why does she kick my ass so hard?†and we'll start from there...

Be Careful At Close Range!
First, watch out for her standing /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif (as if this wasn't obvious enough). In addition to being able to string it with /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif (mid attack which looks like a swipe), with one frame advantage she can use OM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif which is an especially powerful strategy. Don't even think about trying a low punch or an elbow because it will be avoided and you'll get hit from the side. If you didn't listen to my advice and tried a LP you are going to wind up getting hit with /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif again. In order to counter this try using a big attack like a knee or a delayed attack aimed to hit her out of the last frames of her offensive move.

What did I say about that low punch? Even if you block /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif you can't duck or LP because her /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif -will- stagger you. If you are a character who can sabaki high or mid punches why don't you try that?

If you wind up getting staggered, recovery quickly and try D-MTEG. Be careful though because if you get hit with Eilen's /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif while you whiff a throw escape or are staggered you are going to eat a lot of damage.

Eileen's Roundhouse Kick
The book claims that Eileen players might use her fully circular roundhouse kick against people who like to dodge. However, this kick leaves her vulnerable because it is high and if you duck it you can get a guaranteed back throw. If the Eileen player you are fighting against actually does something so reckless as throwing at this move which leaves her vulnerable to a guaranteed back throw then you need to capitalize!

Special Hint About Her /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif
If you dodge her /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif then she can't cancel into another move, so try using an OM to get to her side!

Eileen's Throws
Eileen's only weak point is her throws... they are awful... we are talking worse than Shun in Evo awful...
You want to escape: /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif and /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif in that order...

Dealing With Her Cancel Movements
What we've all been waiting for, how to deal with her never ending strings of monkey dung.
First, look at what moves your opponent is abusing to win matches and figure out what they are likely to do to you. There are many opponents who will /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif and then catch throw instead of /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif. It can be easy to freeze up and guard in this situation but if you attack you can get an easy knock down. Even if the opponent follows through with /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif, if it is a normal hit don't sweat it (she'd only be at +1)...

Also, OM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif can be effective against her strings. If she tries "zenkuuhon" (that move where she flips in the air) or a linear attack you can get a side crumple! With correct timing you can also avoid her fully circular /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/db.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif.

If you guard her /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif and correctly guess what way to dodge you can dodge and then do an OM to get to her side.

At any rate, if you get disoriented and freeze up you still have to be out thinking Eileen. Even if you are standing there guarding look at her movements and try to beat her to the next punch!

Dealing With Her Koushikouhan (Shoulder Ram, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif)
Whatever power they took out of Akira's shoulder ram from FT to VF5 they put into Eileen's!

After guarding things like a low punch and you are in short range, Eileen, Pai, Shun, Lion, Lei, Lau's low punches will hit her out of this. Also, Eileen, Kage, Lion's elbows will probably hit her too. She can only get big combos from this attack if you are in open stance. Good Eileen's will often aim for big combos with this move while in open stance... use the fact that you know its coming to turn the tables on your opponent!

Her shoulder ram has a short reach, and takes a while to come out. If you think she's going to try to shoulder ram you you should backdash and then hit her out of it. It takes a while to come out and is basically a move she uses while at disadvantage and there is a chance that it might avoid whatever move you use to counter attack with. She's a light character though so if you launch her you need to pound her with Eileen-only damage-high combos to win.

If you block the second shoulder ram then she is at -15. Get your guaranteed minor counter damage with an elbow or a move like Jacky's /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif or Blaze's /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif!

***
Picture of Sarah backdashing away from Eileen's shoulder ram (she is probably eat a dragon cannon for her troubles).

Caption: Her shoulder ram is a special move which can easily avoid other moves during execution, but it has short reach so counter attack with something that won't get eaten!
***

Guaranteed Counter Attacks
I had to translate this heading three times to make sure I got it right... it turns out if you block some of her moves you can actually get guaranteed damage on counter attacks! Let's remember the guaranteed counter attacks to Eileen's most frequently abused moves...

You can throw or punch her after you block the following:
-her backturned /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif (-12)
-her enkoushutsudou (/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif from cancel movement, -13)
-the second hit of her jump kick combo (-14, actually elbow counterable?).

You can counter the following moves with elbow and "upper class" attacks.
-/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif (-14)
-/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/uf.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif (-14)
-/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif (-14)
-/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif (her second shoulder ram, -15)
-backturned /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif (-14)
-flip jump kick (/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif while she is flipping in the air, -15)

Counter attacks might whiff if you block the following low fully circular attacks. If this happens you will be very, very angry.
-backturned /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif (-15)
-flip jump kick (/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif while she is flipping in the air)

After blocking her /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif from /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/db.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif counter attacks are likely to whiff so use a "middle class" attack (whatever that means)...

Counter these with knee class attacks:
-/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif
-/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif

She does have a high follow up to her /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif, but if you duck it then you can nail her for some easy guaranteed damage!

It can be easy to get stuck guarding her strings like /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif. Be sure to land the guaranteed counter attacks!
**************

That's all, I wish I had some pictures to go along with this... If I get my hands on some I'll add them in later...

-Alex

 

Thanks a lot for this. I'm having a hard time against her and I can use all the help I can get. She's friggin deadly.

 

Thanks for the tips.

Nice work on the guide btw.

 

nice post!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">After blocking her /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif from /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/db.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif counter attacks are likely to whiff so use a "middle class" attack (whatever that means)...</div></div>

I think this means use "Middle Kick" class attacks. Middle Kicks have nice range, and are 15 frames in most cases, so they'll easily hit this, which is -18 on guard.

I like the part about using OM /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif against her flip, I'd been using /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif -> combo, but I wanna try this.

 

Let me know how it works out... That might only get you a side crumple against one of her attacks from that stance but I'm not certain...

It's also highly possibly that I made a mistake or that there was a mistake in the Black Book... It can be pretty frustrating spending 10 minutes looking up the kanji for the name of a move only to realize that they printed the wrong kanji in the book...

-Alex

 

Nice work.

Looks like I can't irritate Summah with her as well anymore. >.<

 

Upon anticipation I was able to land bounce heel sword combos (/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif) with Jacky.

 

Be careful trying to DM or OM against Eileen's flip, as her /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif will track you, and most good Eileen players will see it coming and make sure you don't escape. Even Itazan had a hard time countering it with Aoi, Akira, and Shun, and never beat it. It's just unsafe to try. Chances are, if she's good, she'll have cancelled a /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif___ string into the flip, and your best option is to block. Remember what the SF3: Third strike players say- Blocking is top-tier.

 

haha JF_ I'm a 3s player too was my VF before I knew what VF was. I didn't reolize how top tier 3K was, I'll put it more into my gameplan. I also didn't know it tracked.

 

Read up on Eileen more and you'll probably find tons of useful info. I have to say that some of the most useful threads I've read, though, are ones on how to play AGAINST your character of choice. This helps you in avoiding bad habits and in learning how to play conservatively. Keep in mind that although 3/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is great, the normal /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is still the primary option, as a whiffed 3/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif could get you hit hard.

 

Catch throw?

I'm trying to use Vane's /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif whenever I see it (don't have it down at all /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif )

FUCK!

And Zenk /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif= not top tier, good, but no!

 

Yup. Still a good mixup/mind game option. As I said, the /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is still the primary choice, though it leaves you at a disadvantage on block. A great string I found that really tricks people is /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/db.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif. Try it out and see how it works for you. If a faster character can stuff it, let me know, since my friend just plays a cheap Pai.

 

I don't like using eileen's kick's all that much personaly, I like using /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif or /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif even /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif as mid options because they don't leave you on too much diss.

 

No need to stuff it, as anyone can block it (at least 50% of the time).

 

And don't forget you can add Zenk -> 2k to the mix if people stand and guard (in fear of 3k) but you're too far out for the catch throw to land. As it knocks down, it allows you to initiate the oki game of your choice too.

 

zenk throw I've taken out've my game almost. Not on purpose I just didn't see places to use it that were safe. After watching Gorgeous here made me rethink that http://youtube.com/watch?v=MY3rmqZ1RW8

 

You've gotta use the catch throw! It is (imo) the best option out of Zenk. Like 214K, you have to be careful about pushing the opponent out of range; however, after 6P+K or 3P, it lands with consistency. It is essential to use it because it initiates the Zenk mix up in the opponent's mind -- do I guard high? Do I guard low? Do I try to attack? If you don't use the catch throw, the opponent can essentially just hold guard and deal with most of your options (other than the relatively low dmg 2k).

 

is eileen on enough adv. after 6P+K or 3P to not be hit out of the flip before I come down?

 

I think it's time this got bumped up since we've gotten a lot of new people in and this is on the 2nd page now.

cheers

 

The safest way to not get hit out of the flip is by doing the K option. But even that I wouldn't guarantee its safety.