What puts people off from playing vf?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I do not understand this. For a fan of martial arts, Virtua Fighter gets as close as possible to true Martial Arts while still keeping the game playable.
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People who buy games aren't exactlly looking for the most accurate redition of how someone should look like. If you care so much for accuracy, might as well eliminate women. As for style, M. Bison never looked like a real life master, but do we care??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With the exception of the T5/T5DR and the GG music, the VF music is much better than music in other games. The problem with most fighting game reviewers is a sense of nostalgia they have for older fighters, and their famous tunes. The SF series is a good example of this, as the same themes can be heard throughout it's various versions. When we first heard the tunes, they were awesome. Now, we associate them with past games. Reviewers let nostalgic bias to get in the way.

Voices. Well. I do have to admit that the voices are a bit cheesy, but AM2 certainly made improvements over previous games. "I've done handcuff lightning" anyone? (Which is funny, as that is an incomplete quote from Cassius Clay).
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While I'm not a fan of the remixes of the original SF music, Nothing beats that initial 12 stage songs. The first thing that got to me when I poped in SFAC years later was that opening song/video and it all came back. Soul Calibur does as pretty good job for modern 3D fighters. Tekken usually does decent for at least some of it's stages. VF, wow, remember Pai's stage in VF4 and/or evo. in VF5, i actually like the tropical stage, the ruins, and Akira's stage song. The rest, is very fogettable.

Voice is better this time areound, but please change Lion and el Blaze. Lion sounds nothing like a frenchman, El Blaze sound even less like a Mexican.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"characters look plastic" </div></div>

I thought the game did a fairly good job. Especially when played on a Sony Bravia, 1080P HDTV. I have no problem with Vannea, Akira, Jacky shirtless. Jeff is decent, wolf has a bit too much shine, but Have anyone seen professional wrestlers on TV???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">no online </div></div>

If you know in the US, the biggest video game market in the world, gives 2 sh#* about arcade, You also know that the fighting game community is decreased and people now expect online, Why be so adamant about it not being in. This is actually more AM2 than anything because Explain why Virtua Tennis 3 has online for the 360(not made by AM2), and no online for the PS3 (made by AM2). Beat a dead horse, but might as well keep doing it, as it's clear that the community wants and craves it.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">no real "revolution" game-wise since vf4 </div></div>

It's hard to continuously inovate. I thought that for tekken to establish it's difference it shoudl have kept the tag. After all, VF was the technical game, Soul Calibur has weapons, nothing set Tekken apart. Come to think of it, Where are all the 3D Tag games????? In the end though and thus why i like Virtua fighter. I rather modification of each fighters moves in an effort to fully balance the game. throw in all new stages (not just reused one), and a better coat of paint and i'm fine with that. What pisses people off is Street fighter 2 and it's 6 or 7 clones being nearly the same game over and over again. So you have people buying it once, twice, 3 times and eventually a ton of people just drop fighting games in general since their champion and leader (street fighter, really isn't doing much so can we expect the same from it's clones).

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">not sufficient number of bonuses (fmv's, other modes like BOWLING... yes he really mentioned he'd like something like bowling. Said he doesn't care for costumes and items so...) </div></div>

I agree bowling is useless. Now, puzzle fighter is a pretty good ice breaker when you had a ton of battles. But ultimately, I don't care for that. BUT, and a BIG BUT. who doesn't like what SC3 did, with it's FMV endings, it's single player rivalries and storylines and so on. That we do care. What I don't like is beat the game and see credits. In this day and age, that is LAZYNESS. I'm not too big on costumes, but I do dabble a bit with it. Now ask me this, would I rather 2 costumes at a time, 4 total, and it can be tweaked. OR 4 costumes all can be accessed from match to match, I would rather the latter. Sega, WAS IT THAT HARD TO MAKE AVAILABLE 4 COSTUMES IN VS. MODE AVAILABLE WITHOUT GOING TO CUSTOMIZE AND SWITCHOUT 1 FOR ANOTHER????? Again, it's the combination of the little things that really pissed people off.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes. Quick gratification will win out every time. In our new society of ATMs, Cell Phones, Drive Thru's (for coffee no less), and Instant Access Media, if people are not satisfied in 10 to 15 seconds they move on to the next outlet. </div></div>

What do you think VF5 deserve. It's actually a touch question. In one sense, it's the best fighting game. In another sense, it's as bare as a baby's ass. It's 2007, we shouldn't have to deal with that. It's Blu-Ray, so we KNOW it isn't an excuse for lack of space. Here is a question, you've played 2D fighting games all your life. You got a PS3 and decide to give VF5 a try. explain how this new person is gonna learn the mechanics of Virtua Fighter. You shoudln't have to go ONLINE for answers. This person has 1 friend who plays VF, friend comes over to play only once every 2 weeks, now what??? Your quickly, and I mean QUICKLY left with a game you've beaten a few times, tried the quest mode and now no longer have any reason to play. You decide to go over his house for a change, oh wait, I had a 10 game winning streak against him and Vanessa is now really a black person again thanks to the tropical tan. Oh wait, I got to start from the beginning again with her. Man that sucks. So then I ask you, Virtua Fighter 5 averages an 87 on gamerankings.com. What did you expect reviewers to give it???

Now, just like people are bashing it sometimes, lets give it credit as well. Virtua Fighter 5 is much smoother than it's predecessors. One big knock against it was that it always felt stiff.

Virtua Fighter 5 is the new king of best looking fighting game. Everyone oogled at DOA3 for that very reason years ago, so give credit to VF for it's achievement. Especially if Tekken 6 ends up like the trailer.

Virtua Fighter for the most part is balance, Something that is VERY key to fighting games. There is no such thing as, oh you beat me because I had Dhalsim and you had Bison.

 

There's so much !?WTF?! in that post, I can only deal with the first and last . ..

Riiight . . . cause you could kick, say, kyra gracie's ass without breaking a sweat . . . sexism FTW!

You may think it is key, I may think it is key . . . but sales figures say otherwise. How many characters do you see in high level 3rd strike? How many copies did T4 sell? There's a reason people buy tier-based games. . .

Oh, and you're right, bison/dic clearly owns dhalsim for free:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOADkx0VC7Q

 

i agree with this ice9 point on the CURRENT lack of players overall.

"- VF veterans are getting older and thus don't come out to play as much, teach newbies as much, or write strategies/techniques/tactics as much. I think we need young blood who are determined to be the best, out to topple the vets (like Ladon and Denkai), and who will then in turn recruit and teach other young people to play."

my 2 cents...

 

Think character balance isn't an issue for the overwhelming majority of players, even enthusiasts that know about the principles of how to play because they're still not good enough to take advantage of the sorts of exploits that the very best players come with.

I never saw imbalance as a design phillosophy. If Sega didn't revise their game consistently you would probably end up with the same problems, just that, I guess they have an industry based around tournaments in Japan so they have to revise their data.

To balance a game before releasing it would be too complex to do by just the developers because the amount of mathematical situations that arise in a fighting game are enormous if not infinite, so the only real way is to put it out there and see what strategies the best players come up with.

 

The friends I've showed my ps3 to all want to see virtua fighter.

when they eventually end up playing it they all say they don't feel any impact of the moves and they all say the soundeffects are bad: the swooshing of the full circulair moves, when someone hits the floor on the akira stage(is that suppose to be wood creaking?), a lot of the same impact sounds for many different moves when they hit.

I try to explain simply that the sounds are a part of the interface, like the "fireworks" in tekken when you hit/block/ch someone, but for most people this is still too abstract and they just say that sega had to do it differently and add some cool sounds.

 

probably because vf isn't flashy enough. it's like a fighting sim (sort of). No fireballs, flying, weapons, finishing moves, insane speed, or special form's of power's. It's just straight up realistic moves that can be combined (except for a few air attacks).

you could consider vf being an average looking woman without her make up, while fighters such as tekken or street fighter is that same women with her make up.....It's the same woman, except she's given herself a boost in image to fool everyone into thinking she's better then average.

extra: in simpler terms..vf is bruce lee while the others are are jackie chan and tony ja. one will find the best way to kick your ass, the other two will try to put on a show while kicking your ass.

IMO

 

I guess that would make Counter Strike a hooker?

 

Sexism, it's hard to tell. But when was the last time we saw a female in UFC or Pride?. At the very top top level of fighting, I don't believe a female can fight against a male. Why, because unlike fighting games, females are NOT faster than males. And females are weaker than males. so you have a situation of being both weaker and slower, 2 very bad combinations. Plus, what do I have to do with this whole conversation. Who said I can be Kara Gracie or even the top female fighter. I only said that if you were going for only accuracy, and you held a tournament for THE VERY BEST fighters in the world, then you can pretty much eliminate females.

Sales is more than a fighting game being balance. There are a lot of things other fighters do better than virtua fighter. ie.. A reason to play the single player, if you bought VF5 and you didn't have a friend to play with, it wouldn't take long before you grew tired of VF5. once you beat the game 1 or 2 times, only to reveal absolutely NO incentive, it would grow stale. some games have better music, more characters and thus peole will mostly find someone that appeal to them. Some fighters to a common gamer will feel miles ahead of VF in smoothness of the engine. Some have online play and so on. REad my post and you'll see that I don't only talk about balance of a fighter.

I'm sure you can find a video about a man beating up a lion. at the very best level, I'm sure you can find a Dhalsim beating many/all the characters. That isn't the point. for the 99% of the population, Dhalsim sucks. Which lead to this other quote.

While that would be great, that is for the less than 1% of the pepole who buy fighters. Most people don't plan on going to Las Vegas, or Japan to play. They play against their family, friends, and friends' friend who thinks they are the shit against their local competition. You get a case of someone saying this guy is good, I want you to beat him for me, because he is talking too much. Often times, people will say this great Japanese player says this, or this great Japanese player did this and proof that your comment is wrong. Or even worse, why don't you put your money where your mouth is at and come to japan to play the very best. This kind of thinking is what frustrate me the most when discussions on virtua fighters comes up. Most people dont' give two shits about what Japanese players are doing, or saying and they aren't going to sacrifice their vacations to go to japan just to play video games. Most people only aim at beating their friends, family. In fact, most people who buy Virtua Fighter and won't even come to Virtua Fighter.com for discussion or look up info on strategy. We want to increase virtua Fighters' popularity not just for the 1% or less of the people who would be willing to go and defeat international people, but for those who would be willing to defeat the best in the state, the best in the county, the best in the town or school. we want to appeal to those that would only play against friends. It's when ALL segments of the buying group is satisfied are when the game reaches mass market appeal. For example, in Madden, there are national tournaments, state tournament, or even local Mall tournaments. people talk crap amoung friends never deciding to play in a tournament. If I'm recruiting a new madden player, it won't be geared towards one day you might face and defeat some guy in another country, it's to increase the amoung of people that i play against. So instead of having a steady group of 6 people who consistently play competitively, it would be good if I can now have 8 people who i can play cosistently and competitively against.

 

This is sooooo true. I for myself study and am dedicated to fighting games and i emphasise a lot on the pluriel of this cause i play a lot of them but besides me all my friends and all the people i barely know that play fighting games dont give crap about frame data, tech traps fighting systems advantage or disavantage on block. The only thing they care about is learning the moves and the basics and play against friends to have fun beating each other up. In fact in my neiborghood theres probably nobody that can beat me 1 game out of a thousand in lets say guilty gear cause i am of that 1% branch who loves fighting games to an abssessive point. VF is appealing to me because of that but to people who want to learn a bit and have fun Tekken and the like are without a doubt more appealing.
So VF gets bitch with good reason because of that. Its not appealing to the casual gamer its more of a hardcore freak fighting game. which is why people complain about it and they are usually right.

 

^this seems to be a promblem with fighters in general.


Fighters need human players...and well people dont want to put the time in to being good....they rather play hao and get instan gratification. Nothing is wrong with that...games are for fun. And it takes alot of time to get vf sytem...well not really.


I believe if was marketed to everybody instead of hardcore it would do better. By marketed better make it more flashy and with better commercials. But also include it with every thing needed to ge good at the game. A turorial mode like the one in vf4 evo is a good example. Also if the gam e got some online features like replay's and leader boards that would be great too.Also they should teach avdantage an disadvantage in asimple way...since it is the basis of vf...

 

I just wanna chip-in and say that:

--The majority of gamers who just LOOK at, let alone actually play, a fighting game are casual players looking for a fun game that can be played with friends.

--The casual player who will buy a fighting game, will generally buy one that looks good (graphics varying by art style, "flash" being a strong bonus), is easy or relatively easy to learn (aka friendly to "mashing"), is fun to play (ESPECIALLY with friends), and makes a player "feel like a badass" when doing well.

--The difference in popularity, IMO, between VF and "the popular kids" like Tekken, GG, SF, MK, etc is representative of differences in how the games are made . . . . those games have "flash", they are friendly to "mashing" (while REQUIRING genuine knowledge for high-level play), makes a player "feel like a badass" (even when owning his n00b friends with Feng Wei's 4-LP . . NONSTOP! lol), etc., etc. These are things that many casual players just don't get from VF.

 

Sure, tougher learning curve is part of it, lesser focus on story is part of it, lack of "flash" is part of it, questionable marketing (?) is a part of it, etc., etc., none of these are the definitive ONE REASON why VF is less popular. But all these things PUT TOGETHER make VF a game that is NATURALLY less attractive to the bulk of gamers looking for a fighting game.

It seriously takes significant time (and skill) built up in VF before a player can have real "fun" with VF! And new/casual players are turned away by that simple fact.


What I think would help VF grow is Sega making an effort to show the casuals what makes VF great. That means show them the elements of VF and what "high-level" VF play looks like! Perhaps, have demo booths running vids of various tourney matches, then show (dojo-style!) some or all of the elements put to use in the matches! With that, someone walking by would see a fight that OWNZ, followed by a visual explanation of WHY it owned!

 

Have the demo booths always connected online and the vids can be updated constantly and/or on a regular basis.







BTW: I apologize for the triple-post. I'm posting from PS3, which has a slightly annoying character-limit on POSTDATA (or whatever it is).

 

Sometimes its just nobody in your area to play. It was easier for me to pick up and drive to NYC for a weekend before having what amounts to 2 careers.

 

According to a lot of fighting gamers in my area it's the fact that VF players seem to boast about the games depth to an unreasonable degree. Thus putting off a lot of players thinking that the game requires much more work than they are willing to put forth. And they don't realize that games like Tekken require just as much work, but since Tekken players to spout off about Tekken's depth new players feel more welcomed.

 

Srider was right way back on page one.

Every step has to be deliberate. On top of that, the commands have to be entered precisely. It takes time and practice to learn the basics and most people want the instant gratification of winning a match without have to take time to learn anything.

P.S.

I have been gone for a while, what happened to the code for the command notation. Ahh yes it still works..../forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif

 

It's because the weather up here is so damn beautiful.


(At least here in WA).

 

Maybe its because of the story that the other games have. Tekken's story mode is what attracts people to it, with it CG endings and still frame beginnings, besides the combos and flashy graphics. Soul Caliber's story isn't as well put together as Tekken but atleast they have one. Virtua Fighter though is mainly about the game play, for anyone to know whats going on in the story they have to go read the little book. This is just something I picked up when I read the article on VF vs Tekken on 1up.com. Its no surprise to see who wins.

 

Western VF will die if it doesn't evolve and implement some of the tactics that the more successful fighters in the West use.
Wether it's more flash; explosions; bouncing boobs; a novice controller mode to make moves and combos easier to do (like some Capcom games); whatever. The kind of crap that you find in lesser fighters that draw in these huge crowds.

If VF doesn't apply some of these sleazy tactics to draw in more players and in turn make more money it will die in the West.
VF needs to adapt and overcome.
Times have changed and if VF doesn't change with the times it will get killed by the competition.
I love VF just the way it is but if they have to make some visual and audio changes to draw more people in and make more money, I'm willing to deal with that minor inconvinience just so that it does not die here in the West and so I dont have to go to Japan just to be able to play the next installments.
Gameplay-wise it has to still be VF though so it wont lose it's core audience.
If at all possible, VF could have two versions of it's next installment. The Japanese version and a Western version for the rest of the world.
Final Fantasy does it! Why not VF

 

..... I just realized something else that puts people off from playing VF...

It's threads like these. Can we start banning people for talking about irrelevant subjects?

If you are asking questions like these, you might as well stop playing.